Recommendations on cyclocross/gravel racer

[richwagmn]

I'm going to build up a cyclocross bike for riding this winter and am looking for some recommendations.

I've got a whole Shimano 6500 group and a spare set of wheels sitting around that need a home.

I'm thinking right now of going with an alloy frame. The bike will face some harsh conditions (sand, salt spray) and can't be cleaned easily after riding in the winter. So...

1) What are some alloy frame recommendations?
2) Cantilever recommendations?
3) What's the largest tire I can stick on a standard road wheel?

 

[LugHugger]

I'm going to build up a cyclocross bike for riding this winter and am looking for some recommendations.

I've got a whole Shimano 6500 group and a spare set of wheels sitting around that need a home.

I'm thinking right now of going with an alloy frame. The bike will face some harsh conditions (sand, salt spray) and can't be cleaned easily after riding in the winter. So...

1) What are some allow frame recommendations?
2) Cantilever recommendations?
3) What's the largest tire I can stick on a standard road wheel?

Guiseppe's your man here. He's got a lovely example of this type of ride. It's posted somewhere on here. My tuppence worth -

1) try a Chinese carbon f&f from somebody like Dengfu Bikes. You should be able to get a F&F delivered price for around $550 to N America
2) Shorty Ultimate's are very nice but pricy. Loads of people ride and race TRP alloy canti's. TRP also make some very nice mini V brakes compatible with road levers.
3) I've raced 34s on standard Mavic rims with no issues.

Bon chance.

EDIT: http://www.bikeman.com always have a good stock of alloy framesets at competitive prices if Chinese carbon doesn't float your boat

 

[42x16ss]

Options could also include a less agressive alloy road bike like a Giant Defy, Cannondale Synapse or Specialized Roubaix. Just be careful to check the tyre clearances.

For best performance with wider tyres, take a look at wider rims such as the Velocity A23. They make a world of difference.

 

[Giuseppe Magnetico]

I'm going to build up a cyclocross bike for riding this winter and am looking for some recommendations.

I've got a whole Shimano 6500 group and a spare set of wheels sitting around that need a home.

I'm thinking right now of going with an alloy frame. The bike will face some harsh conditions (sand, salt spray) and can't be cleaned easily after riding in the winter. So...

1) What are some alloy frame recommendations?
2) Cantilever recommendations?
3) What's the largest tire I can stick on a standard road wheel?

What size bikes do you roll? I may have a frame for you, this one in the pic is FOR SALE. If the wheels you're using are the regular road width 18-19mm wide, you can fit 35c CX tires on them no problem, people have been doing that for eons before the 23mm wide rims that we love so much came around. Canti's suck! Go PAUL MiniMoto, short stack V-brakes.

 

[mewmewmew13]

Sweet bike! I wish is was my size...

 

[Giuseppe Magnetico]

Sweet bike! I wish is was my size...

Maybe so mew, the frame is on the small side 52cm CT-ST/52.5cm effective TT

I'm 6'1" and was able to ride this bike somewhat comfortably with a 130mm stem and a setback post, but it is too small for me in the long run.

 

[Race Radio]

Nice bike GM, which factory did you buy that from? I am thinking of doing a similar build with Campy 10.

These guys had a great group buy last year
http://pedalforce.com/online/

 

[Giuseppe Magnetico]

Nice bike GM, which factory did you buy that from? I am thinking of doing a similar build with Campy 10.

These guys had a great group buy last year
http://pedalforce.com/online/

This is an unpainted with clear coat Trigon XQC01. Same company that produces Pinarello, Merckx. A couple years ago I was sourcing carbon rims through them and decided to do a little experiment making a CX bike into a gravel racer. This bike, the handful of times I rode it, simply gave me some ideas to what I ultimately want to accomplish with a custom build this winter. What I did find is that there are slight advantages to having eurostyle CX bikes, which is what this Trigon is, with high BB's and slack front ends for the more rough and technical style gravel races. Some of these other gravel grinders are much better with more of a traditional road race geometry, I've even raced some of these events on a pure road bike with 28c tires stuffed into it. Really depends on geography. In MN where richwagmn and myself are from, the gravel events run the gamut of terrain and conditions.

 

[Bustedknuckle]

I'm going to build up a cyclocross bike for riding this winter and am looking for some recommendations.

I've got a whole Shimano 6500 group and a spare set of wheels sitting around that need a home.

I'm thinking right now of going with an alloy frame. The bike will face some harsh conditions (sand, salt spray) and can't be cleaned easily after riding in the winter. So...

1) What are some alloy frame recommendations?
2) Cantilever recommendations?
3) What's the largest tire I can stick on a standard road wheel?

Great suggestions here, I second a carbon cross frame from China..it will work fine.

Use Tektro 926 mini Vs..the Pauls and TRPs are nice but GD expensive. When the brake blocks wear out on the 926..replace with Clarks CX brakes/holders..about $20 per bike worth.

A standard road wheel will accept any tire size the frame will handle.

