Non-majority opinion = trolling, it seems

[HyperMartin]

I'm amazed that the thread I started ("Why Alberto Contador will never be a champion for the ages") was closed.

But I'm even more amazed that the closing administrador had the brass neck to call it a trolling thread. Apparently, on the CN forums, any opinion that goes against the majority point of view is automatically labelled "trolling".

Would it have been that difficult to send me a PM beforehand and give me the opportunity to defend my thread? Really?

It would speak positively of the moderators if they were gracious enough to correct their mistake and re-open the thread for discussion.

 

[BigMac]

I agree with you in that the thread should be re-opened as there is no reason for it's content, at least what's presented in the original post, to be labeled trolling. There were, however, many who felt the need to shower trolling accusations around and hurl insults to you and those who agreed with you. The fanboys and girls who can't stand a different opinion than theirs - which in the case of Contador, are too many.

 

[Red Rick]

There is a difference between not having the majority opion and trolling. I think the Hitch gave a couple of good examples of that in the moderators thread. There's plenty of posters I respect that have a different opinion than mine, and I'm pretty sure that holds for most of the people you mean.

 

[djpbaltimore]

I was really disappointed by the tone of the final post from the mod too. The fact that there was no direct communication makes it even worse. The thread would've been fine IMO if it hadn't been for the repeated accusations of trolling. I thought the new rules were supposed to prevent those kinds of personal attacks?

 

[BigMac]

And what's different in this case, then. A poster making legitimate points which some happened to agree with it. Why can't this poster's opinion, which is shared by others, be respected? The OP was keen on discussing the subject, but some felt the urge to call him troll without anything to base their caims, just their instinct, and, apparentely, 'experience'. This happens too often in this forum and something must be done. I've went through it recently, though with different labels. The OP always stood on-topic while some tried to derrail the thread with insults and acting cretinous. And the excuse for the unsubstantiated, nonsensical accusations, is that ''trolls are getting more sophisticated''. The OP wanted a civilized discussion, while some were trying to create a flame war.

 

[HyperMartin]

It's easy to label someone a troll when you don't agree with them. It provides a convenient escape route from actually having to confront their arguments with arguments of your own.

But it was quite obvious I'm not a troll.

I supported my OP with several reasoned arguments (whether people agreed with them or not was a different matter). When people pointed out one or two mistakes in my arguments, I was happy to correct them. And I was open to changing my mind if sufficient proof was provided, (e.g. regarding the DQ of Rasmussen from the 2007 Tour). I refrained from personal attacks, even when other people called me an idiot. And, if the thread-closing admin had taken two minutes to write to me, I'd have defended my post courteously and reasonably.

One would certainly expect better behaviour from a moderator than to brand someone a troll and shut his thread down... for simply daring to have a non-majority opinion.

 

[the sceptic]

trolling = trolling

 

[kingjr]

Whether the original creator of the thread is a troll or not, the discussion itself wasn't too bad, so how about just getting rid of the supposed troll and keep the thread open?

 

[del1962]

trolling = trolling

Does that include when you and the Hog are trolling

 

[HyperMartin]

Whether the original creator of the thread is a troll or not, the discussion itself wasn't too bad, so how about just getting rid of the supposed troll and keep the thread open?

How about not? How about not getting rid of someone just because a number of people lazily played the "troll" card?

 

[the sceptic]

Whether the original creator of the thread is a troll or not, the discussion itself wasn't too bad, so how about just getting rid of the supposed troll and keep the thread open?

agree, the thread generated some pretty interesting discussion.

 

[del1962]

How about not? How about not getting rid of someone just because a number of people lazily played the "troll" card?

Just a question, have you ever been a fan of Andy Schleck?

 

[BigMac]

agree, the thread generated some pretty interesting discussion.

banning the troll and keeping the thread open would have been better imo.

What? If the thread generated interesting discussion, it was due to the points made by the OP. You are so full of yourselves that you don't realize how arrogant you are with your accusations and trying to pass as an omniscient truthful entity. For you he is a troll because he is a troll - that's not how things work. His behaviour was impeccable on all acounts, yet you and others, as always, have to feed your megalomaniac ego and self-importance by taking a position over others and actually trying to guess one's intentions based on nothing other than your perverted will for it to be as you want it to be. You've done it before (to me and, I'm sure, others), you are still doing it, and I doubt you will stop as this seems to be allowed over and over as long as it is the same ones doing it.

 

[Afrank]

Calm down people. Let's not start throwing insults at each other. And lets stop with calling people a troll as well. If you suspect trolling, just report it instead of posting about it.

 

[del1962]

I am not a contador fan, but HyperMartin does come across as someone whos sole aim is winding up contador fans, from what I can gather, first post sets up a thread to denigrate contador, only posts in that thread, then this thread.

 

[BigMac]

I am not a contador fan, but HyperMartin does come across as someone whos sole aim is winding up contador fans, from what I can gather, first post sets up a thread to denigrate contador, only posts in that thread, then this thread.

No, No, No. People should read eveything and not cherry-pick what's most convenient. In no way was his purpose to wind up whoever it was, but to express why he thinks what he thinks. He was careful enough to write in the beggining of the post that he acknowledges Contador ''is a great rider who makes for very entertaining racing. His never-give-up attitude has made him a fan favourite, and rightly so.'' However, in his own right, he states that ''he'll never be a champion for the ages, like Hinault or Merckx were.'' After that, he proceded to explain why. And he elaborates, instead of throwing some meaningless words around, as some here do and easily get away with. Only those with quite a fragile ego can get winded-up at that - and there were many, who, instead of acting like normal people, went hysterical and decided that it was wise to insult the OP. This is a tremendous injustice.

