Proof of government doping program in Russia

Apr 20, 2009
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According to the Dutch news broadcaster NOS, there will be a documentary on the German ARD on Wednesday. The German journalist who uncovered the use of Full Size MGF and xenon-gas was approached by whistle blowers after those revelations. He now has proof that the Russian anti-doping bureau, the Moscow laboratory and the organisations for various sports are involved.

Dutch source:

http://nos.nl/artikel/2006890-ard-schokkende-onthullingen-over-doping-in-rusland.html

German source (probably the original):

http://www.sportschau.de/doping/interview-hajo-seppelt-geheimsache-doping100.html
 
Sep 29, 2012
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I heard a 3rd hand rumour that the Russian blood profiles were all over the shop. This could be very interesting.
 
Apr 20, 2009
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I wonder if we have any German posters who can watch this for us and give us the highlights in real time. My German is just good enough to order food on holiday, but not to follow an in depth discussion on doping.
 
Sep 25, 2009
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this is NOT news. nor is it remotely accurate.

rather a typical media hype to SELL something as news about an easily demonizable target.

several posters, including one of my recent posts in the xc skiing doping thread related an insider info. specifically, i have alluded to the high likelihood of the russians using the gases to get an edge...

the 'unfortunate' fact was that the use was NOT illegal under the WADA rules in effect then.

NOW, it is.

big deal ? yes and no, b/c everything scientific i was able to find is pointing to a very minor effect compared to epo, yet likely sufficient against anyone
NOT using the stuff.
 
Aug 13, 2009
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Hajo Seppelt has broke many big stories of doping in sport. He uncovered Contador's positive when the UCI was trying to keep it quite. He uncovered a lot of the details of Fuentes operation, including his German transfusion tech, Markus Choina. He also did a big expose on the doping of Kenyan distance runners

This will likely be big news
 
Jul 11, 2013
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Thanks, interesting stuff..

Here is Google translate's take on it:

Seppelt - "Scandalous doping in Russia"

"Top secret doping - As Russia makes its winner" is the new film by Hajo Seppelt, who on Wednesday (12.03.2014, 18.50 clock) runs in first. Seppelt gives an insight into the doping system Russia. "I did not think that there is still a system in 2014, which has so many parallels to what in the GDR was before," says the author.

sportschau.de: Mr. Seppelt, which gave rise to tackle the issue of doping in Russia?

Hajo Seppelt: We have to delve us before the Olympic Winter Games in Sochi for the first time with the doping problem in Russia and are on a time still unknown doping substances (Full Size MGF, editor's note...) Encountered. Also, we have reported on the use of xenon in the Russian elite sport in many athletes. This meant that suddenly people reported after the games with me and I wanted to report a much greater degree of doping in Russia. Thus began research in March. That the story would evolve so, I could not expect at the time. We must assume that in Russia a state-supported doping system is with a big cover-up machine that pulls the strings in the background.

Anyone who has registered with you?

Seppelt: They were courageous whistleblowers that significant risks are discussed in order to make us the doping system explained. They told incomprehensible and provided evidence in image, sound and text.

They also spoke with Russian athletes and coaches. How this came about interviews?

Seppelt: I am back and traveled across Russia. Some wanted to talk openly, some did not dare for fear. Some have also said that they are intimidated and threatened. About Doping in Russia to speak, is dangerous. The few brave ones who veer and talk, have painted a shocking picture of the realities in the Russian elite sport.

It was at the Olympic Winter Games in Sochi not a single positive doping test of Russian athletes. What is the relationship of this finding is to what you have researched?

Seppelt: The facade has little to do with the reality of something. In our film, you will see that both the Russian Anti-Doping Agency and the Doping Control Laboratory in Moscow and sporting organizations operate all obviously a system for the protection of national interests and the cover-up of doping to a significant extent seems to serve. There are so many checks in Russia than in any other country - in my view just window dressing.

