Keisse doping case dismissed

[skidmark]

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/keisse-doping-charges-dismissed

While this isn't necessarily huge news, I thought it was interesting to follow this case since last year, as it truly appears he just mistakenly took a drug that had banned substances in it. What is interesting to me was his reaction, which was pretty much 'I'm screwed now - I just made a stupid mistake and now I'm going to be suspended'. Kind of refreshing when compared with the 'I just came out of my oxygen tent'/'the lab was corrupt'/whatever the hell Schumacher is going to say next defence. Or worse yet, the 'I just took it once'/'it was only intended doping' half-apology, or the most common, silence and an utter lack of remorse.

With little to go on as fans without incredible medical knowledge or inside knowledge of the peloton, I find that I'm often forced to make up my mind based on what the riders say about doping. Keisse's reaction just seemed to have a ring of truth to it, and it seems this is in fact the case. I'm wondering if anyone else draws conclusions about riders based on similar things, with little else to go on?

 

[BASIL USA]

Class

My name is Basil. I raced with Iljo in the amateur sixdays of Berlin and Copenhaugen. I stayed in his dad's house in Gent for a month.

Iljo is a class act. He was younger than me, but I looked up to him. He raced fair. Each night I was proud to line up with him. After the race I had dinner with a great friend. We talked about where we saw our futures in the sport. I always knew he would become the racer he is today.

I respect how he handled his doping case. I knew from the first moment I herd the news that there had been a mistake. He didn't take a banned substance! He took a substance that converted to a substance that is used as a masking agent.

It's strange the power that is held over the racers. Many cheat - some are caught - some proclaim innocence... Is it fair? Sport is our best chance as a society to be fair and balanced. Some riders have won the big races and confess to doping at the end of their career. Some in the middle of their career. Who are the companies that make the drugs and leak them to doctors? Who profits the most from doping? Epo with a marker? Who came up with that idea? Why do you need a clinical trial with rats when young and fit athletes will take an excess of the drug till they die, give themselves cancer...

Big up to Iljo for filling out the form with the cold medicine he took, his honesty and his pride (I hope it is restored). Big down to his partner Robert Bartko for throwing him under the bus. Shame on the system for proclaiming him guilty before they looked at the evidence. Shame on the media for making doping bigger news than winning. Shame on his team for firing him. The biggest shame on goes out to the drug companies and doctors.

Although he was found innocent: the system has wronged him. He will carry the burden. I'm sure he lost money and these last 11 months must have been terrible. Ill always be a fan because I know him better than some. I hope you all have seen the person he is on and off the bike. I hope you all are now bigger fans of him.

ALL CLASS!!!

 

[luckyboy]

If the cold medicine had a banned substance in it, surely he would've got a TUE and the case would never had got this far?

The biggest shame on goes out to the drug companies...

I don't think they're making these drugs for athletes to use

 

[Mongol_Waaijer]

Danilo Hondo had his career ruined for something similar to this....

 

[BASIL USA]

I don't think they're making these drugs for athletes to use [/QUOTE]

Really? 4 Dutch cyclists died of overdoses of epo four years before the drug started it's first clinical trials in humans. They had taken so much their blood was thick as yogurt. At night there heart slowed and couldn't pump the thickness. How do you get a drug if it's not yet released?

Have you herd of a street drug called Methamphetamine? You can't produce the drug without ephedrine or sudoephedrine. Those two building blocks are manafactured by 9 companies world wide. Only recently have any regulations been placed on these companies. In the 90's Mexican cartel were ordering ephedrine direct from the manufacturer by the ton. Do you know any tweekers? Have you seen the effects of this drug on our society? Is business worth it? How much less do you think these drug companies would make if we measured and regulated the product and distribution? Do you feel bad for them?

The companies might not be producing the drugs with the intention of poor use, but they profit from it. Not all drug companies have your health as their highest priority. Someone is leaking the drugs or their building blocks. Do you think that people want to take years off their lives? Do you think that athletes are excited about doping? Like when their 12 they dream of taking more drugs than anyone else? No! They dream of working hard and winning.

The reason I commented in the first place not to debate these points with you. Only to say: I knew this sweet kid from Belgium. I knew his family. I know he's not a cheat, a doper, a dishonest person... This has effected him in a bad way. It's not fair. It's not right. I think he dealt with it quite well and honest. Congratulations to him!

Who's to blame? The athletes? The doctors? The testers? The pharmacological companies? The press? Really two questions need to be asked: Who does this hurt? Who profits?

 

[Martinello]

I don't think they're making these drugs for athletes to use

Really? 4 Dutch cyclists died of overdoses of epo four years before the drug started it's first clinical trials in humans. They had taken so much their blood was thick as yogurt. At night there heart slowed and couldn't pump the thickness. How do you get a drug if it's not yet released?

