Rowing and cycling

[craig1985]

You know I find it interesting that a lot of rowers and have competed at a high level (Olympics and so on), switch to cycling and have a lot of success. Aussie Cameron Wurf, rode last season for Fuji-Servetto, is an ex-rower, and rode the Australian TT Championships and had a good ride and rode at the Worlds in Germany in 2007. He was a top level rower. Rebecca Romero was a silver medalist for GB at the 2004 Athens Olympics in the women's quadruple sculls, retired in 2006, started cycling and was the British TT champion that year. Now she has a Gold Medal in the Individual Pursuit at the 2008 Beijing Olympics. And just the other day Amber Halliday won the women's TT in the Australian National Championships. She was at the Beijing Olympics for Australia in rowing.

Now just because I put it in the Clinic, doesn't mean that I'm implying all three dope (AFAIK Wurf is not riding for Footon this season), but I'm interested in the link from top level rower, and then become a top level cyclist. Now I should add though, just because somebody has switched sports, doesn't mean they have been successful. Sally Robbins (infamous when stopped rowing for some reason during the Athens Olympics, to which she has been dubbed 'Laydown Sally', look her up on wiki if you want) rode the Australian TT race the other day and came in 6 minutes down in 34th spot. And also that those have changed over are either TT specialists and ride the track.

 

[auscyclefan94]

i think Both cyclists and rowers have high VO2 maxs

 

[Anonymous]

The explosive power in the legs would translate well to shorter track events, where the upper body mass wouldn't be as big a detriment.

 

[karlboss]

Rowers characteristics match cycling pretty closely for TTs and pursuit. I'll be surprised when I see a high level rower climb well. Though, won't be surprised to watch a small guy who almost made it in a boat switch to cycling which will suit him better.

For your info, rowing efforts are around 6-7 minute efforts depending on the discipline, major muscles used are legs and lower back.

 

[Animal]

I'm not surprised at all.

Although rowing events are short compared to road races, the event is powered by aerobic systems, and so the training is mostly endurance training.

I used to do 30 minute sessions on the Concept II every morning as part of my pre-work gym sessions. I've never suffered as much on a turbo trainer compared to attempting to keep the readout at the required power level.

Thr crossover effect is huge. I used to win a fair number of time trials, and I'm positive the intense efforts helped me.

 

[python]

in a sense rowing is a unique sport for humans b/s it requires all four limbs. unlike our 4-legged cousins it’s something we evolved away from.

xc skiing (my favorite) is another 4-limb sport with the similar physiological demands. top xc skiers in nordic countries are/were often top cyclists as well. these two sports require more oxygen than cycling because they stress every major muscle group. Consequently, when an a rower or xc skier switches to cycling or running he/she already have the main prerequisite - huge aerobic capacity. what they lack is cycling muscle specificity development. with time, they get that too. I can personally attest to xc skiing benefits in cycling and running. one year, after a particularly intense and long season of skiing, I broke 3h in a marathon with just 30km/wk running.

 

[Kennf1]

I'm not surprised at all.

Although rowing events are short compared to road races, the event is powered by aerobic systems, and so the training is mostly endurance training.

I used to do 30 minute sessions on the Concept II every morning as part of my pre-work gym sessions. I've never suffered as much on a turbo trainer compared to attempting to keep the readout at the required power level.

Thr crossover effect is huge. I used to win a fair number of time trials, and I'm positive the intense efforts helped me.

I picked up a Concept II a few months ago. It kicks my ****. Good cross training.

 

[Oncearunner8]

in a sense rowing is a unique sport for humans b/s it requires all four limbs. unlike our 4-legged cousins it’s something we evolved away from.

xc skiing (my favorite) is another 4-limb sport with the similar physiological demands. top xc skiers in nordic countries are/were often top cyclists as well. these two sports require more oxygen than cycling because they stress every major muscle group. Consequently, when an a rower or xc skier switches to cycling or running he/she already have the main prerequisite - huge aerobic capacity. what they lack is cycling muscle specificity development. with time, they get that too. I can personally attest to xc skiing benefits in cycling and running. one year, after a particularly intense and long season of skiing, I broke 3h in a marathon with just 30km/wk running.

Just 30k a week, was it all at intensity training (at your threshold)? You must have been in massive condition from the xc skiing. Was sub 3 your goal? What marathon did you break 3 in NYC?

