Is there a doctor in the Team.....

[Benotti69]

Dim space has a good article here

http://www.cyclismas.com/2013/03/is-there-a-doctor-in-the-house/

So many doctors, so supicious, so dodgy, so much for change.

 

[JimmyFingers]

Damning and depressing reading really

 

[the sceptic]

Hadnt even heard of half the guys on that list. So Pantanis former doctor is now working with Sagan? thats not a good sign.

Step 1 to clean up cycling should be to ban teams from hiring doctors.

 

[JimmyFingers]

Team Sky have undoubtedly made a rod for their own back with their “clean team” policy by then hiring a doctor who we now know was behind much of Rabobank’s doping program during the last decade. But it demands that we all – journalists and fans alike – ask the question, “Why aren’t we asking a lot more questions of a lot more teams about a lot more people?”

A worthy statement: Sky maybe the current bete noir, but huge long threads about them won't change the fact if they are at it, they aren't alone

 

[maltiv]

I really don't get why they don't just ban every ****ing doctor who's been involved in anything. It's not like the doctor becomes unemployed afterwards or something, he can just...you know, continue being a doctor elsewhere!

It's hard to believe in anyone after reading this. I just can't see any reason whatsoever why someone would hire a doctor involved in drug scandals other than for doping products.

 

[hrotha]

Good article, but Dim needs to stop the whole "Oh yeah? Well look what the other teams are doing!" thing to deflect the Sky hate.

 

[Benotti69]

A worthy statement: Sky maybe the current bete noir, but huge long threads about them won't change the fact if they are at it, they aren't alone

Have you bothered to search all the threads in the clinic?

Most clinicians accept that most teams have some doping going on, whether it is an A team program or a select few riders.

Also most of the top riders have their own threads.

The length of the thread is generally down to the fanboys who protest cleanliness a tad too much.

 

[the sceptic]

A worthy statement: Sky maybe the current bete noir, but huge long threads about them won't change the fact if they are at it, they aren't alone

So if sky are doping, theyre not doing it alone. But since sky are clean, everyone else must be clean too.

 

[Fearless Greg Lemond]

Dimspace should at least be man enough to credit where he copy translated this from.

All copy past from this site:
http://www.dopingzaak.nl/blog/2012/04/11/emilio-magni/

 

[Benotti69]

BMC seem well stocked with dodgy docs. Add that to the BMC soigneur caught with lots dope, it makes it hard to think Evans won the TdF clean.

 

[sniper]

I found this one particularly interesting, as Greenedge directly and indirectly relate to many of the new age teams/riders out there.

Manuel Rodriguez Alonso – Orica GreenEDGE

Manuel Rodriguez has been around a bit: doctor for the Spanish Olympic committee from 1996 to 2004, and Team Doctor at ONCE, Mapei (with Testa and Ruffini), and Quick Step. He even did a three-year spell at Real Madrid as their professor of nutrition counseling and sports performance. Former pro Patrick Sinkewitz explicitly named Rodriguez as administering doping products at QuickStep.

Doesn't reflect well on the close collaboration (including the interchange of staff) between Garmin and Orica. Plus, he has almost the same profile as certain Garmin doctors.

 

[Roude Leiw]

Interesting read. What about the teams not mentioned in the article? Did anyone do any research on other teams, there are some obvious dodgy ones missing here (Rabo, Movistar, Cofidis,....)

 

[taiwan]

Once again, dimspace doing the investigative journalism that journalists don't. Remember the map of Armstrong's business connections? Chapeau.

Oh wait, copypasta? Ah well, interesting anyway

 

[Escarabajo]

Good article, but Dim needs to stop the whole "Oh yeah? Well look what the other teams are doing!" thing to deflect the Sky hate.

+1.

Impressive list of Doctors though. How do we believe in clean cycling with a list like this?
Is like all the teams rotate Doctors.

 

[Dazed and Confused]

+1.

Impressive list of Doctors though. How do we believe in clean cycling with a list like this?
Is like all the teams rotate Doctors.

yes, lots of rotation going on. You can include the needle users in this group. Most of the team owners knows about these characters, will hire them and then turn a blind eye. Results will follow.

 

[Fearless Greg Lemond]

Daniele Tarsi – Vini Fantini

A colourful character who has been around for a fair few years. He’s been team doctor at, amongst others, ZG, Refin, Casino, Saeco, Lampre, Phonak, Acqua Sapone, and Farnese Vini.

Back in 1998 Tarsi was involved in the Bologna doping scandal and stood trial along with Ferrari but was eventually acquitted in 2004. In 1998 while doctor at Casino, Rodolfo Massi took the polka dot jersey in the Tour before being arrested the next day for use and distribution of drugs. Other riders Tarsi “coached” included Hamilton, Camenzind, Bo Hamburger, Di Luca, and Piepoli. He was also the doctor in charge when Patrik Sinkewitz was busted in 2011 for HGH use while at Farnese Vini. Interestingly, Tarsi is secretary of the Italian Association of Cycling Doctors.

and now in Dutch:

Daniele Tarsi

13 mei 2012 by admin

Daniele Tarsi heeft een lange carrière in het wielrennen. Op zijn website is een uitgebreid overzicht te vinden, met een aantal opmerkelijke namen. Zo was hij ploegarts bij onder ander ZG, Refin, Casino, Seaco, Lampre, Phonak en Acqua & Sapone en nu Vini Farnese.

