Teams & Riders Official Wout Van Aert thread

[tobydawq]

Has anyone ever won it without winning one of the nine major races of the year?

Has anyone ever been a better rider without winning one of the nine major races of the year than Van Aert this year?

And what if he wins the WCRR?

Also, does anybody truly believe he wouldn't have won Flanders if he hadn't gotten Covid a couple of days before?

 

[sir fly]

Has anyone ever been a better rider without winning one of the nine major races of the year than Van Aert this year?

And what if he wins the WCRR?

Also, does anybody truly believe he wouldn't have won Flanders if he hadn't gotten Covid a couple of days before?

I don't truly believe he wouldn't win Flanders, but neither I believe he'd have surely won it.
There weren't much more Watts to be spilled from the second Kwaremont onwards than Pogačar and Van der Poel splashed.

 

[tobydawq]

I don't truly believe he wouldn't win Flanders, but neither I believe he'd have surely won it.
There weren't much more Watts to be spilled from the second Kwaremont onwards than Pogačar and Van der Poel splashed.

But he had been in a league of his own in the classics before that.

 

[KZD]

I don't truly believe he wouldn't win Flanders, but neither I believe he'd have surely won it.
There weren't much more Watts to be spilled from the second Kwaremont onwards than Pogačar and Van der Poel splashed.

Exactly, last year he also won Ghent Wevelgem and Amstel but was dropped like a stone by Van der Poel in the last Kwaremont so even after his impressive Omloop and E3 wins its possible that he could have been beaten in RVV this year. I like Van Aert but one need to recognise that he tends to underperform in monument distance races when compared with shorter classics.

 

[sir fly]

But he had been in a league of his own in the classics before that.

The strongest from Flanders weren't around, although they'd probably have been beaten... MVdP still recovering, Pogačar learning.
Flanders would've been different for sure.

 

[Ricco']

Has anyone ever been a better rider without winning one of the nine major races of the year than Van Aert this year?

Valverde 2014?

2nd Lombardia
2nd LBL
3rd Worlds
3rd Vuelta (1 stage)
4th Tour
1st San Sebastian
1st Fleche Wallonne
4th Amstel
5th Itzulia
3rd Strade Bianche (not same status as today but already big)
plus some .1 wins

 

[Ilmaestro99]

How am I biased? Sure, I sometimes pitch in a little skewedly in Valverde/Nibali discussions to offset the heavy Nibali bias on this forum, otherwise I wouldn't exactly say that I have my head up the butt of certain riders.

Whereas your bias is laughingly obvious, even if you once in a while come up with a post along the lines of "oh, I'm so sorry, I never meant to be like this on this forum, sorry if it has gotten out of hand" after which you continue in the exact same way.

I don't know if it necessarily should merit a ban, though, but if you can't see yourself that you elevate Masnada to a demigod (if he wasn't already) for being second in a monument whereas Van Aert's podium places in monuments are just proof of his complete uselessness, then I really don't know what to tell you.

The context of the riders and the race make a difference in that comparison but you do make a good point.

But when assessing van aert I have no bias. I don't understand why being Masnada fan makes me biased about wout van aert.

You being a valverde fan doesn't make you biased about assessing van aert.

Van aert is not the best rider in the world.

I enjoy llmaestro99's posts most of the times, including his extreme biases, but I see toby as the least biased (hyper)active poster in this forum. And I, being a biased poster, am not biased in this.

Toby is a good guy and he understand the sport.

But I've though it's about heart, passion, emotion, fighting spirit... If it's just about results, then that makes Masnada an irrelevant gregario ... Is that what you're trying to say? That's just cold man

The Masnada thing is a combination of me being a fan of his character and his racing style, and my belief that he's underrated.

I don't believe that Masanda is the best rider in the world and I never claimed that. People here are claiming van aert is the best rider in the wrold.

This so called best rider won only 1 monument in the last 4 years.