/snip/

The first phase II trials on epo in humans were published in 1987 (Eschbach et al), and several multicenter trials were published in 1988.
To the best of my knowledge the semi-pros didn't start waking up dead due to massive embolisms until 1992-ish.

I've never really bought the conspirational theory stating that a substantial part of the epo-production goes to doping with the blessing of the pharmaceutical industry.

How much epo excactly can say 2000 microdosing cyclists, 500 cross country skiiers, some swimmers, a couple of thousand track and field athletes and the rest of the pro- and semipro sporting community use?
My guess is that the end-stage-kidney failure patients world wide with their life long high-dose consumption are far better customers at Amgen.

 

[Cloxxki]

I know a guy who tipped another guy to be the first-ever pharmacy student to graduate on a thesis regarding EPO in sports, early 80's it must have been.

To information (heresay, if you will) I received, EPO was being used as early as by Calgary '88 gold winners (look them up, who is suspicient?). Winter sports featured some odd "talents" claiming sudden Olympic golds, after mediocre amateur level careers, which effectively ended when EPO testing started to take form, by mediocre results.

 

[blackcat]

Danilo Hondo had his career ruined for something similar to this....

at about that time, it was my opinion that DH was better than Hushovd too.

 

[Aapjes]

How much epo exactly can say 2000 microdosing cyclists, 500 cross country skiiers, some swimmers, a couple of thousand track and field athletes and the rest of the pro- and semipro sporting community use?
My guess is that the end-stage-kidney failure patients world wide with their life long high-dose consumption are far better customers at Amgen.

They weren't microdosing in the 90's. Given the high prices, it would be some very nice extra income. Primarily for the local reseller who supplies the dopers, but also for the pharmaceutical companies. It's easily earned too, you don't need to send pharma babes to the riders.

 

[blackcat]

I add it up like Martinello too.

I just do not see the market that large.

5 thousand riders tops, who are on EPO. Absolute tops. That includes the Masters, the jnrs, the pros and the cat 2 and cat 3 try-hards in SoCal.

A thousand odd triathletes.

A thousand odd swimmers.

More runners tho, but I dont think as many as cyclists.

There cannot be such a big catchment of Nordic skiiers who are willing to take it.

Then there is the track and field, not the distance runners. 1000 tops, most will go to strength and power hormones.

Then you have the soccer players, potential big market. But outside the pros, especially Italy, Spain, Portugal, there cannot be the weight of numbers.

Now you have all the epo-bio similars. Plus you have the counterfeit but biologically effective stuff from China and Russia in the labs not acting to the international patent law.

Where is the market? I just cannot see the market this big.

 

[blackcat]

NB. those were my upper estimates. I know their are jnrs doping, I know there are masters doping. But the ones that dope would be in the slim minority. Miniscule numbers. And not everyone is doping in the pro field. To assume the market is this big, you must come from the BigBoat school of conspiracy that EVERYONE dopes. No way. There are 450 Protour riders. Plus another 400 in Europe. 200 who make a living in US. 1000 top espoirs. 500 top jnrs. Are they all on Amgen manufactured epo? No way. Perhaps 1% of them get some black market epo that was from an Amgen facility. Lots are doping on epo bio-similars and autologous blood I appreciate it. And the percentage none higher than the Protour.

 

[HoustonHammer]

I add it up like Martinello too.
<snip>
Where is the market? I just cannot see the market this big.

I don't know what the rest of the EPO market looks like, so it's hard to say. But I don't think that's the point. Unless I missed it, I didn't think anybody was saying that the pharma companies see elite athletes as an end market. The suggestion seems to be that they can be a useful source of guinea pigs during the drug development phase. That's an appealing argument, but I don't buy it.

I'm also very skeptical of conspiracy theories. BASIL asked how athletes got the drug before it was released. That's a good question, but are sure they did have it prior to release? In the US, Epogen/Procrit was first approved by the FDA for sale in 1989.

 

[HoustonHammer]

I'm also very skeptical of conspiracy theories.

Notwithstanding my preceding logic-based post, here's a couple of points for the committed conspiracy-theory nuts to discuss amongst themselves:
- Is is just coincidence that Amgen decided to market EPO under the trade name "ProCrit". Hmmm?
- Check out this link: Access to the site is split for 'Patients' and 'Professionals'. Talk about cheek- they don't even try to hide it!!

 

[MiXels]

Access to the site is split for 'Patients' and 'Professionals'. Talk about cheek- they don't even try to hide it!!

Health Care Professionals.

 

[HoustonHammer]

Health Care Professionals.

That link was for conspiracy nuts.
Here's one for you.

 

[MiXels]

That link was for conspiracy nuts.
Here's one for you.

I assumed as much. Of course, irony and sarcasm are often lost in translation on the internet.

 

[HoustonHammer]

I assumed as much. Of course, irony and sarcasm are often lost in translation on the internet.

