Percentage of ProTour riders clean 2011 season

[Dallas_]

Please vote above: Percentage of ProTour riders clean 2011 season?

Being a member on this forum, I have realized there is maybe a wide range of opinions on how clean the peloton is.

Is the combination of the Bio Passport and testing for substances such as EPO, having a positive effect on the ProTour Peloton?
Are the euro pros in 2011 entering a much cleaner peloton? I hope so

The results could prove interesting!
cheers

 

[Elverde]

Please vote above: Percentage of ProTour riders clean 2011 season?

This forum is supposed to be used to discuss cycle racing, the vast majority of messages refer to doping in some way or another. Why? Are you all of such limited intelligence that you can see no further than scandals. What pathetic life styles you must lead. From their tone, most of the letters appear to have been written by people with no knowledge or experience of cycle racing. Why do you not get back to your televisions for your soap operas and to your gossip-mongering newspapers.
Nobody who has experience of cycle racing denies the doping problem, but it is not helped by small minded agitators.
I personally think that the clinic should be closed down.

 

[Cobblestoned]

Optimistic choice of poll-options %, although you noticed the wide range opinions.

Can't vote my 5-10 % and don't want to vote the option "less 80 %". Too far away.

 

[rhubroma]

Please vote above: Percentage of ProTour riders clean 2011 season?

This forum is supposed to be used to discuss cycle racing, the vast majority of messages refer to doping in some way or another. Why? Are you all of such limited intelligence that you can see no further than scandals. What pathetic life styles you must lead. From their tone, most of the letters appear to have been written by people with no knowledge or experience of cycle racing. Why do you not get back to your televisions for your soap operas and to your gossip-mongering newspapers.
Nobody who has experience of cycle racing denies the doping problem, but it is not helped by small minded agitators.
I personally think that the clinic should be closed down.

So you are a fascist?

 

[Andynonomous]

Because PERFORMANCE ENHANCING substances enhance performance, it is likely that the highest finishing racers have the highest rate of doping. My opinion is that a better question to ask is "what percentage of the riders who finish in the top 25 of any major long distance race in 2011 are likely doping ?".

In that case, I am quite sure the number is well above 50%.

 

[Barrus]

Shouldn't there also be an option I don't know. As I don't know the exact number, but I think it will be above the 50% mark of riders that are doping. Also if you don't want to discuss doping, don't venture in the clinic

 

[Hugh Januss]

Optimistic choice of poll-options %, although you noticed the wide range opinions.

Can't vote my 5-10 % and don't want to vote the option "less 80 %". Too far away.

Agreed but I went ahead and voted since 5-10% is "less than 80%".
I believe the Passport has reduced the doping benefit, but not enough yet to make winning clean a real possibility.
They are winning "cleaner", But Clean? No way.

 

[Hugh Januss]

So you are a fascist?

No, just an idiot.

 

[red_flanders]

This forum is supposed to be used to discuss cycle racing, the vast majority of messages refer to doping in some way or another. Why? Are you all of such limited intelligence that you can see no further than scandals. What pathetic life styles you must lead. From their tone, most of the letters appear to have been written by people with no knowledge or experience of cycle racing. Why do you not get back to your televisions for your soap operas and to your gossip-mongering newspapers.
Nobody who has experience of cycle racing denies the doping problem, but it is not helped by small minded agitators.
I personally think that the clinic should be closed down.

Funny, my impression is that the people who actually know WTF is going on have been on the forefront of speaking the truth about cycling, and that group includes a lot of former racers, as well as long-time, knowledgable fans from both old and new cycling nations.

What you don't see here are those who are forced to suck at the teat of the big lie, like the U.S. local bike shop owners with Armstrong plastered all over their walls, the Oakley/Trek/Bontrager employees of the world, the riders, the PR hacks and so on...

Nope, not too many of those people in the clinic discussing the truth of the matter. The last to see what's been happening have inevitably been newcomers to the sport, who haven't yet had enough time to see all the warts and decide to follow anyway.

