Miami doping ring implicates MLB stars

[zlev11]

http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/story/_/id/8893139/report-alex-rodriguez-others-miami-clinic-ped-lists

surely rodriguez should be banned for life now? this is the 2nd or 3rd time he's been caught doping.

but cycling is the only truly dirty sport...

 

[Catwhoorg]

MLB doesn't subscribe to WADA, it takes a whole lot to get a life ban.

No random testing in season.
Takes 3 positive tests for steroids, and upto 5 for other substances for a 'at discretion' which is the level at which a lifetime ban becomes an option.


MLB (and especially the Minor leagues tiers) is a joke for doping.
As bad as cycling ever was.

 

[Turner29]

I just saw this. I also agree that Baseball's drug-testing program is at best for public relations purposes only.

The New York Yankee's are Baseball's version of US Postal. In some ways, even more worse in that the Yankee's look the other way regarding doping, then when a player is caught, they seek to void his contract.

For years, Cycling was a red herring for those sports Americans really care about: Baseball, Football, Basketball, Hockey, Tennis and Golf. American journalist would jump on Cycling, yet turn a blind eye to these sports. However, this does not seem to case anymore, at least on an individual basis.

Let's see if any journalists have the guts to question an entire team or sport.

 

[Catwhoorg]

And of course A Rod


has never tested positive....

*chortle*

He did admit to using steroids in 2001-2003(IIRC), before they were against the substance abuse policy.

 

[spalco]

http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/story/_/id/8893139/report-alex-rodriguez-others-miami-clinic-ped-lists

surely rodriguez should be banned for life now? this is the 2nd or 3rd time he's been caught doping.

but cycling is the only truly dirty sport...

****ing hell at the old white guy in the next video on that site.

"Hold on, why aren't you happy Rodriguez used HGH? They weren't testing for it last year".

"If the sport isn't testing for it, can you condemn him for reaching for it?"

"Can you blame him? I can't blame him."

 

[zlev11]

yeah that's Skip Bayless, probably the worst person on ESPN, and that's saying a lot.

 

[DirtyWorks]

For years, Cycling was a red herring for those sports Americans really care about: Baseball, Football, Basketball, Hockey, Tennis and Golf. American journalist would jump on Cycling, yet turn a blind eye to these sports. However, this does not seem to case anymore, at least on an individual basis.

I generally disagree. Cycling has been a minor sport that gets any attention for the TdF and then the Olympics. The problem, from the IOC's perspective, is Hein can't keep the doping controversy out of the media.

Track and Field had a medal winner defend a WADA-banned athlete manager in the 2012 post-medal-round interview as her close family friend. Meanwhile, the banned from all events dope distributor was IN NIKE'S SUITE AT THE STADIUM while the show was on. That is the gold standard for doping controversy management and Hein can't seem to do it.

Where was the media? Dropping that part of the athlete interview.

Let's see if any journalists have the guts to question an entire team or sport.

Then the sport/team pulls the media outlet's access. That is much worse than just one writer being blocked like a Kimmage. That's the game. Kimmage lost it early with Wonderboy while scumbags like Wilcockson just resold the myth. Wilcockson did just fine selling cheating, intimidation and all the rest. Wilcockson's got plenty of work.

 

[fuzzydunlop3]

as much as the media piles on cycling for being a dirty sport, I'd actually argue that amongst professional sports right now that is one of the "cleaner" professional sports. Am I wrong?

 

[spalco]

as much as the media piles on cycling for being a dirty sport, I'd actually argue that amongst professional sports right now that is one of the "cleaner" professional sports. Am I wrong?

We can't possibly know the answer to this question imo.

 

[DirtyWorks]

as much as the media piles on cycling for being a dirty sport, I'd actually argue that amongst professional sports right now that is one of the "cleaner" professional sports. Am I wrong?

Well, I wouldn't say wrong. It depends on how you define dirty.

If you define dirty as is the UCI trying to pass competitive road cycling as a legitimate game? Then absolutely it's dirty. Far, far worse than most American sports where there's some confidence there's a game.

If you define dirty as which professional sport is the most doped? No winners there for a number of reasons. I'd call it about equal.

People like it that way though. If they didn't some aspects of doping would/should be a criminal offense.

The IOC/NCAA disguised as the BCS/MLB/NBA/NFL likes doping and they have made sure that they've carved it out of most criminal law. They *hate* doping controversy. big difference.