Meanwhile we have a guy that won 1 monument, 2 wolrd championships and a top 5 on the Tour de France in the same period

We have a guy that won 2x monuments in the same season with the Tour de France.

We have a guy who finished 1st, 2nd, 1st in the last 3 edition of RVV

We have a guy like roglic that won 3 grand tours, a monument and an Olympic gold.

Results matter. For sure Van Aert might be the strongest in the world if the Tour de France was done on zwift. But this is not cycling.

 

[Valv.Piti]

"For sure Van Aert might be the strongest in the world if the Tour de France was done on zwift. But this is not cycling."

This is quite possible the least intelligent thing I have ever read on this forum. I don't even know what to make of it, Im just lost.

 

[Carrick-On-Seine]

"For sure Van Aert might be the strongest in the world if the Tour de France was done on zwift. But this is not cycling."

This is quite possible the least intelligent thing I have ever read on this forum. I don't even know what to make of it, Im just lost.

It thought it was pretty obvious. Strength is one of the assets that wins races but not the only one.

 

[Valv.Piti]

It thought it was pretty obvious. Strength is one of the assets that wins races but not the only one.

Yes, and Wout Aert won 3 stages, the green jersey with a new record while simultaneously being the best domestique. Its like saying the sky is blue. Like, duh.

 

[Netserk]

As of now?
Correct me if I'm wrong but I reckon there hasn't been a single Velo d'Or winner who wasn't at least a Monument/WC or GT winner.

As of now, I expect those three to be the top-3 that is published.

His biggest win last year was Amstel, yet he was still 3rd.

 

[Netserk]

Valverde 2014?

2nd Lombardia
2nd LBL
3rd Worlds
3rd Vuelta (1 stage)
4th Tour
1st San Sebastian
1st Fleche Wallonne
4th Amstel
5th Itzulia
3rd Strade Bianche (not same status as today but already big)
plus some .1 wins

And he was 3rd in Velo d'Or that year, behind Nibali.

Trolling is a thing on forums. I wouldn’t consider @Ilmaestro99 to be trolling. He is just extremely biased, which I think is both good and bad, but overall makes this forum more enjoyable. Asking for people who have extreme fandoms like Ilmaestro to be banned makes the forum less enjoying. So, if you please don’t want this people to be on the forum, just ignore them. I don’t, as it keeps all the fun posters on this forum able to see to me.

He is an attention sink, a noise generator. Just like the old Machado "fan" iZnoGouD.

You are right that that doesn't in itself necessarily mean that he is (intentionally) trolling, but functionally he is.

 

[SafeBet]

As of now, I expect those three to be the top-3 that is published.

His biggest win last year was Amstel, yet he was still 3rd.

Amstel and Gent-Wevelgem, which is better than Harelbeke and Omloop.
Doesn't cut it to win the Velo d'Or (historically).

Tour de France winner will almost always be preferred in "weak" years.

 

[Red Rick]

As of now, I expect those three to be the top-3 that is published.

His biggest win last year was Amstel, yet he was still 3rd.

A lot of people were putting him 2nd behind Pogacar last year

 

[sir fly]

If they all would race Flanders and Amstel against each other Velo d'Or would be unnecessary.

 

[frisenfruitig]

Because winning the Tour matters a lot, and in the end Van Aert didn't win a monument either.

Van Aerts entire argument basically rests on being flashy in TdF breakaway stages, while Vingegaard at least dropped the 2 single most powerful climbing performances in the last 15 years in the Tour de France.

Even for sheer quantity Van Aert isn't that much better. He has 9 wins vs Vingegaards 6.

Finally it's also weird that Vingegaards win gets treated like Nibali in 2014 a little bit. He was up there before July, he just didn't win much.

Van Aerts (and also Pogacar's) entire argument rests on the fact that they are competing for the win in every race throughout the whole season and not just the TDF. If you only look at wins and ignore the rest then sure, the difference isn't big. But that is not a fair assessment of their performances at all. Where was Vingegaard when Pogacar and Van Aert were racing for the win during the spring? I can hardly recall him doing anything of note.