What's your background? You're certainly a fail at characterizing those who write here. I'd hate to make the same mistake about you, so maybe you could tell us why you have such a backwards, opposite view of what's really happening here. I don't think doublespeak is too strong a term for the highlighted above.

 

[Darryl Webster]

Funny, my impression is that the people who actually know WTF is going on have been on the forefront of speaking the truth about cycling, and that group includes a lot of former racers, as well as long-time, knowledgable fans from both old and new cycling nations.

What you don't see here are those who are forced to suck at the teat of the big lie, like the U.S. local bike shop owners with Armstrong plastered all over their walls, the Oakley/Trek/Bontrager employees of the world, the riders, the PR hacks and so on...

Nope, not too many of those people in the clinic discussing the truth of the matter. The last to see what's been happening have inevitably been newcomers to the sport, who haven't yet had enough time to see all the warts and decide to follow anyway.

What's your background? You're certainly a fail at characterizing those who write here. I'd hate to make the same mistake about you, so maybe you could tell us why you have such a backwards, opposite view of what's really happening here. I don't think doublespeak is too strong a term for the highlighted above.

Spot on Flanderd..I`ve been a cyclist since the age of 8 years old..im now 48. The only years my interest vanished were the Armstrong years so obvious was the scam.

PS...at based on my own experiance and being amongst the mind set of elite althletes, in one form or another I`ve gone for 85%...however I personaly make a very big distinction between the effectivness of drugs on the list and believe penatlies should reflect this. Currently I dont think they realy do and theres a definate question mark as to why some substances are even on the list.
The bio passport , though I think concieved with good intentions, is legaly flawd by the simple fact , as we all know , its extraordanerily difficult to prove a false negative.

 

[The Hitch]

Because PERFORMANCE ENHANCING substances enhance performance, it is likely that the highest finishing racers have the highest rate of doping. My opinion is that a better question to ask is "what percentage of the riders who finish in the top 25 of any major long distance race in 2011 are likely doping ?".

In that case, I am quite sure the number is well above 50%.

I was thinking the same thing.

 

[Dr. Maserati]

This forum is supposed to be used to discuss cycle racing, the vast majority of messages refer to doping in some way or another. Why? Are you all of such limited intelligence that you can see no further than scandals. What pathetic life styles you must lead. From their tone, most of the letters appear to have been written by people with no knowledge or experience of cycle racing. Why do you not get back to your televisions for your soap operas and to your gossip-mongering newspapers.
Nobody who has experience of cycle racing denies the doping problem, but it is not helped by small minded agitators.
I personally think that the clinic should be closed down.

I completely agree.

And if the people in charge at Future Publishing (who appear to think they own the place) refuse to close The Clinic down then they should place it seperatley within the forum and perhaps could highlight the following:

The Clinic is the only place on Cyclingnews where you can discuss doping-related issues. Ask questions, discuss positives or improvements to procedures.

I also share your confusion - I have no idea why more people are not discussing actual 'cycle racing' in the middle of the off season.

 

[hektoren]

Silliest poll ever. IF you mean "how many will ride clean", (with no possible way of knowing for sure) it's think of a number. Any number. Be the least gullible of them all; vote 1%! Be the most gullible and vote for close to a 100%. Who'll know? Nobody'll be right, nobody'll be wrong. Position yourself on this forum! Strike a pose! Be the hardened cynic with a glass of whisky, neat, close at hand, Philip Marlowe-style, that you secretly fantasize about.... Practice the Sean Kelly/LA -mean look! Absolutely hilarious!

If, on the other hand, we're talking percentages of riders from ProTour or Pro Continental/ Continental teams that'll get caught doping in 2011, a sum we can tally up come 2012, it would be interesting, but I gather there are but a few takers in here.

So what is it? Fantasy-world or real-world?

I do realize, of course, that a number of riders will test negative, even though they're PEDalists, but we just won't know how many, so why bother asking? Don't feed the fantasies! Get real!