Calm down people. Let's not start throwing insults at each other. And lets stop with calling people a troll as well. If you suspect trolling, just report it instead of posting about it.

It wasn't an insult. I (and certainly others too) are tired of the_sceptic and some others thinking they are the paragons of truth and that whatever they say is how things are. They throw accusations around without any sort of content to back them up, they don't even take the time. It's not the first time he does it and it won't be the last as no proper action is taken. You advise them to stop calling others trolls, but they will continue. And you will advice again, and again, and the pratical response will always be the same, and on we go. Hope this doesn't get deleted too.

 

[HyperMartin]

Just a question, have you ever been a fan of Andy Schleck?

No. Since I started following cycling in '97, I've been a fan of Ullrich, Vinokourov, Di Luca and now Nibali. But how is that relevant?

 

[the sceptic]

No, No, No. People should read eveything and not cherry-pick what's most convenient. In no way was his purpose to wind up whoever it was, but to express why he thinks what he thinks. He was careful enough to write in the beggining of the post that he acknowledges Contador ''is a great rider who makes for very entertaining racing. His never-give-up attitude has made him a fan favourite, and rightly so.'' However, in his own right, he states that ''he'll never be a champion for the ages, like Hinault or Merckx were.'' After that, he proceded to explain why. And he elaborates, instead of throwing some meaningless words around, as some here do and easily get away with. Only those with quite a fragile ego can get winded-up at that - and there were many, who, instead of acting like normal people, went hysterical and decided that it was wise to insult the OP. This is a tremendous injustice.



It wasn't an insult. I (and certainly others too) are tired of the_sceptic and some others thinking they are the paragons of truth and that whatever they say is how things are. They throw accusations around without any sort of content to back them up, they don't even take the time. It's not the first time he does it and it won't be the last as no proper action is taken. You advise them to stop calling others trolls, but they will continue. And you will advice again, and again, and the pratical response will always be the same, and on we go. Hope this doesn't get deleted too.

If you get so offended by me calling people trolls, maybe you shouldnt be throwing around insults yourself?

And shouldnt you be a bit more grateful towards the mods after they let you come back from your permaban?

 

[BigMac]

If you get so offended by me calling people trolls, maybe you shouldnt be throwing around insults yourself?

And shouldnt you be a bit more grateful towards the mods after they let you come back from your permaban?

Insults? I'm not 'offended' by you calling people trolls - It's that you are always ready to make accusations and label others as something you think they are, and you should not. Be it troll or something else. You do it too often and it's completely arrogant - if on purpose or not, I don't know.

And since when is expressing an opinion which happens to go against that of a mod, being ungrateful? Are you suggesting that I should shut up and not question any moderator decisions? Are you appealing to moderator power again? I am very grateful to sittingbison, for the record, as he was the one who took the time to listen to my case - one thing has nothing to do with the other. I am free to express my opinion as long as It's substantiated and not harmful.

 

[Christian]

It's an interesting question! I did not get to participate in the original thread and I am not sure if it is allowed here.

Results-wise I think Nibali and Wiggins would have (had) the best shot to come close to the same diversity of wins as Merckx. Wiggins has won the Tour, the Olympics, track, and has done well in races like Roubaix. Didn't he even target the hour record? Nibali seems to me the most versatile out of the current GC contenders, and I could see him excell in races that others wouldn't enter.

Not sure if Contador even wants to become a legend for the ages? He seems like a pretty quiet, shy guy who might be happy spending his retirement in his little village in Spain with his wife. Of course the results speak for themselves, but still - who will people sooner remember, Miroslav Klose or Ronaldo? Of course Klose is great, and a gentleman sportsman, but personally I think I shall sooner remember Ronaldo.

 

[LaFlorecita]

Wow! I only just realized BigMac is actually back

 

[LaFlorecita]

It's an interesting question! I did not get to participate in the original thread and I am not sure if it is allowed here.

Results-wise I think Nibali and Wiggins would have (had) the best shot to come close to the same diversity of wins as Merckx. Wiggins has won the Tour, the Olympics, track, and has done well in races like Roubaix. Didn't he even target the hour record? Nibali seems to me the most versatile out of the current GC contenders, and I could see him excell in races that others wouldn't enter.

Not sure if Contador even wants to become a legend for the ages? He seems like a pretty quiet, shy guy who might be happy spending his retirement in his little village in Spain with his wife. Of course the results speak for themselves, but still - who will people sooner remember, Miroslav Klose or Ronaldo? Of course Klose is great, and a gentleman sportsman, but personally I think I shall sooner remember Ronaldo.

Contador is definitely not interested in becoming a legend, I'm not sure if he would mind becoming one, but it's not his goal or something. He just wants to win as much as possible.

 

[BigMac]

Wow! I only just realized BigMac is actually back

Thank you! It's always touching when people notice me.

 

[Parker]

People who call 'troll', 'sockpuppet' etc every time someone annoys them (or even reports them to the mods) are like footballers who wave imaginary cards to referees when they get fouled. Even if they are right they look pathetic. It just shows that you are insecure in your own opinions.

 

[the sceptic]

People who call 'troll', 'sockpuppet' etc every time someone annoys them (or even reports them to the mods) are like footballers who wave imaginary cards to referees when they get fouled. Even if they are right they look pathetic. It just shows that you are insecure in your own opinions.

what about people who whine about those who correctly point out trolls?