In 1998 was Tarsi betrokken in een omvangrijk schandaal rond een dopingnetwerk rond een apotheek uit Bologna. Tarsi stond in dezelfde rechtzaak als Michele Ferrari terecht, maar Tarsi werd uiteindelijk in 2004 vrijgesproken van distributie van dopingmiddelen.

In 1998 was hij de teamarts van Casino met onder andere Rodolfo Massi die in de bolletjestrui op indrukwekkende wijze de bergetappe naar Luchon won van renners zoals Ullrich en Pantani. Een dag later werd Massi door de Franse politie opgepakt voor gebruik en distributie van doping.

Bij Seaco werden onder andere Wegmann en Simoni gepakt op moment dat Tarsi daar ploegarts was. Bij Phonak liepen Hamilton en Camenzind tegen de lamp tijdens de Olympische spelen.

Andere bekende renners en (later) gepakte rennner die hij begeleid heeft zijn onder andere: Piepoli, Järmann, Hamburger, Dufaux, Di Luca, Mazzoleni, Frigo.

Vorig jaar werd Vini Farnese renner en doping-herintreder Patrick Sinkewitz opnieuw geschorst voor het positieve test op het gebruik van groeihormonen.

Tarsi is ook secretaris van de Italiaanse vereniging voor wielerartsen ofwel Associazione Italiana Medici del Ciclismo (A.I.Me.C), hierin zit een bonte verzameling van bekende wielerartsen, zoals Crosetti, Besnati en Andreazolli.

 

[Dazed and Confused]

Daniele Tarsi – Vini Fantini

A colourful character who has been around for a fair few years. He’s been team doctor at, amongst others, ZG, Refin, Casino, Saeco, Lampre, Phonak, Acqua Sapone, and Farnese Vini.

Back in 1998 Tarsi was involved in the Bologna doping scandal and stood trial along with Ferrari but was eventually acquitted in 2004. In 1998 while doctor at Casino, Rodolfo Massi took the polka dot jersey in the Tour before being arrested the next day for use and distribution of drugs. Other riders Tarsi

snipped...

Oops, not nice. In fact pretty bad.

 

[DirtyWorks]

Did anyone do any research on other teams, there are some obvious dodgy ones missing here (Rabo,

There's at least two threads about Rabobank. Look for the "revenge of Rasmussen" and "Geert Lienders" thread. Sky threads too maybe???

It's not that hard.

 

[mattghg]

Interesting read. What about the teams not mentioned in the article? Did anyone do any research on other teams, there are some obvious dodgy ones missing here (Rabo, Movistar, Cofidis,....)

You do rather get the impression that there's more digging to be done, don't you?

 

[sniper]

...

and now in Dutch:
...

Excellent find.
Full-throttle plagiarism. German-style.

Once again, dimspace doing the investigative journalism that journalists don't. Remember the map of Armstrong's business connections? Chapeau.

Oh wait, copypasta? Ah well, interesting anyway

 

[skippy]

Read the Cyclismas article then moved to the cyclingnews article , both eye openers !
When i comment on Cyclingnews with this :

skippyLess than a minute ago
Your comment is awaiting moderation
It only takes one person to have their nose put out of joint , before the thumb is pulled out of the **** ! flandis dumped USPS , Dekker has done for Rabobank !
Which team is next ?

You can see i am suspect , yet lysysloik & mike73nz can have a joust for hours without interuption !

Wonder who their moderator can be? Wouldn't be discrimination involved, surely , not on the premier cyclingnews reporting medium of the internet ?

Guess i had better stick to my blog , when i wish to get a valid point across ! At least there i can avoid all the petty point scoring .

 

[coinneach]

I agree its a good and depressing article.

Can I try to lift the mood by making a couple of points?

# Quite a lot of the people in the article have actually been cleared when their cases have come up.....doesn't mean they are not suspicious, but I'm uneasy about a different standard of proof than we would want for ourselves

# There was an interesting article in the Guardian a few weeks back:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2013/feb/15/drug-cheat-dilemma?INTCMP=SRCH

Describes sports doctors as "Servants, contractors who do what we are told rather than what we should"

I hope the recent example of journalists asking cyclists what exactly a doctor has done for them can be spread. This whole area needs much more public exposure. By publishing details of drugs proscribed and TUE given, we can start to open this area up. Cyclists might not like their medical details made known, but I think I'd rather that was out in the open than having half the folk think I was some cheating junkie.

 

[Dazed and Confused]

snipped...


Cyclists might not like their medical details made known, but I think I'd rather that was out in the open than having half the folk think I was some cheating junkie.

Only dopers have problems getting the details aired. Clean riders will be happy to provide information.

 

[ElChingon]

Oh wait, copypasta? Ah well, interesting anyway

Surprised it didn't make the CN headlines of copied stories.

 

[Roude Leiw]

There's at least two threads about Rabobank. Look for the "revenge of Rasmussen" and "Geert Lienders" thread. Sky threads too maybe???

It's not that hard.

I am pretty aware of Rabo discussions and you have to be blind to miss the sky threads here, so my examples were perhaps not well chosen. So how about this, anything similar to this article out there for the likes of Europcar (i know that there is a thread or 2 around voeckler et al), fdj, etc.
I am looking for someone knowledgeable who looked into soigneur / medical staff with dodgy links.

No need to be patronising