 

[Dallas_]

Silliest poll ever. IF you mean "how many will ride clean", (with no possible way of knowing for sure) it's think of a number. Any number. Be the least gullible of them all; vote 1%! Be the most gullible and vote for close to a 100%. Who'll know? Nobody'll be right, nobody'll be wrong. Position yourself on this forum! Strike a pose! Be the hardened cynic with a glass of whisky, neat, close at hand, Philip Marlowe-style, that you secretly fantasize about.... Practice the Sean Kelly/LA -mean look! Absolutely hilarious!

If, on the other hand, we're talking percentages of riders from ProTour or Pro Continental/ Continental teams that'll get caught doping in 2011, a sum we can tally up come 2012, it would be interesting, but I gather there are but a few takers in here.

So what is it? Fantasy-world or real-world?

I do realize, of course, that a number of riders will test negative, even though they're PEDalists, but we just won't know how many, so why bother asking? Don't feed the fantasies! Get real!

Silliest thread ever: Agreed This thread is total rubbish guilty as charged.
I may be sanctioned by RFEC
no cheers

 

[Hugh Januss]

I completely agree.

And if the people in charge at Future Publishing (who appear to think they own the place) refuse to close The Clinic down then they should place it seperatley within the forum and perhaps could highlight the following:


I also share your confusion - I have no idea why more people are not discussing actual 'cycle racing' in the middle of the off season.

You're being sarcastic aren't you?

 

[Dallas_]

Please vote above: Percentage of ProTour riders clean 2011 season?

This forum is supposed to be used to discuss cycle racing, the vast majority of messages refer to doping in some way or another. Why? Are you all of such limited intelligence that you can see no further than scandals. What pathetic life styles you must lead. From their tone, most of the letters appear to have been written by people with no knowledge or experience of cycle racing. Why do you not get back to your televisions for your soap operas and to your gossip-mongering newspapers.
Nobody who has experience of cycle racing denies the doping problem, but it is not helped by small minded agitators.
I personally think that the clinic should be closed down.

Elverde

Must agree this thread is a no hoper. If protocols are in place, I would prefer a Mod or Admin flicked the switch. ....just wishing

Apart from that, I cannot see why you are in the Clinic. I have browsed your previous posts and your quote:
from 06-14-10 Thread: Was cycling cleaner 06-08 than 09-10?
Why are you people so obsessed with doping?
Cycle racing has always involved doping, live with it or leave it.

The Clinic is doping related. You obviously have an opinion. Why don't you enter the Clinic and take part in the discussions?

cheers

 

[Alpe d'Huez]

I think the poll misses some details, and probability. For example, if you're saying ALL illegal PEDs, then it's probably something like 1/3rd clean. So the numbers on your chart are flipped. It should have variables the other way around if you ask me. Then again, I'm old and cranky and a lot of people find me jaded when it comes to doping in cycling!

I personally think that the clinic should be closed down.

Okay, I see your point how people are cynical, but seriously, how much time have you actually spent here? How many threads have you actually read? While there are plenty of negatives and accusations, there's actually a great deal of up to the minute information and great detail on here. This information is often used to better understand, and combat doping in the sport.

 

[online-rider]

I think the poll misses some details, and probability. For example, if you're saying ALL illegal PEDs, then it's probably something like 1/3rd clean. So the numbers on your chart are flipped. It should have variables the other way around if you ask me. Then again, I'm old and cranky and a lot of people find me jaded when it comes to doping in cycling!


Okay, I see your point how people are cynical, but seriously, how much time have you actually spent here? How many threads have you actually read? While there are plenty of negatives and accusations, there's actually a great deal of up to the minute information and great detail on here. This information is often used to better understand, and combat doping in the sport.

Thats just what I think. It seems unfeasible that 80 % of the peleton could be clean now, in the past, or in the forseeable future.

