Teams & Riders Official Wout Van Aert thread

[Echoes]

Van der Poel is transitioning to mtb at least until 2020 probably. I think cycing fans often forget that a factor influencing a rider's choice could just be enjoyment of the sport, and VdP just enjoys cross/mtb much mroe than road cycling. Besides, the pay in cross isn't too much less. I mean, he (vdp) made at least 40k in prize money alone last year, and Wout made around 30k, not including sponsorship or salary from the team, or even continental races.

All very true and by the way as I often reminded on these boards, also Wout enjoys cyclocross a lot more. It was his dream as a kid to be a cyclocrosser, not a roadie. Only his body is better built for road racing than it is for cyclocross, at least now because that was not the case in the youth categories. Besides, so far Wout's problem on the road has always been the distance (see Belgian Nats in the past two years; he's also admitted it several times himself). So the results that he's had so far this road season could've been expected but if he also performs like that at the Tour of Flander*s, you might say that he's ready to switch but until then, you cannot draw any conclusion. By the way I'm not sure that Wout and Mathieu could be regular opponents on the road given the fact that Wout would rather focus on the cobbled classics (he's way too heavy for the Ardennes, as a matter of fact he's also normally too heavy for cyclocrosser) while Mathieu would rather focus on the Ardennes, the way I see it if he ever switch to the road.

 

[MTBrider]

So being good in Strade Bianche shows he is not the new Zdenek Stybar? Makes sense.

He will be better than Stybar. Maybe much better.

No! He needs to stick with cyclocross...sure do some road races, but he shouldn't completely make the switch.

He will stick to cyclocross for a while but i think that's a mistake. I also don't get why van der Poel is wasting his time with this cross niche. Do the real thing, Mathieu!

Van der Poel is transitioning to mtb at least until 2020 probably. I think cycing fans often forget that a factor influencing a rider's choice could just be enjoyment of the sport, and VdP just enjoys cross/mtb much mroe than road cycling. Besides, the pay in cross isn't too much less. I mean, he (vdp) made at least 40k in prize money alone last year, and Wout made around 30k, not including sponsorship or salary from the team, or even continental races.

That depends on where you are in the hierarchy of the two sports. There’s no real financial incentive to go from being one of the two guys who divide up all of the cross races to being a pretty good road racer. But there’s an enormous incentive if you can be Tom Boonen.

The pay in CX is a lot better than that for those boys. 30 to 50K is what a top five women makes in prize money. Between start money and prize money alone the top two guys are easily clearing 6 figures and the first number is a lot bigger then 1, 2 or 3.

That is why those guys are reluctant to switch. Right now they would be taking a pay-cut to race on the road. Who is going to pay a first year Pro-tour rider 7 figures?

Plus, CX racing is a lot of fun. You can have a life out side of racing, road racing on other hand asks a lot more of your time.

 

[Velolover2]

Much better than Stybar (who has great palmarès) would require monument. I don't know if Van Aert can win one. Maybe. He is still young.

 

[Dekker_Tifosi]

Let's put it comparatively. Van Aert (and VdP) put the opponens Nys sometimes barely beat to shame, they dominated in an unseen way in CX, against opponents Stybar struggled with. Every time Van Aert or VDP go to other disciplines (road races, mtb) they have done immediately well. Both have won road races already at a lower level. And even at world level (VDP in MTB world cup, Van Aert now in strade bianchi).
So yeah, I think Van Aert is vastly more talented than Stybar, even on the road. Question is if he will put the same dedication in. As for now he is still planning on riding a full cross season which will seriously hamper his road chances.

 

[Zinoviev Letter]

So being good in Strade Bianche shows he is not the new Zdenek Stybar? Makes sense.

He will be better than Stybar. Maybe much better.

No! He needs to stick with cyclocross...sure do some road races, but he shouldn't completely make the switch.

He will stick to cyclocross for a while but i think that's a mistake. I also don't get why van der Poel is wasting his time with this cross niche. Do the real thing, Mathieu!