They have also been investigated for doping in Kenya and China, Mexico and Belarus. For five years running their documentation under the label of "top secret doping" in the ARD. Can you ever have something shocking in terms of doping?

Seppelt: I did not think that there is still a system in 2014, which has so many parallels to what was formerly in the GDR and certainly is not a part of the heritage of the Soviet Union. All this is topped with capitalist characteristics of a commercialized elite sport that exists naturally in Russia

How important are sports achievements in these times for the Putin regime?

Seppelt: Sport is in Russia under full control of the government, the Ministry of Sports. As in any country that has to build on it to increase the image and prestige in the world of sport is an ideal instrument for self-marketing. That is why sport plays a significant role in Russia, it seeing that the Olympic Winter Games have been considered a status symbol and Russia has become the host of the World Cup 2018. I think Putin has like no other recognized in the world, as you can make it through sports policy. The dark side trying to keep it under a cover. But this is like a powder keg that must eventually explode.
 
python said:
the 'unfortunate' fact was that the use was NOT illegal under the WADA rules in effect then.

NOW, it is.
That's actually an arguable* point. The gases have been named as examples in current lists, yes, but the class of aids (HIF activators) was there before.


* as in lots of highly paid lawyers appealing all the way to CAS expensively arguable
 
Dec 7, 2010
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Aapjes said:
I wonder if we have any German posters who can watch this for us and give us the highlights in real time.
And to think that some folks supported Foxxy being banned. :(



mrhender said:
Here is Google translate's take on it:
Thanks for that.

Although I find it hard to believe that a country like Russia would be involved in any sort of sporting deception that was in any way associated with the Olympics. :eek:
 
Mar 13, 2009
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Granville57 said:
And to think that some folks supported Foxxy being banned. :(



Thanks for that.

Although I find it hard to believe that a country like Russia would be involved in any sort of sporting deception that was in any way associated with the Olympics. :eek:
who hosted the last olympics?

did they have a record haul?
 
Oct 16, 2010
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Could political motives have interfered here?

Why isn't Hajo looking at his own?
There's enough (anti)doping scandal to be found in Germany, with both German ADA and the government getting involved to cover up a recent report on widespread doping in Germany.

Also note that this comes shortly after the German government approved a new anti-doping law.

There's a bit of a "anglosaxons and germans don't dope" smell to this.
 
Lets try to stay on topic and not have the usual suspects trying to make it about something that it isn't.

The junior track champs, held in Portugal these past few years are a real eye opener, in terms of the Russian athletes.
Physical development? Not normal.

Victoria Baranova got her best (and only) big results there. Otherwise ordinary.
 
sniper said:
Could political motives have interfered here?

Why isn't Hajo looking at his own?
There's enough (anti)doping scandal to be found in Germany, with both German ADA and the government getting involved to cover up a recent report on widespread doping in Germany.

Also note that this comes shortly after the German government approved a new anti-doping law.

There's a bit of a "anglosaxons and germans don't dope" smell to this.
Erm, he got Russian whistleblowers? It's mentioned in this very thread?

You can't conjure up German whistleblowers out of thin air, you know.
 
Oct 16, 2010
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hrotha said:
Erm, he got Russian whistleblowers? It's mentioned in this very thread?

You can't conjure up German whistleblowers out of thin air, you know.
conjure what?
politics and sports correlate, you know.
i'm not talking about the whistleblowers. Just wondering why he didn't go out and search for scandals in his own country.
Sie haben auch schon zu Doping in Kenia und China, in Mexiko und Weißrussland recherchiert.
now Russia.
What about his own country?

I just read the snippets from the Seppelt interview posted by westerner.
The tenure is that Russia is an old school DDR-like doping country that has discovered how the national economy can benefit from sports results. As if the rest of the west hasn't! Germany just became world champion on bread and water? The hhypocricy here is not small.
 
Sep 29, 2012
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Someone from Russia approached him. What is he meant to do? Ignore the scoop and say

Oh no, that's ok, there might be something new and fresh I can stumble across here at home. Thanks all the same though. I mean. If I do follow your lead and investigate your claims, someone somewhere might think I am being a hypocrite and we can't have that now, can we? Nein.
 
sniper said:
What about his own country?