 

[python]

let’s assume there is that super informed person, the only person who is super well connected…. to pro riders, to tester, to uci-sters and the like…and what does that person know about the incidence of doping ? and if the person knows, then with what accuracy ?


that hypothetical ‘he or she’ would be 99.9% more credible than 99.9% users here…

and even then that person can only begin guessing with very loose level of confidence.

i get a good laugh reading how easy it is to make the 5% distinction.

no wonder fiction genre beats documentary every time…

long live dreaming !!

but..it's snowing here and i'd rather wax my skis

 

[Elverde]

Funny, my impression is that the people who actually know WTF is going on have been on the forefront of speaking the truth about cycling, and that group includes a lot of former racers, as well as long-time, knowledgable fans from both old and new cycling nations.

What you don't see here are those who are forced to suck at the teat of the big lie, like the U.S. local bike shop owners with Armstrong plastered all over their walls, the Oakley/Trek/Bontrager employees of the world, the riders, the PR hacks and so on...

Nope, not too many of those people in the clinic discussing the truth of the matter. The last to see what's been happening have inevitably been newcomers to the sport, who haven't yet had enough time to see all the warts and decide to follow anyway.

What's your background? You're certainly a fail at characterizing those who write here. I'd hate to make the same mistake about you, so maybe you could tell us why you have such a backwards, opposite view of what's really happening here. I don't think doublespeak is too strong a term for the highlighted above.

My background, I raced for 9 years as an amateur, 4 years as an indepenent and 6 years as a professional. Most of my racing was done in UK but I did spend fairly long periods in France and Belgium when I was an amateur. I saw lots of doping during the whole of my racing career (not as sophisticated as todays stuff, mainly amphetamines) and I am 100% against doping. The reason that I wrote was because it is my belief that discussing it here does not help, what we need is an organisation that chases dopers out of the sport, something like the UCI but with teeth and no corruption.
I would also say to Hugh Janus - How can someone who choses a name like that call me an idiot?

 

[Monte Zoncolon]

My background, I raced for 9 years as an amateur, 4 years as an indepenent and 6 years as a professional Most of my racing was done in UK but I did spend fairly long periods in France and Belgium when I was an amateur. I saw lots of doping during the whole of my racing career and I am 100% against doping

Well done sir, Chapeau

 

[Darryl Webster]

Please vote above: Percentage of ProTour riders clean 2011 season?

This forum is supposed to be used to discuss cycle racing, the vast majority of messages refer to doping in some way or another. Why? Are you all of such limited intelligence that you can see no further than scandals. What pathetic life styles you must lead. From their tone, most of the letters appear to have been written by people with no knowledge or experience of cycle racing. Why do you not get back to your televisions for your soap operas and to your gossip-mongering newspapers.
Nobody who has experience of cycle racing denies the doping problem, but it is not helped by small minded agitators.
I personally think that the clinic should be closed down.

If your am X pro Elvarde why not use your real name?.

 

[Elverde]

If your am X pro Elvarde why not use your real name?.

Darryl, I remember you, you were a star, if I had been as good as you I would have used my real name.

 

[Darryl Webster]

Darryl, I remember you, you were a star, if I had been as good as you I would have used my real name.

Im not sure about that...I was only a pro for two years..and saw enough doping, race fixing/ collusion , nepatism and downright ugliness to convince me I wanted no further part.
Obviously you see it through differant eyes?

 

[Hugh Januss]

My background, I raced for 9 years as an amateur, 4 years as an indepenent and 6 years as a professional. Most of my racing was done in UK but I did spend fairly long periods in France and Belgium when I was an amateur. I saw lots of doping during the whole of my racing career (not as sophisticated as todays stuff, mainly amphetamines) and I am 100% against doping. The reason that I wrote was because it is my belief that discussing it here does not help, what we need is an organisation that chases dopers out of the sport, something like the UCI but with teeth and no corruption.
I would also say to Hugh Janus - How can someone who choses a name like that call me an idiot?

That is a very good idea, let's all sit quietly and passively by and see if such an organization materializes.
My user name is meant to be humorous, your comment about closing the clinic because you don't like what is discussed there is just plain stoopid.