 

[Galic Ho]

You know I find it interesting that a lot of rowers and have competed at a high level (Olympics and so on), switch to cycling and have a lot of success. Aussie Cameron Wurf, rode last season for Fuji-Servetto, is an ex-rower, and rode the Australian TT Championships and had a good ride and rode at the Worlds in Germany in 2007. He was a top level rower. Rebecca Romero was a silver medalist for GB at the 2004 Athens Olympics in the women's quadruple sculls, retired in 2006, started cycling and was the British TT champion that year. Now she has a Gold Medal in the Individual Pursuit at the 2008 Beijing Olympics. And just the other day Amber Halliday won the women's TT in the Australian National Championships. She was at the Beijing Olympics for Australia in rowing.

Now just because I put it in the Clinic, doesn't mean that I'm implying all three dope (AFAIK Wurf is not riding for Footon this season), but I'm interested in the link from top level rower, and then become a top level cyclist. Now I should add though, just because somebody has switched sports, doesn't mean they have been successful. Sally Robbins (infamous when stopped rowing for some reason during the Athens Olympics, to which she has been dubbed 'Laydown Sally', look her up on wiki if you want) rode the Australian TT race the other day and came in 6 minutes down in 34th spot. And also that those have changed over are either TT specialists and ride the track.

First of all. Everyone lay off Sally. Secondly it is all down to physiology. VO2 max is recorded in millilitres per minutre per kilogram. They take your output, multiply by the minutes and divide by the weight (from memory so the specifics might be off). But your overall VO2 aerobic output remains the same. A study (can't remember which) from one of the Nordic nations calculated the odds of nordic distance skiers chances of medalling at the Olympics on V02 aerobic output. They measured it differently, on only the sole kilogram and not the athletes weight. So some had 6.1 litres/kg or as high a volume output as 6.4l/kg. Either way enough to win a gold medal. When put in the ml/min/kg format that is in the 90 range. Rowers are the same. Their outputs are very high, so they have the capacity to be bike riders. All they need to do to have high traditional score is to drop the weight. Output (the engine) stays the same), but the chassis and style improve. With the natural high cardiovascular output if they decrease their weight (upper body muscle and body fat) they increase their VO2 max in ml/min/kg. Engine stays the same, they just go faster on a bike. Simple really.

 

[GratefulDead]

I remember seeing Redgrave rowing a 110Kg barbell for 8 reps, perfect form... Crazy strength, huge guy...

 

[row4free]

I've been rowing for 7 years, the last 4 at national level and the last 2 trying to get a gig on the national team. Rowers typically spend around 20-24 hours a week training, most of this purely aerobic with the inclusion of some strength and power work. As mentioned earlier in this thread, races last 6 to 7 min but the bulk of our training is base aerobic. Hence the ability to mix it with club cyclists on long training rides.

As for the size of rowers, there are 2 divisions - heavyweight and leightweight. Drew Ginn and Rebecca Romero members of the former and Cameron Wurf and Amber Halliday the latter. Top Lightweight males are typically around 6 foot tall and max 70kg with specific aerobic capacity well over 70ml/kg/min. So theres no reason why the lighter rowers can't climb. In my opinion TT's suit rowers because of their mental capacity to sit and grind away for km upon km.

There is a rower from GB with a aerobic capacity of around 10 litres/min!

 

[spike61]

rowing as an "extreme" sport!

Having rowed for 5 years, in college and then training towards making the National Team back in the 80's, I can attest to the intensity of the training. Running tours of Harvard stadium (double height and width stairs) working with weights in the boathouse- heavy, medium and lightweight sessions to stretch muscle capacity. Grueling sessions on the river in intense cold in the spring/fall, heat in the summer. My coach used to say that at 1000 meters of a 1500 meter race (which is what women's races were then) you "see God". We would go out on our bikes for 50 to 70 miles on our day off to get a rest and some different scenery. Constant competition both outside the team and within. Back then we didn't know about "overtraining" and two weeks before Nat.Team tryouts, I decided that I wasn't where I wanted to be mentally and physically, and gave it all up. 5 years of every day working and suffering to be just a little faster.

So I think, along with VOmax, there is a training to accept intense suffering as normal, a training of the mind that makes or breaks an athelete...especially someone who races. Rowers had a rep then, and maybe still, of thriving on excess...and if one was to be successful, one whittled down those excesses to (mostly) the positive ones!

20 years later I decided to race my mountainbike locally in a NORBA series. I came in second in my class (I missed a couple of races) right away not, I believe because I had a great VOmax, or fly skills on a bike, but I knew how to train my body to race and suffer, and now, have a lot of fun doing it!