 

[fuzzydunlop3]

but it seems to me that at least the cycling problems in terms of not just the doping of the riders, but how corrupt and complicit the governing bodies have been are now completely out in the open. there seems to be a genuine interest by many to actually want to fix this problem.

can't say the same for NFL, NBA, MLB, Soccer, tennis, even though all are just as dirty. the general public still has their head in the sand with regard to these sports. I respect that the cycling journalists are at least making an attempt at taking on the problems in the sport.

 

[zlev11]

there's no way to say if cycling is any cleaner than any other sport, but certainly there's more talk about a solution to the PED problem than say, the NBA, NFL, or even MLB. some of the players in the NBA and NFL are so obviously doped it's ridiculous.

without a doubt in my mind there are team run doping programs in the NFL. there's too much money involved for there not to be. the problem is that the media doesn't care enough to expose it and since NFL drug testing is a complete joke, nobody ever tests positive either. people wonder why concussion rates are way up, well it doesn't take rocket science to figure out it's because everyone playing the game is doped to the gills and ten times bigger than normal human beings.

the hypocrisy in the media is disgusting. glorifying a player like Ray Lewis (probably doped) who more than likely was guilty of murder while in the same breath (rightly so) calling Lance a fraud and cycling a horrible dirty wasteland. the fact is that all of these athletes are frauds. and most of them are sociopaths just like Lance himself.

 

[fuzzydunlop3]

there's no way to say if cycling is any cleaner than any other sport, but certainly there's more talk about a solution to the PED problem than say, the NBA, NFL, or even MLB. some of the players in the NBA and NFL are so obviously doped it's ridiculous.

without a doubt in my mind there are team run doping programs in the NFL. there's too much money involved for there not to be. the problem is that the media doesn't care enough to expose it and since NFL drug testing is a complete joke, nobody ever tests positive either. people wonder why concussion rates are way up, well it doesn't take rocket science to figure out it's because everyone playing the game is doped to the gills and ten times bigger than normal human beings.

the hypocrisy in the media is disgusting. glorifying a player like Ray Lewis (probably doped) who more than likely was guilty of murder while in the same breath (rightly so) calling Lance a fraud and cycling a horrible dirty wasteland. the fact is that all of these athletes are frauds. and most of them are sociopaths just like Lance himself.

funny you mention Ray Lewis. this came out today:
http://www.philly.com/philly/blogs/trending/Ray-Lewis-SWATS-doping-Sports-Illustrated-banned-substance.html

 

[TheBean]

The logic behind all of this is simple.

If you take a group of people who have a strong competitive drive, add the fact that there is the possibility of making tens of millions of dollars in a year based on athletic performance by breaking a rule, then decrease the chance that an athlete will get caught cheating either by providing masking agents or performing sub-standard or biased testing, then there will almost certainly be people who cheat.

The risks of cheating via doping are insignificant when compared to the possible rewards.

Any time the balance of risk vs. reward is skewed favorably towards the reward, there will be plenty of people willing to take the small risk of being caught.

I have come to the conclusion that watching sports (which I truly enjoy doing) is more akin to watching a magician's act than anything else. When watching a magician, I know that he hasn't actually sawed his lovely assistant in half, but it is still a good show.

I suppose this is just my way of being able to continue to enjoy the spectacle of it all.

On another note...

The previous poster who said Skip Bayless is a j@ck@ss will get no argument from me. That guy is probably the worst sports commentator - editorialist I have ever listened to or read.

 

[biokemguy]

And his coach trots out the "never tested positive" line.
What a joke.

 

[DirtyWorks]

but it seems to me that at least the cycling problems in terms of not just the doping of the riders, but how corrupt and complicit the governing bodies have been are now completely out in the open.

Only because of the Clinic 12 and a few peripheral websites. Most of the major cycling media outlets understand the political game. Don't blow up the sport publishing doping stories and the ASO will send you TdF press passes.

there seems to be a genuine interest by many to actually want to fix this problem.

It seems like it. But, not really. Cycling has been here before and always manages to "move on" to have "the cleanest peloton ever."

can't say the same for NFL, NBA, MLB, Soccer, tennis, even though all are just as dirty. the general public still has their head in the sand with regard to these sports.

Lots and lots more viewers for those sports and the viewers embrace the doping. I heard a claim 21 million Americans watched the NFL-funded vacation called the Pro Bowl. The NFL would pull media credentials in a heartbeat if a media property started covering doping. The fans wouldn't like it either.

I respect that the cycling journalists are at least making an attempt at taking on the problems in the sport.