I just read the snippets from the Seppelt interview posted by westerner.
The tenure is that Russia is an old school DDR-like doping country that has discovered how the national economy can benefit from sports results. As if the rest of the west hasn't! Germany just became world champion on bread and water? The hhypocricy here is not small.
Seppelt has done numerous reports on doping in Germany. I don't think he backs off when it's about the big names. German wikipedia page: http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hajo_Seppelt
 
Oct 16, 2010
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Dear Wiggo said:
Someone from Russia approached him. What is he meant to do? Ignore the scoop and say

Oh no, that's ok, there might be something new and fresh I can stumble across here at home. Thanks all the same though. I mean. If I do follow your lead and investigate your claims, someone somewhere might think I am being a hypocrite and we can't have that now, can we? Nein.
screaming fist said:
Seppelt has done numerous reports on doping in Germany. I don't think he backs off when it's about the big names. German wikipedia page: http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hajo_Seppelt
both fair points.

I just couldn't help noticing that the program comes conveniently short after the Germans passed a new antidoping law.
I wouldn't be surprised to hear that there's been some coordination with Hajo's production team. ARD is state funded after all.

tinfoil hat on:
We know sports results can significantly stimulate a national economy. Perhaps smearing Russia's sports results is more effective than a trade boycot?
 
Oct 16, 2010
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again, very fair points by Dear Wiggo and Screaming Fist.

Otoh,
1. who in his right state of mind and with a desire to live goes traveling through Russia to investigate state sponsored doping?
I think only someone with a good level of protection from above would do that.

2. the recent suppression by government and NADO of a huge and damning report on doping in Germany up to present had all the ingredients of a story that Hajo could pursue. Why didn't he? If he's to convince me that he's not on the German government's bandwagon, I expect some sort of reference to that report in tonight's program.
 
So this journo is part of a conspiracy to paint Russia in a bad light, but you're the one saying he wouldn't be safe investigating there unless he had official protection by his government (and the German secret services, I'd assume)?
 
Oct 16, 2010
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hrotha said:
So this journo is part of a conspiracy to paint Russia in a bad light, but you're the one saying he wouldn't be safe investigating there unless he had official protection by his government (and the German secret services, I'd assume)?
I'm not saying in the sense of claiming anything am I?
I'm having a good time speculating about possible correlations. There might be none, there might be some. It wouldn't surprise me. There is enough scandal to be found in Germany. The German government surpressed a report about widespread doping (a.o. in soccer), then adopted a new antidoping law, and now seem ready to smear Russia over doping.
Again, don't forget ARD is state funded.
 
Sep 29, 2012
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1. A real journalist. Don't let the current crop of cycling "journalist"s fool you into believing that's how it always was or should be.
 
Mar 8, 2010
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Russian corruption at IAAF

good article in L'Equipe today about that for those who can read french
http://www.lequipe.fr/Athletisme/Article/La-federation-russe-aurait-elle-corrompu-l-iaaf-nbsp/34687

Members of the IAAF anti-doping comisssion + experts would have been corrupted to ignore suspicious fake bio-pass data

Any familiar name within the IAAF anti-doping comisssion ? Martial Saugy yes.

But what about another name ...

http://www.iaaf.org/about-iaaf/structure/commissions#iaaf-medical-anti-doping-commission
 
Aug 13, 2009
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screaming fist said:
Seppelt has done numerous reports on doping in Germany. I don't think he backs off when it's about the big names. German wikipedia page: http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hajo_Seppelt
Yup, he targeted Germany for years. He uncovered Fuentes German operation and even found his transfusion doctor who was based there. He did several articles on Telekom, used his connections at the Cologne Lab to break the Coronado positive, and did extensive pieces on Stinkewitz and others.

The guy knows his stuff. Looking forward to hearing what he said
 
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