Roche/Gadret: polemica in 2011 Tour?

[Splintered]

Inevitably given his performance in the Giro, Gadret might now ride the Tour:

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/lavenu-hopes-gadret-will-ride-tour-de-france

So who'll be the protected rider in Ag2r, Roche or Gadret? This would be interesting even if last year's row hadn't occurred - it's always hard to know what to think about the stragety of having two or more leaders on a grand tour team - but of course it's even spicier in this case, given last year's acrimony. Add to the mix that there are sure to be doubts about the form of each: Roche was injured and had a shakey start to 2011; for his part Gadret will be exhausted after his Giro. Neither will win the Tour, but since they're both up-&-coming riders to watch it's an interesting situation.

Any thoughts? Anyone with inside knowledge?

 

[Hugo Koblet]

Although some riders blossom late in their careers, I wouldn't go as far as calling Gadret an up-and-coming rider given he's already 32 years old.

 

[theyoungest]

Gadret was already quite good in last year's Giro... it didn't garner much attention because he'd already lost half an hour or so in the first week. But in the Tour he wasn't that great, only climbing with the best in the now famous stage where he refused to give his wheel to Roche. I wouldn't expect too much from the guy.

 

[El Pistolero]

If Gadret still has good legs I'd go for him. Roche is a little whining b*tch who you don't notice in a race like the TdF.

 

[Ferminal]

Roche has been preparing for it all year whilst Gadret is coming off that Giro, so Roche should be leader.

H2H at this stage of their careers I think Gadret has a better chance of GC success. Roche will struggle to crack the top 15 in July.

 

[William H]

There's no reason a team shouldn't be able to handle two guys with GC hopes, particularly if they're not really contenders for the win

 

[Moose McKnuckles]

"Let the road decide."

 

[Mellow Velo]

Hopefully, Gadret will be well up on the GC, then have a puncture on a crucial climb.
Whereupon, Roche can simply ignore his pleas for a wheel and ride away!

 

[rxgqgxnyfz]

Or you know, one can be domestique for the other depending who will be stronger (thinking how Gadret finished uber hard Giro, that must to be Nicholas)

Roche was the first congratulating John for his Giro stage win. It's obvious things are swell and dandy by now. You're obviously not seeing the full picture and are judging things just by what you read on internet.

 

[Zinoviev Letter]

Roche was the first congratulating John for his Giro stage win. It's obvious things are swell and dandy by now. You're obviously not seeing the full picture and are judging things just by what you read on internet.

Yes, there's no actual evidence of an ongoing feud and I suspect that Ag2r management would have clamped down hard on any ongoing bickering if there was any sign of it given that they are the two key riders on the team.

If they had realised the form Gadret was going to produce in the Giro, the team would probably have kept his powder dry for the Tour. Getting a frenchman into the top 10 would be a huge deal for a French team. But they didn't, so I doubt if they have any great hopes for him in the GC after the (fantastic) effort he has already put in. There's also the problem that the Tour, while climb-heavy by its own standards, is still weighted more towards Time Trials than the Giro is and Gadret time trials like JRod.

My guess is that if Gadret rides the Tour it will be as a stage hunter with a free role. That's how I'd use him anyway, have him soft pedal most stages, conserve his energy and then have him make a go of it on a handful of target stages.

If Roche doesn't perform well on GC this year, send him to the Giro next year and make Gadret the GC man for the Tour.

 

[PedalCastro]

Gadret will not be able to ride for GC after the Giro, Roche is improving after his poor start to the season. I think (hope) he can top 15 even though his form has not been great. Hopefully he can show some signs of improvement in Dauphine

 

[El Pistolero]

I think a Gadret in his Giro shape could have been 5th or something at the Tour this year. Well if we take out the time trial.

 

[craig1985]

By the sounds of things everything is fine and dandy anyway. And so what? It's no the first somebody has told their co-worker to 'get ****ed'.

 

[Galic Ho]

If Gadret still has good legs I'd go for him. Roche is a little whining b*tch who you don't notice in a race like the TdF.

+1000. Couldn't agree more.

 

[Zinoviev Letter]

+1000. Couldn't agree more.

If Gadret really does have the legs, I'd expect the team to prioritise him because a Frenchman in the top 10 would be a big deal for them. But I don't see how anyone would expect him to have the legs after the Giro. He was markedly worse in the Tour last year than he was in the Giro and as someone has already pointed out, he was a good bit less prominent than Roche.