You'll notice, the media outlets that are breaking the stories are NOT cycling-specific. Wall St. Journal, Sports Illustrated, and others. The cycling media properties that have switched have only done so because they can play the "Lance lied to me!" victim card. Some are *still* trying to sell the myth. John Wilcockson for one.

To be fair to CN, they do a good job leading the anti-doping stories and still cater to the sport's promoters. They could have easily moderated this sub-forum to oblivion but didn't/don't. Hopefully there is some benefit to CN for doing this. There's a number of other smaller, sites doing a great job too. But pretty small operations relative to a Rodale Press.

 

[D-Queued]

With any luck for all those deniers out there, MLB's latest affair will surpass Armstrong as the most sophisticated doping program ever.

This is kind of ironic, however.

At one point, it was a bad time to be flirting with doping as a cyclist in the US as Congress was investigating baseball. Back then, people like Navigators' Cippolini were trying to get sympathy support to reduce the amount of testing (can you say wrong way?).

Now, given the high profile of Lance's meltdown, any appeal for leniency from baseball would be just plain funny.

But, Oprah is looking for more ratings. Looks like she might get a lineup.

Dave.

 

[86TDFWinner]

^^^^ Agreed, pretty spot on there.

 

[86TDFWinner]

funny you mention Ray Lewis. this came out today:
http://www.philly.com/philly/blogs/trending/Ray-Lewis-SWATS-doping-Sports-Illustrated-banned-substance.html

I think Lewis is a POS. He knew he got away with murder, and he plays up to the media(and they him) that he's some sort of icon, and a "great football guy"....

 

[zlev11]

funny you mention Ray Lewis. this came out today:
http://www.philly.com/philly/blogs/trending/Ray-Lewis-SWATS-doping-Sports-Illustrated-banned-substance.html

wow, that's great. bet it wont get a single mention during the super bowl this weekend, though.

 

[techknowgn]

I've done a lot of talking to media types who do spend time on the doping/sports law beats, and a few people in the league, and it looks like MLB has gotten serious about doping. It will obviously take til the next CBA to change the rules, but popping their superstars isn't a league that hides doping; that's the difference between the NFL (popping linemen, not QBs/RBs) and the MLB. The NHL from what Ive been able to find is on the same arc as MLB but a couple years behind. They added a ton of language for new antidoping measures in the new CBA, though the exact language isnt available to the public yet, just the "memorandum of understanding" that encapsulates what will be covered. random in-season HGH committee to evaluate, everything else on line already. HGH committee should have answers in the next year, likely testing the year after that. Its not enough but its going to wind up being closer to MLB than NFL.

 

[Fatclimber]

...
You'll notice, the media outlets that are breaking the stories are NOT cycling-specific. Wall St. Journal, Sports Illustrated, and others. The cycling media properties that have switched have only done so because they can play the "Lance lied to me!" victim card. Some are *still* trying to sell the myth. John Wilcockson for one.
...

Cheers to 60 minutes, maybe this new sports edition will rattle the cages of some sports who have been frolicking tranquilly in their piles of cash while their young athletes shoot themselves in the heart rather than head to preserve their brain for scientific study.

 

[Fatclimber]

With any luck for all those deniers out there, MLB's latest affair will surpass Armstrong as the most sophisticated doping program ever.
...

This is exactly what comes to mind when hearing Tygart referring to the most professionalized, successful, sophisticated, yadda, yadda, doping program sport has ever seen by dopewadstrong. I have a hunch that any of the football teams (American) that have played in the last 3 weeks have programs that would supersede sh!tf@cestong's program in all areas mentioned quite easily.

 

[mwbyrd]

The previous poster who said Skip Bayless is a j@ck@ss will get no argument from me. That guy is probably the worst sports commentator - editorialist I have ever listened to or read.

Michael Wilbon and Stephen A. Jackson are as bad as Skip!!!

 

[D-Queued]

This is exactly what comes to mind when hearing Tygart referring to the most professionalized, successful, sophisticated, yadda, yadda, doping program sport has ever seen by dopewadstrong. I have a hunch that any of the football teams (American) that have played in the last 3 weeks have programs that would supersede sh!tf@cestong's program in all areas mentioned quite easily.

Yes, it is kind of funny that people would get worked up over that. Why be offended by Tygart's statement?

Even if it is true, the title may be as fleeting as an Armstrong TdF win.

Cycling can't win even when it is losing.

Dave.