 

[Race Radio]

This is an unpainted with clear coat Trigon XQC01. Same company that produces Pinarello, Merckx. A couple years ago I was sourcing carbon rims through them and decided to do a little experiment making a CX bike into a gravel racer. This bike, the handful of times I rode it, simply gave me some ideas to what I ultimately want to accomplish with a custom build this winter. What I did find is that there are slight advantages to having eurostyle CX bikes, which is what this Trigon is, with high BB's and slack front ends for the more rough and technical style gravel races. Some of these other gravel grinders are much better with more of a traditional road race geometry, I've even raced some of these events on a pure road bike with 28c tires stuffed into it. Really depends on geography. In MN where richwagmn and myself are from, the gravel events run the gamut of terrain and conditions.

was it the different dimensions that led you to use such a small frame? a 52 for a 6'1" guys seems tiny, even for me. I am 6' and run a 54 with an 110 stem.

 

[LugHugger]

was it the different dimensions that led you to use such a small frame? a 52 for a 6'1" guys seems tiny, even for me. I am 6' and run a 54 with an 110 stem.

Is that for your road set up? A very general rule for setting up a cross bike is to drop 2cms from your effective t/t measurement. I've heard loads of reasons for this ranging from reduction in lower back stress through to a more heads up position with supposedly better depth of field perception when cross racing.

 

[TexPat]

I've been using an old school geometry ss cross bike with little bb drop for rides like that for ten years, and race it in the winter cross series as well (have even raced it in several mtb events). Last week I organised a 100mile gravel ride near here and rode the old trusty. It's great. I'm accustomed to the handling, but a lower bb is better, which most modern cx bikes have.
However, the gravel specific bikes by companies like Salsa take it a step further and lengthen the wheelbase a tad for stability and have a lower bb. I agree with the design.
Just got a Ritchey Swiss Cross, which I'll use for the same purposes, and to stroke my ego a little more by potentially enabling me to narrow the gap between myself and the young fellows---by having more than one gear. Its geo is midway between my old schooler and the shorter lower modern race cx bikes, which I expect to be ideal for me anyway. Will let you know. It's spring here and I've got another longer gravel suffer fest in the works in early November.
As far as brakes go--and I realise that many will disagree--cantis work fine, if you use the right ones and set them up properly. I've never felt that I'd go better with more brake. V Brakes reduce mud clearance and often rub the rim.
Shimano R550s are the best I've used.

 

[avanti]

I'm going to build up a cyclocross bike for riding this winter and am looking for some recommendations.
...............................

Is this for racing or just general riding?

I thought a CX bike would be great for general winter or dirt trail riding so I bought a Fuji CX frame and built it up using various other components including Conti Speed CX tires. But the bike did not work for me. The bike rides great on finished roads and grass, but is too lively for other riding conditions. I'm ready to strip it down and sell frame on ebay.
[For winter and trail riding I bought a new, but 2 two year old, Cannondale Quick with flat bars - a little different than my road and track bikes but it works for me. Incidentally I've seen CX racers using flat bars.]

 

[richwagmn]

Maybe so mew, the frame is on the small side 52cm CT-ST/52.5cm effective TT

I'm 6'1" and was able to ride this bike somewhat comfortably with a 130mm stem and a setback post, but it is too small for me in the long run.

That'd be small for me too. But thanks for the suggestions.

 

[Giuseppe Magnetico]

was it the different dimensions that led you to use such a small frame? a 52 for a 6'1" guys seems tiny, even for me. I am 6' and run a 54 with an 110 stem.

I bought the frame with every intention of selling it later. I usually ride 56cm for CX and 58 on the road. The front end of this thing is what I wanted to put to the test on the gravel. The custom project this winter will have a slightly more aggressive road style front end and a mid 40's fork rake. I'm actually thinking traditional triangle as well for more compliance on the gravel roads.

 

[Giuseppe Magnetico]

I've been using an old school geometry ss cross bike with little bb drop for rides like that for ten years, and race it in the winter cross series as well (have even raced it in several mtb events). Last week I organised a 100mile gravel ride near here and rode the old trusty. It's great. I'm accustomed to the handling, but a lower bb is better, which most modern cx bikes have.
However, the gravel specific bikes by companies like Salsa take it a step further and lengthen the wheelbase a tad for stability and have a lower bb. I agree with the design.
Just got a Ritchey Swiss Cross, which I'll use for the same purposes, and to stroke my ego a little more by potentially enabling me to narrow the gap between myself and the young fellows---by having more than one gear. Its geo is midway between my old schooler and the shorter lower modern race cx bikes, which I expect to be ideal for me anyway. Will let you know. It's spring here and I've got another longer gravel suffer fest in the works in early November.
As far as brakes go--and I realise that many will disagree--cantis work fine, if you use the right ones and set them up properly. I've never felt that I'd go better with more brake. V Brakes reduce mud clearance and often rub the rim.
Shimano R550s are the best I've used.

I also agreed with the design of the Warbird up until I noticed they routed the cables underneath the TT, dropping the ball on many people, including the OP, looking for a dual purpose bike that can be used for both gravel and CX races. And PF30 BB? Not, no way! The cable routing could have been easily been applied to the DT with room to go hydraulic when it eventually becomes the standard without having to buy a new frame. Not thinking ahead IMHO. They did get the geometry right though, basically a road bike with CX clearance.