Van der Poel is transitioning to mtb at least until 2020 probably. I think cycing fans often forget that a factor influencing a rider's choice could just be enjoyment of the sport, and VdP just enjoys cross/mtb much mroe than road cycling. Besides, the pay in cross isn't too much less. I mean, he (vdp) made at least 40k in prize money alone last year, and Wout made around 30k, not including sponsorship or salary from the team, or even continental races.

That depends on where you are in the hierarchy of the two sports. There’s no real financial incentive to go from being one of the two guys who divide up all of the cross races to being a pretty good road racer. But there’s an enormous incentive if you can be Tom Boonen.

The pay in CX is a lot better than that for those boys. 30 to 50K is what a top five women makes in prize money. Between start money and prize money alone the top two guys are easily clearing 6 figures and the first number is a lot bigger then 1, 2 or 3.

That is why those guys are reluctant to switch. Right now they would be taking a pay-cut to race on the road. Who is going to pay a first year Pro-tour rider 7 figures?

Plus, CX racing is a lot of fun. You can have a life out side of racing, road racing on other hand asks a lot more of your time.

I’m not sure if this is supposed to disagree with the post it’s replying to?

Road is a much bigger sport with much more money. Swapping cross for road if you were guaranteed to be racing at the same level in both sports would be a very easy financial decision to make. Swapping being one of the two guys with an absolute stranglehold on top level cross to be a merely good roadie is not such an obvious financial decision. WVA and MVDP are earning more than all but the road elite. If they can transition to being part of that elite there is more money, if they can’t, there isn’t.

There may also be other issues involved in such a decision, as you note, including enjoyment and also lifestyle, but those are distinct from the financial question which is pretty straightforward.

 

[Frankschleck]

Re:

Let's put it comparatively. Van Aert (and VdP) put the opponens Nys sometimes barely beat to shame, they dominated in an unseen way in CX, against opponents Stybar struggled with. Every time Van Aert or VDP go to other disciplines (road races, mtb) they have done immediately well. Both have won road races already at a lower level. And even at world level (VDP in MTB world cup, Van Aert now in strade bianchi).
So yeah, I think Van Aert is vastly more talented than Stybar, even on the road. Question is if he will put the same dedication in. As for now he is still planning on riding a full cross season which will seriously hamper his road chances.

Well, i don't agree with that. Stybar is one of the worlds best classic riders, and it is really to early to say that Van Aert has the talent and the mindsset to do what Stybar has done since he became a roadracer. Stybar is kind of boring in my opinion, but he is really talented, so i wouldn't say that Van Aert is more talented.

 

[MTBrider]

I’m not sure if this is supposed to disagree with the post it’s replying to?

Road is a much bigger sport with much more money. Swapping cross for road if you were guaranteed to be racing at the same level in both sports would be a very easy financial decision to make. Swapping being one of the two guys with an absolute stranglehold on top level cross to be a merely good roadie is not such an obvious financial decision. WVA and MVDP are earning more than all but the road elite. If they can transition to being part of that elite there is more money, if they can’t, there isn’t.

There may also be other issues involved in such a decision, as you note, including enjoyment and also lifestyle, but those are distinct from the financial question which is pretty straightforward.

I was partially disagreeing. I was referring to fact that those two boys already make a lot of money racing CX.

And as you said, if they can dominate road racing like they do CX racing then it is a no-brainer. But if they were to give up CX racing to focus on the road they would, in the short term at least, be taking at least a 50% pay cut.

I suspect that both of their plans is to continue to develop through CX, MTB, and lower tier road racing, and when they do switch to focus on the road at 25 or 26 they will immediately be major factors at their target races.

 

[Zinoviev Letter]

I’m not sure if this is supposed to disagree with the post it’s replying to?

Road is a much bigger sport with much more money. Swapping cross for road if you were guaranteed to be racing at the same level in both sports would be a very easy financial decision to make. Swapping being one of the two guys with an absolute stranglehold on top level cross to be a merely good roadie is not such an obvious financial decision. WVA and MVDP are earning more than all but the road elite. If they can transition to being part of that elite there is more money, if they can’t, there isn’t.

There may also be other issues involved in such a decision, as you note, including enjoyment and also lifestyle, but those are distinct from the financial question which is pretty straightforward.