Also saying Van Aert was just "being flasy in breakaway stages" is just ridiculous, he did way more than that.

 

[tobydawq]

"For sure Van Aert might be the strongest in the world if the Tour de France was done on zwift. But this is not cycling."

This is quite possible the least intelligent thing I have ever read on this forum. I don't even know what to make of it, Im just lost.

I think it was pretty obvious what his point was, even though it could have been put a bit more eloquently.

ilmaestro: It doesn't have to do with the fact that you're a Masnada fan but closing your eyes for everything but major race results when discussing Van Aert is being biased. The guy does things we have never seen before and I'm sure that inside the peloton he was considered by far the best rider in the Tour. You, however, clearly don't like him and have felt the need to give him mocking nicknames and comparing him to a much inferior rider who also happened to have just one monument even though it's for all to see that Pozzato, while being a fine rider, has nowhere near the level of Van Aert.


And let it be clear, I don't particularly like Van Aert, but I do know that what he can do is something absolutely unique. Valv.Piti's description of him being a "peak Sagan on steroids" is probably the most apt way of capturing his level I have seen.

 

[tobydawq]

Also saying Van Aert was just "being flasy in breakaway stages" is just ridiculous, he did way more than that.

Can the word ridiculous even cover it?

 

[Red Rick]

Van Aerts (and also Pogacar's) entire argument rests on the fact that they are competing for the win in every race throughout the whole season and not just the TDF. If you only look at wins and ignore the rest then sure, the difference isn't big. But that is not a fair assessment of their performances at all. Where was Vingegaard when Pogacar and Van Aert were racing for the win during the spring? I can hardly recall him doing anything of note.

Also saying Van Aert was just "being flasy in breakaway stages" is just ridiculous, he did way more than that.

Vingegaard was 2nd in Tirreno and 5th in Itzulia. Its like saying Pogacar wasnt racing for the win in Sanremo or de Ronde

 

[Blanco]

If season ends now, it's:
1.Vingegaard
2.Van Aert
3.Pogacar

 

[KZD]

If season ends now, it's:
1.Vingegaard
2.Van Aert
3.Pogacar

I would never put Van Aert ahead of Pogačar this season given that the latter has 5 more wins including 2 World Tour stage races and one of the most important non-monument classics plus a second in the Tour overall

 

[Pirazziattacks]

I don't truly believe he wouldn't win Flanders, but neither I believe he'd have surely won it.
There weren't much more Watts to be spilled from the second Kwaremont onwards than Pogačar and Van der Poel splashed.

Pog was a few pedal strokes off cracking MVDP in Flanders, and I think MVDP is a close to undroppable as there is on those climbs. I have a hard time believing that WVA could've stuck with them unless he and Jumbo had done something earlier on to alter the course of the race and prevent Pog from being so aggressive.

 

[Carrick-On-Seine]

I would never put Van Aert ahead of Pogačar this season given that the latter has 5 more wins this season including 2 World Tour stage races and one of the most important non-monument classics plus a second in the Tour overall

Sometimes I just wish Van Aert would go and win a couple of big ones so his ultra fans would stop this kind of thing. As @Red Rick pointed out earlier, people were even arguing last year that Van Aert should have been above someone who won a GT and Olympic gold. Bizarre.
Incredible rider but let the major race results speak.

 

[Bonimenier]

Why is Velo d'Or getting discussed in van Aert's thread? He's not even in the virtual top 3 right now. Hindley, Vingegaard, Evenepoel and Pogacar are easily ahead of him for now.

 

[tobydawq]

Why is Velo d'Or getting discussed in van Aert's thread? He's not even in the virtual top 3 right now. Hindley, Vingegaard, Evenepoel and Pogacar are easily ahead of him for now.

Hindley? Come on...

Sorry, but one guy had to win the Giro, and none of the main guys from the race had anything else noteworthy to show for the season.