Mmmm, SwissCross!! Excellent choice! Do you have a site for these gravel events in AUS? Would love to see some.

 

[TexPat]

I also agreed with the design of the Warbird up until I noticed they routed the cables underneath the TT, dropping the ball on many people, including the OP, looking for a dual purpose bike that can be used for both gravel and CX races. And PF30 BB? Not, no way! The cable routing could have been easily been applied to the DT with room to go hydraulic when it eventually becomes the standard without having to buy a new frame. Not thinking ahead IMHO. They did get the geometry right though, basically a road bike with CX clearance.

Mmmm, SwissCross!! Excellent choice! Do you have a site for these gravel events in AUS? Would love to see some.

They had an idea of what would work best for the stated purpose of gravel road racing, and they seem to have created a worthy vehicle. I'm eager to see one in the flesh, of course. As far as I know, there was no plan to make it a do-it-all bike. Don't you think a cx bike does it all anyway?
What's wrong with PF30?

I live in NZ, which stands for New Zealand. It's a nice, civilised, green country 1000km east of Australia. Wouldn't have a clue about what goes on over there; it sounds scary--a lot like Texas. Full of snakes and other mean things.
The events I organise are aimed at the local yokels, friends, and customers. Low-key like the old days. Google will lead you to more info.

 

[Giuseppe Magnetico]

Ha-ha!! The first time I built this frame up it was a 2 speed! Look closely.

 

[Giuseppe Magnetico]

They had an idea of what would work best for the stated purpose of gravel road racing, and they seem to have created a worthy vehicle. I'm eager to see one in the flesh, of course. As far as I know, there was no plan to make it a do-it-all bike. Don't you think a cx bike does it all anyway?
What's wrong with PF30?

I live in NZ, which stands for New Zealand. It's a nice, civilised, green country 1000km east of Australia. Wouldn't have a clue about what goes on over there; it sounds scary--a lot like Texas. Full of snakes and other mean things.
The events I organise are aimed at the local yokels, friends, and customers. Low-key like the old days. Google will lead you to more info.

CX bikes are great do-it-all machines, and I understand Salsa's point is niche. But the mix of CX/gravel bike isn't too far off, hydraulics and electronic will solve the cable routing issues. PF30 is a bearing pressed inside of a sleeve, pressed again into the BB shell. Just a BB30 times another problem. I've seen too many press fit BB's fail much sooner than any outboard, even GXP, SRAM being the originator or PF 30. Maybe King's new push into PF BB's will solve my apprehensions, only time will tell.

Sorry about the country mix up, I know you're from NZ, just been speaking to too many Aussies lately.

 

[TexPat]

CX bikes are great do-it-all machines, and I understand Salsa's point is niche. But the mix of CX/gravel bike isn't too far off, hydraulics and electronic will solve the cable routing issues. PF30 is a bearing pressed inside of a sleeve, pressed again into the BB shell. Just a BB30 times another problem. I've seen too many press fit BB's fail much sooner than any outboard, even GXP, SRAM being the originator or PF 30. Maybe King's new push into PF BB's will solve my apprehensions, only time will tell.

Sorry about the country mix up, I know you're from NZ, just been speaking to too many Aussies lately.

Oddly, it's the outboards that I've had the most problems with (or rather, I've made the most money replacing!) The PF sleeves eliminate the noise emanating from poorly matched bearing casings and/or bb shell dimensions. Seems like a smart approach to me.
Bearing issues are almost entirely due to poor quality balls and/or seals, or poor care.
The weather in this part of the country is often atrocious. I'm pretty sure that I've replaced more drivetrain components, brake pads, cables and bearings in my six years in Wellington than the thirteen previous in TexAss.
Could be a numbers game, but again, the outboard bb's are the worst.

Come to NZ sometime for a bit of gravel and scenery. We'll look after you.

 

[Giuseppe Magnetico]

Oddly, it's the outboards that I've had the most problems with (or rather, I've made the most money replacing!) The PF sleeves eliminate the noise emanating from poorly matched bearing casings and/or bb shell dimensions. Seems like a smart approach to me.
Bearing issues are almost entirely due to poor quality balls and/or seals, or poor care.
The weather in this part of the country is often atrocious. I'm pretty sure that I've replaced more drivetrain components, brake pads, cables and bearings in my six years in Wellington than the thirteen previous in TexAss.
Could be a numbers game, but again, the outboard bb's are the worst.

Come to NZ sometime for a bit of gravel and scenery. We'll look after you.

Watch out, I just might take you up on that!!

 

[TexPat]

Watch out, I just might take you up on that!!

That's what you're missing if you don't.

 

[Benotti69]

That's what you're missing if you don't.

Does he have to dress like a hobbit

 

[Giuseppe Magnetico]

I'm not a religious man, but this is what I think heaven looks like.

That's what you're missing if you don't.

 

[Benotti69]

I'm not a religious man, but this is what I think heaven looks like.

Nah, Middle Earth