I was partially disagreeing. I was referring to fact that those two boys already make a lot of money racing CX.

And as you said, if they can dominate road racing like they do CX racing then it is a no-brainer. But if they were to give up CX racing to focus on the road they would, in the short term at least, be taking at least a 50% pay cut.

I suspect that both of their plans is to continue to develop through CX, MTB, and lower tier road racing, and when they do switch to focus on the road at 25 or 26 they will immediately be major factors at their target races.

Nobody can dominate road racing like they do cross because it’s too complex a sport. In cross there are few ways to beat someone who is stronger on the day, so if you are consistently the strongest, you win with a consistency that’s unheard of in modern road racing. But other than that detail I agree with you. With the proviso that if either man can put in multiple super strong performances moonlighting on the road, the path to a “star” contract may be a little shorter than that.

 

[MTBrider]

[quote="
Nobody can dominate road racing like they do cross because it’s too complex a sport. In cross there are few ways to beat someone who is stronger on the day, so if you are consistently the strongest, you win with a consistency that’s unheard of in modern road racing. But other than that detail I agree with you. With the proviso that if either man can put in multiple super strong performances moonlighting on the road, the path to a “star” contract may be a little shorter than that.[/quote]

Road is unique, it is almost as if there is different disciplines. You have the grand-tour rides, the cobbled classic riders, the Hilly classic riders, and the field sprinters. I would say that Froome, Sagan, Valverde, and Kittle are the dominant riders in their disciplines.

Obviously tactics are major factor on the road but biggest difference is the depth of competition. In CX there are really only two guys who are world class cyclist, in MTB there is 10, on the road there is 50. Hard to win every race when you are against 50 guys who are your ability level.

I suspect that Wout's agent got more than a few phone calls this week.

 

[Echoes]

Well Wout said it in several interviews. There are a lot more pay discrepancies in road cycling than in cyclocross and if you win classics and are a regular contender for classic wins, you are in a league of its own. But Wout is far from sure to be in that category on the road, neither is Mathieu. Being one of the two top guys in cyclocross is worth more than being an average road classic rider who can hardly hope to do better than a top10 in the said classics. It's not always been so but these days it definitely is, here in Belgium because cyclocross has become so widely covered by TV. So persevering in cyclocross is also a financial insurance. Sponsor Crelan has always very much wanted Wout to stay in cyclocross. They did not want to risk it. Very convenient for Wout as he likes it better that way.

The fact he and Mathieu are more way more talented than Stybar, which cannot be denied, is no guarantee for an at least equally good road career as Styby's. Lars Boom is also considered more talented than Styby (at least on the road but even in cross) and has always been seen as such but his road career so far is much less of a success. Niels Albert was also considered more talented than Styby at least for the road work but also definitely in cross but he never wished to make the switch as he liked cross way better.

 

[nayr497]

No matter what, winning a CX WC and then a few weeks later going #3 on a long, tough road race is wildy impressive.

 

[Akuryo]

Re:

No matter what, winning a CX WC and then a few weeks later going #3 on a long, tough road race is wildy impressive.

That was never the issue. I think we all agree that his ride at Strade was great. The question was, if he could have an equally or even "much better" road career than Zdenek Stybar?.

 

[Frankschleck]

Re: Re:

No matter what, winning a CX WC and then a few weeks later going #3 on a long, tough road race is wildy impressive.

That was never the issue. I think we all agree that his ride at Strade was great. The question was, if he could have an equally or even "much better" road career than Zdenek Stybar?.

maybe equally, maybe better, but most defiantly not a lot better.

 

[fauniera]

Re: Re:

maybe equally, maybe better, but most defiantly not a lot better.

Hmm? It's not like a lot is needed to have a much better road career than Stybar (so far).

 

[frisenfruitig]

Re: Re:

No matter what, winning a CX WC and then a few weeks later going #3 on a long, tough road race is wildy impressive.

That was never the issue. I think we all agree that his ride at Strade was great. The question was, if he could have an equally or even "much better" road career than Zdenek Stybar?.

maybe equally, maybe better, but most defiantly not a lot better.

