One more guy to make for an awesome Giro

[Parrulo]

http://jornalciclismo.com/basso-abdica-do-giro-em-que-devera-participar-tiago-machado

pretty much means tiago machado will ride the giro.

good for him and for us cus the hog won't be the manager in the giro(azevedo will) so we can see some crazy attacks.

 

[Libertine Seguros]

Hope he has the old Boavista insanity still. A year with the Hog may have beaten the fun out of him like it did to Paulinho, Popovych et al...

 

[Parrulo]

Hope he has the old Boavista insanity still. A year with the Hog may have beaten the fun out of him like it did to Paulinho, Popovych et al...

even tho those guys were fun to watch machado was just plain crazy. and crazy can be hidden but not washed away. i just hope he does well so he feels like he needs to gain time for an even better GC rank and attacks with over 9000 km to go so we can enjoy some old school cycling again.

 

[Libertine Seguros]

True, Machado's one of the most kamikaze guys I've ever seen. I'd love to see him decide to go on a speculative one in the Dolomites a bit like Sella did in '08, and see some other crazy climbers - Duarte and Rujano for example - go with. That could make for an epic Giro.

 

[Kvinto]

it'll be interesting company of "second echelon" captains: Van Garderen (HTC) Lofkvist (Sky) and now Machado as well

 

[Finbouy]

That lad Machado's on of my "one to watch this year".

Gotta love a trier.

 

[TourOfSardinia]

True, Machado's one of the most kamikaze guys I've ever seen. I'd love to see him decide to go on a speculative one in the Dolomites a bit like Sella did in '08, and see some other crazy climbers - Duarte and Rujano for example - go with. That could make for an epic Giro.

but Sella then was clearly .... [to be continued over in the clinic]

 

[jens_attacks]

goddamn i thought that you were talking about di luca when i saw the title.

machado?i like him but it'll be so tough to fight for GC,maybe a stage victory.but who knows...

 

[Kvinto]

His main weakness before Giro starts is only a lack of GT experience, his climbing and tt is OK. I suppose he can reach top-10

 

[Fester]

Hope he has the old Boavista insanity still. A year with the Hog may have beaten the fun out of him like it did to Paulinho, Popovych et al...

I hope Hog beat some sense into him.. His palmáres is about 10x as sparse as it could be rich because of those stupid tactics. Typical self sabotage and someone who is pleased with 4th. The other teams just must just grin to themselves as they put two roulleurs on the front to catch him with 3k's to go.

He's been a team leader since for ever so he's probably missing a lot of understanding of other aspect of how to win races rather than "pedal harder, faster!".

Those attacks aren't beautiful cycling.. beautiful would be if he won something with his brain!

 

[Michielveedeebee]

I hope Hog beat some sense into him.. His palmáres is about 10x as sparse as it could be rich because of those stupid tactics. Typical self sabotage and someone who is pleased with 4th. The other teams just must just grin to themselves as they put two roulleurs on the front to catch him with 3k's to go.

He's been a team leader since for ever so he's probably missing a lot of understanding of other aspect of how to win races rather than "pedal harder, faster!".

Those attacks aren't beautiful cycling.. beautiful would be if he won something with his brain!

because of this kind of reasoning cycling isn't as fun anymore

 

[canyonball]

There are enough riders to play that role and give you that kind of entertainment.

As for Machado, when you attack 3k from the finish in a flat stage, just to fall short on the moutain stages where differences are made, you are not getting your priorities straight. He nedded to chill out a bit and I think he did that this year while keeping some of his irreverence.

Next year giro...hmmm. I am curious to see what he does. Top 30 going unnoticed? Down the GC but with a stage win? I could defenitely see him winning a stage similar to the one Anker Sorensen got this year.

 

[Parrulo]

if nicolas roche can top 5 the vuelta then machado can at least top 15 the giro

 

[Kvinto]

if nicolas roche can top 5 the vuelta then machado can at least top 15 the giro

Are you about Vuelta a Catalunya? In my opinion it's more likely that Roche finished Vuelta a Espana in top 7
It was 5th GT for Roche, and second good result at Vuelta (he finished 13th in 2008). There are also: 22th (2009) and 15th (2010) at TDF and 122th at 2007 Giro. The only thing that makes his 2010 Vuelta special is how he gained this result. He was 6th at Bola del Mundo, but didn't get seconds in breakaways.
On the other hand for Machado it'll be GT debut, he doesn't have experience like Roche but he looks like GT rider more than Roche who's imo better for hilly classics and weeklong races like Paris-Nice

 

[Parrulo]

Are you about Vuelta a Catalunya? In my opinion it's more likely that Roche finished Vuelta a Espana in top 7
It was 5th GT for Roche, and second good result at Vuelta (he finished 13th in 2008). There are also: 22th (2009) and 15th (2010) at TDF and 122th at 2007 Giro. The only thing that makes his 2010 Vuelta special is how he gained this result. He was 6th at Bola del Mundo, but didn't get seconds in breakaways.
On the other hand for Machado it'll be GT debut, he doesn't have experience like Roche but he looks like GT rider more than Roche who's imo better for hilly classics and weeklong races like Paris-Nice

a small mistake. anyway you said it yourself he looks like a better GT rider then nico roche. also i did say top 15 since he needs more experience. still he did plenty of voltas and the volta is one of the best step up races to GT's.

 

[Libertine Seguros]

I hope Hog beat some sense into him.. His palmáres is about 10x as sparse as it could be rich because of those stupid tactics. Typical self sabotage and someone who is pleased with 4th. The other teams just must just grin to themselves as they put two roulleurs on the front to catch him with 3k's to go.

He's been a team leader since for ever so he's probably missing a lot of understanding of other aspect of how to win races rather than "pedal harder, faster!".