Fair enough. I could have set it up better

 

[Martinello]

I'm also very skeptical of conspiracy theories. BASIL asked how athletes got the drug before it was released. That's a good question, but are sure they did have it prior to release? In the US, Epogen/Procrit was first approved by the FDA for sale in 1989.

No pharmaceutical company would use professional athletes as illegitimate guinea pigs for their new drugs. There is an entire continent called Africa full of human specimens where they don't give a damn about GxP, ethics committees or clinicaltrials.org.
HBOC (haemoglobin based oxygen carriers) have been tested extensively in poor Africans with sickle cell anaemia and thallessemia. Why bother with a couple of crazy cyclists when you can get good quality, controlled data???

 

[HoustonHammer]

No pharmaceutical company would use professional athletes as illegitimate guinea pigs for their new drugs. There is an entire continent called Africa full of human specimens where they don't give a damn about GxP, ethics committees or clinicaltrials.org.
HBOC (haemoglobin based oxygen carriers) have been tested extensively in poor Africans with sickle cell anaemia and thallessemia. Why bother with a couple of crazy cyclists when you can get good quality, controlled data???

Exactly. Why have a small inconsequential conspiracy theory when you can have a massive, gonzo, insane conspiracy theory? I mean, bigger is better, right?

 

[DAOTEC]

UCI playing with fire

The UCI is burning the teams cash and getting close to Anarchie towards (Inter) national laws. Wada is just an illegal regulating body, nothing more.

Iljo Keisse will ask a Belgian court to fine the International Cycling Union 100,000 Euros for preventing him from riding in the Manchester Revolution track event this past weekend.

Maeschalck said he didn't know what the UCI was up to. “But I know I find it inconceivable that this game be played with the head of an athlete who already has been through a lot. Honestly, I think this is beneath contempt. "

[http://cyclingnews.com]

 

[sheenyp]

Epogen

A quick search showed Sales of Epogen in 2006-2008 were (in millions):

2006 $2511
2007 $2489
2008 $2456

10,000 athletes using $10k worth each a year you would be a tidy % of that amount. But maybe the numbers arent that high and they probaably dont all use Epogen anyway!

 

[BotanyBay]

Have you herd of a street drug called Methamphetamine? You can't produce the drug without ephedrine or sudoephedrine. Those two building blocks are manafactured by 9 companies world wide. Only recently have any regulations been placed on these companies. In the 90's Mexican cartel were ordering ephedrine direct from the manufacturer by the ton. Do you know any tweekers? Have you seen the effects of this drug on our society? Is business worth it? How much less do you think these drug companies would make if we measured and regulated the product and distribution? Do you feel bad for them?

They've certainly clamped-down on pseudoephedrine sales now. I have to go through a process similar to purchasing ammonium nitrate fertilizer (or dynamite) in order to get it.

 

[BotanyBay]

A quick search showed Sales of Epogen in 2006-2008 were (in millions):

2006 $2511
2007 $2489
2008 $2456

10,000 athletes using $10k worth each a year you would be a tidy % of that amount. But maybe the numbers arent that high and they probaably dont all use Epogen anyway!

A large percentage of kidney/dialysis patients take EPO. It's not hard to find, and it's just as easy for a pusher to "skim off the top" for EPO supply as it is for a 16 year old to steal his Dad's Oxycontin out of the medicine cabinet.

 

[sashimono]

...Keisse's reaction just seemed to have a ring of truth to it...

I thought the same thing about Landis at first. Remember how confused and flustered he was with the bizarre theories about his positive? That had the ring of truth to me because I figured any real doper would expect to be caught at some point, and would have very cool and concise statements prepared. I was obviously wrong.

 

[Master50]

I
Have you herd of a street drug called Methamphetamine? You can't produce the drug without ephedrine or sudoephedrine. Those two building blocks are manafactured by 9 companies world wide. Only recently have any regulations been placed on these companies. In the 90's Mexican cartel were ordering ephedrine direct from the manufacturer by the ton. Do you know any tweekers? Have you seen the effects of this drug on our society? Is business worth it? How much less do you think these drug companies would make if we measured and regulated the product and distribution? Do you feel bad for them?

Basil I don't know how old you are but in the 60s and 70s the meth addicts were our parents and the pushers were guys with the letters MD after their names. There were more housewives addicted to speed in the US than all the street addicts in the world today. Problem with street addicts is their visibility. The actual impact on the greater society is debatable but in my mind a lot of addicted moms is a greater societal burden and probably a bigger impact than what we see in skid row.
My Mom was addicted to prescription drugs for 20 years at least. A habit she managed to hide from me most of my life. The fact that she held a job and paid her bills is about the only difference between her and street addicts. Take the crime and poverty of the street equation and I think a lot more of those people would instantly be less visible and trouble too.