How can you tell it will "defiantly" not be a lot better? Seems a bit early considering he's only 23 years old and this is the first time doing these races.

 

[Jspear]

Re: Re:

maybe equally, maybe better, but most defiantly not a lot better.

Hmm? It's not like a lot is needed to have a much better road career than Stybar (so far).

Exactly. He's a good rider, but he only has a few good results. Maybe you could argue he would have more results if he wasn't on such a strong team, but then you could also argue that he has the results now because of a strong team. He's won a tour stage, vuelta stage, Eneco, Strade, and then some other placings in the classics (these are the "big" results just quickly looking at PCS.) Wout would have a very fair chance of passing Stybar if he were to completely cross over. Of course Stybar is still racing, but then Wout is very young...we shall see.

 

[Jagartrott]

10th in yesterday's GW in a sprint with quite a few fast guys. More importantly, he was again where he needed to be and made it seem easy. It should also be noted he was the youngest in the front group together with Van Schip (who was also very impressive by the way). If he can keep his cool, he has a great future on the road.

 

[Logic-is-your-friend]

Re:

10th in yesterday's GW in a sprint with quite a few fast guys. More importantly, he was again where he needed to be and made it seem easy. It should also be noted he was the youngest in the front group together with Van Schip (who was also very impressive by the way). If he can keep his cool, he has a great future on the road.

The last climb, the Kemmelberg, he seemed so very very comfortable. He was already pretty good on the Muur a couple of weeks ago, but yesterday it seemed, had the finish been 1k after a climb, he would have been one of few to beat. Really strong. Coming from cyclocrossing, it shouldn't amaze people that he has little issues with short steep climbs on cobbles... but the fact that he does so after 220k, is quite interesting.

 

[Red Rick]

There's nothing preventing Van Aert to test himself on the road without giving up too much on CX first. He doesn't have to make the decision yet. He seems to have a great engine right and going deep in Strade makes me think he can do anything that doesn't have 2km climbs in it.

 

[Logic-is-your-friend]

Re:

There's nothing preventing Van Aert to test himself on the road without giving up too much on CX first. He doesn't have to make the decision yet. He seems to have a great engine right and going deep in Strade makes me think he can do anything that doesn't have 2km climbs in it.

That remains to be seen. The past few years, the longer the climb (in CX courses), the more it was in his advantage. Shorter but steeper stuff, was usually for Mathieu. I think he has the engine to 'timetrial' his way up a steady climb, if he wanted to. Clearly he's too big and heavy to be a climber, but i wouldn't downright assume he couldn't cope with 2k climbs. It would certainly depend on the type of climb. Also, despite cramping out, falling over and jumping next to his saddle on the final climb in Strade Bianche, he only lost about 20 seconds on Bardet, who supposedly isn't the slowest climber in the world either.

Also, don't be fooled, he sacrificed this cross season in a major way. It's really not unrelated, that it took him up til november to be able to shake off guys like Aerts, Van der Haar, Sweeck... In september, he was downright attrocious. He clearly focussed on the second part of CX season, more particularly the WC, to push that form further towards his "debut" on the road.

 

[Flamin]

What 'longer climbs' are you referring to?

Wout himself said in December he had the exact same approach to the cross season as the year before, but that he lacked freshness and couldn't go as deep in training as usual. Whether that's completely true, or that he did have a different build-up but didn't want to make any excuses for underperforming (polite as he is, this could be the case), we'll never know.

Iirc he also said in some interview that he enjoys those long training rides and that they have always been part of his training regime. Maybe that's part of the reason why things are going so well so quickly on the road.

 

[Bardamu]

Haven't followed WvA really in the media. What will he do after Roubaix this season?

 

[Valanga]

Re:

Haven't followed WvA really in the media. What will he do after Roubaix this season?

Start yelling "show me the money" to his manager. And finally take a break I suppose.

His spring season ends after Roubaix, and then he'll have to start thinking about his future. Find a WT team that also wants to support his CX for example. He has a contract till the end of 2019 though.

 

[Ruudz0r]

Troooooo Brooooo Leooooon!

 

[Bardamu]

No racing on the road after Roubaix? A shame.