As for Roche being invisible, he went off the front a couple of times during last year's Tour and even attacked on a mountain top finish in the Vuelta (he didn't get very far, but he did cause Nibali to pop).

He's not a good enough climber to make a habit of attacking the best climbers in the world in the high mountains though, which seems to be about the only thing a few people here consider to be worthwhile. He tries to get in breaks, he not very wisely has a go at sprint points. Riding for GC as a fringe GC man in the Tour isn't a recipe for prominence but he was hardly invisible. He seems to have some punch in the hills, but when it comes to the high mountains he's a steady pace guy.

 

[Midnightfright]

If Gadret really does have the legs, I'd expect the team to prioritise him because a Frenchman in the top 10 would be a big deal for them. But I don't see how anyone would expect him to have the legs after the Giro. He was markedly worse in the Tour last year than he was in the Giro and as someone has already pointed out, he was a good bit less prominent than Roche.

As for Roche being invisible, he went off the front a couple of times during last year's Tour and even attacked on a mountain top finish in the Vuelta (he didn't get very far, but he did cause Nibali to pop).

He's not a good enough climber to make a habit of attacking the best climbers in the world in the high mountains though, which seems to be about the only thing a few people here consider to be worthwhile. He tries to get in breaks, he not very wisely has a go at sprint points. Riding for GC as a fringe GC man in the Tour isn't a recipe for prominence but he was hardly invisible. He seems to have some punch in the hills, but when it comes to the high mountains he's a steady pace guy.

I was about post something similar. Couldn't agree more.

 

[nobilis]

what about JC Péraud? nobody is mentioning him. Is he doing the tour?
He would be a legitimate leader since he's a better TT than both Roche and Gadret and better climber than Roche so he has a real chance of a top 10.

 

[taiwan]

Peraud rode the Vuelta last year, his first GT? Nothing there indicated he'd be capable of a top ten at the Tour.

 

[Ferminal]

He is no chance for a top10. Things looked good at the Vuelta but the three weeks were too much. If Peraud was in form and at the Giro he would have lost a minimum 10' to Gadret over the course of the MTFs.

 

[saganftw]

gadret should pull garzelli in TdF,take mountain jersey and maybe a stage victory,he is not w/o chance against gilbert in hilly stages

lets see how roche rides DL before commenting on his form

 

[El Pistolero]

gadret should pull garzelli in TdF,take mountain jersey and maybe a stage victory,he is not w/o chance against gilbert in hilly stages

lets see how roche rides DL before commenting on his form

Based on what really?
One stage in the Giro? He was good, but let's wait for some more of those results. Giro had 0 puncheurs in it. And Gadret has never performed in a hilly classic.

 

[saganftw]

Based on what really?
One stage in the Giro? He was good, but let's wait for some more of those results. Giro had 0 puncheurs in it. And Gadret has never performed in a hilly classic.

i didnt say hes gonna beat gilbert (i dont expect it anyway),but hes got a chance,gadret can digg deep and push himself,sometimes even the strongest riders cannot win a stage

rodriguez and contador can punch very well btw,they just dont focus on hilly classics

 

[taiwan]

They could leave him out of the Tour squad to avoid polemica, then give he and Peraud a free hand at the Vuelta.

 

[El Pistolero]

i didnt say hes gonna beat gilbert (i dont expect it anyway),but hes got a chance,gadret can digg deep and push himself,sometimes even the strongest riders cannot win a stage

rodriguez and contador can punch very well btw,they just dont focus on hilly classics

Yes, but wouldn't you agree it would be better to do a fresh Vuelta against the same but more tired Gilbert

He already did the Giro while Gilbert is as fresh as a daisy.

 

[saganftw]

Yes, but wouldn't you agree it would be better to do a fresh Vuelta against the same but more tired Gilbert

He already did the Giro while Gilbert is as fresh as a daisy.

depends what do you consider to be better

possible stage victory (mountain jersey?) in TdF as a frenchman in french team...or in vuelta?,if i was DS i would want him to ride TdF even if hes not 100% because if he wont have legs,he can always quit the race...i dont know how he recovers after GT but im guessing Giro,then some rest and TdF as stagehunter is doable