Those attacks aren't beautiful cycling.. beautiful would be if he won something with his brain!

You're right. He's a good time triallist, why does he try to animate races and win races and surprise people? He should just do a good TT and then sit on people's wheels until the last 500m of every mountain stage.

That will be really exciting.

 

[kurtinsc]

You're right. He's a good time triallist, why does he try to animate races and win races and surprise people? He should just do a good TT and then sit on people's wheels until the last 500m of every mountain stage.

That will be really exciting.

What's better for a cyclist personally... being exciting... or being boring with better results?

I know fans like attacking... but if the result of your attacking is a boat load of failure, while riding conservative gives you success... should a rider attack?

 

[Barrus]

What's better for a cyclist personally... being exciting... or being boring with better results?

I know fans like attacking... but if the result of your attacking is a boat load of failure, while riding conservative gives you success... should a rider attack?

The problem is that that most often also does not lead to success, it least to a predictable and boring top 10 finish and nothing more

Nut wasn't Machado also the guy in the latest Classica San Sebastian where he sat up just to attack for a fourth place? If he is, he is already spoiled by Bruyneel

 

[theyoungest]

The problem is that that most often also does not lead to success, it least to a predictable and boring top 10 finish and nothing more

Nut wasn't Machado also the guy in the latest Classica San Sebastian where he sat up just to attack for a fourth place? If he is, he is already spoiled by Bruyneel

No, that was Zubeldia. But frankly Machado hasn't really caught my attention this season... the kamikaze part already beaten out of him?

 

[Barrus]

No, that was Zubeldia. But frankly Machado hasn't really caught my attention this season... the kamikaze part already beaten out of him?

Aah perhaps there is still a chance for Machado than

 

[Kvinto]

Yea, it will be very exciting to watch a GT when all riders with tt level a bit more than average would ride the race, the way Leipheimer or M.Rogers does

 

[kurtinsc]

The problem is that that most often also does not lead to success, it least to a predictable and boring top 10 finish and nothing more

Nut wasn't Machado also the guy in the latest Classica San Sebastian where he sat up just to attack for a fourth place? If he is, he is already spoiled by Bruyneel

Suicide attacks rarely lead to even top 10 finishes. They often turn a top 10 into a finish of 35th or so.

They might make races more exciting... but what's better for a rider's career being an exciting attacking rider with lots of finishes outside of the top 20... or being a boring rider with a lot of top 10's?

I like watching guys attack as well... but I understand them riding more conservatively in order to up their results. I imagine that ups their pay-scale as well.

 

[Libertine Seguros]

Suicide attacks rarely lead to even top 10 finishes. They often turn a top 10 into a finish of 35th or so.

They might make races more exciting... but what's better for a rider's career being an exciting attacking rider with lots of finishes outside of the top 20... or being a boring rider with a lot of top 10's?

I like watching guys attack as well... but I understand them riding more conservatively in order to up their results. I imagine that ups their pay-scale as well.

How many people would have heard of Amets Txurruka if he'd not been so suicidal? He'd have probably managed a finish of around 20th-30th at GTs, and be anonymous. Instead, he's a cult figure and hugely popular. If Rinaldo Nocentini hadn't dared to dream he'd never have got a week in yellow. If he rode conservatively to try and get a good GC position he wouldn't have finished any higher than he did anyway, and he wouldn't have had a week in yellow, which is much higher exposure than riding around in the first group behind the heads of state.

Also, sponsors love a guy that will get them lots of exposure. Paolo Tiralongo had a great ride at the 2009 Vuelta, and finished 7th overall. But we barely saw him all race. Johnny Hoogerland finished 12th, and we saw a lot of him. Tommy Voeckler can command more from sponsors than many riders who have better stage racing records than him, for this reason.

 

[Matthijs]

exposure can be a reason for better contracs I presume. Especially if it's combined with showing some strength. The end of the top 10 is in most races not so interesting for showing of to the public. But just like attacking, a good placing can grow expectations with the teamleaders = a better contract.
I think for the sponsor attacking is on the short term better. But on the long term maybe good results are better for the rider/team and sponsor.

 

[kurtinsc]

How many people would have heard of Amets Txurruka if he'd not been so suicidal? He'd have probably managed a finish of around 20th-30th at GTs, and be anonymous. Instead, he's a cult figure and hugely popular. If Rinaldo Nocentini hadn't dared to dream he'd never have got a week in yellow. If he rode conservatively to try and get a good GC position he wouldn't have finished any higher than he did anyway, and he wouldn't have had a week in yellow, which is much higher exposure than riding around in the first group behind the heads of state.

Also, sponsors love a guy that will get them lots of exposure. Paolo Tiralongo had a great ride at the 2009 Vuelta, and finished 7th overall. But we barely saw him all race. Johnny Hoogerland finished 12th, and we saw a lot of him. Tommy Voeckler can command more from sponsors than many riders who have better stage racing records than him, for this reason.

There's definitely a line.

20th-30th? Yeah, nobody would care about that too much, so go ahead an animate the race. You might get lucky (like Nocentini) and hit it big.

A top 10 ride just seems a bit different. I look at someone like Zubeldia who's win in l'ain was his first stage race win since 2000, and only the second of his career. He's only had a four wins of stages or 1-day races in his career.

But he's good a very good reputation and lot of solid finishes. 4th in San Sebastian, six top 15 finishes in GT's, 2nd in Dauphine, 3rd in Catalunya... solid results from riding fairly conservative.

Would he have done better by riding aggressive, getting worse overall results but having a reputation for suicide attacks? I really don't think so. He wasn't going to win those races regardless, but a long track record of top 10 and top 15 finishes at GT's probably did a lot more for his reputation and earning potential then entertaining attacks that would have mostly resulted in failure would have.