 

[Galic Ho]

I've been rowing for 7 years, the last 4 at national level and the last 2 trying to get a gig on the national team. Rowers typically spend around 20-24 hours a week training, most of this purely aerobic with the inclusion of some strength and power work. As mentioned earlier in this thread, races last 6 to 7 min but the bulk of our training is base aerobic. Hence the ability to mix it with club cyclists on long training rides.

As for the size of rowers, there are 2 divisions - heavyweight and leightweight. Drew Ginn and Rebecca Romero members of the former and Cameron Wurf and Amber Halliday the latter. Top Lightweight males are typically around 6 foot tall and max 70kg with specific aerobic capacity well over 70ml/kg/min. So theres no reason why the lighter rowers can't climb. In my opinion TT's suit rowers because of their mental capacity to sit and grind away for km upon km.

There is a rower from GB with a aerobic capacity of around 10 litres/min!

Drew Ginn's VO2 max is 67ml/min/kg.

Also states Simon Gerrans is 80ml/min/kg.

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/faster-higher-stronger/story-e6frf9if-1225699078722

 

[Big GMaC]

Drew Ginn's VO2 max is 67ml/min/kg.

Also states Simon Gerrans is 80ml/min/kg.

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/faster-higher-stronger/story-e6frf9if-1225699078722

Drew is a Heavyweight rower, the guy you were replying to was talking of Lightweights having higher VO2 maxes because the weight limit means that those at the top of the sport need more aerobic ability to succeed, Heavyweights can get away with having greater musculature and power

 

[auscyclefan94]

First of all. Everyone lay off Sally. Secondly it is all down to physiology. VO2 max is recorded in millilitres per minutre per kilogram. They take your output, multiply by the minutes and divide by the weight (from memory so the specifics might be off). But your overall VO2 aerobic output remains the same. A study (can't remember which) from one of the Nordic nations calculated the odds of nordic distance skiers chances of medalling at the Olympics on V02 aerobic output. They measured it differently, on only the sole kilogram and not the athletes weight. So some had 6.1 litres/kg or as high a volume output as 6.4l/kg. Either way enough to win a gold medal. When put in the ml/min/kg format that is in the 90 range. Rowers are the same. Their outputs are very high, so they have the capacity to be bike riders. All they need to do to have high traditional score is to drop the weight. Output (the engine) stays the same), but the chassis and style improve. With the natural high cardiovascular output if they decrease their weight (upper body muscle and body fat) they increase their VO2 max in ml/min/kg. Engine stays the same, they just go faster on a bike. Simple really.

I was at the VIS (Victorian institute of sport) about a year and a half ago and did a tour there and they basically told me exactly what you said when I asked a question about it.

 

[auscyclefan94]

Drew Ginn's VO2 max is 67ml/min/kg.

Also states Simon Gerrans is 80ml/min/kg.

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/faster-higher-stronger/story-e6frf9if-1225699078722

Evans' is 88. I'm prett sure he still has the record at the AIS for the highest.

 

[auscyclefan94]

Drew is a Heavyweight rower, the guy you were replying to was talking of Lightweights having higher VO2 maxes because the weight limit means that those at the top of the sport need more aerobic ability to succeed, Heavyweights can get away with having greater musculature and power

I remember seeing Sally Robbins in the time trial champs last week. She looked really bulky. Too bulky

Look at this girl. She is HUGE

 

[unsheath]

By God, she's a monster!

Was in a bike store a few months back and Drew Ginn was on the turbo trainer out back. From memory, he was holding 450+ Watts at threshold. Looked pretty comfortable.

On another note, the late Amy Gillett was also a rower come cyclist b4 her life was tragically cut short.

 

[Anonymous]

I remember seeing Sally Robbins in the time trial champs last week. She looked really bulky. Too bulky

Look at this girl. She is HUGE

Bulky girls need love too!

 

[craig1985]

Would seriously not want to get in afight with her.

 

[unsheath]

You're not a feeder are you TFF??

 

[Big GMaC]

I remember seeing Sally Robbins in the time trial champs last week. She looked really bulky. Too bulky

Look at this girl. She is HUGE

Having been rowing domestically and at junior intl level for the last few years, I can say that chubby girls are rather more commonplace than you would think...

 

[53 x 11]

Evans' is 88. I'm prett sure he still has the record at the AIS for the highest.

Nope......Brett Aitkin's was higher (around 90) as was Rohan Dennis. As far as I know Brett's is still the highest, or so he says. Rohan was crapping on about betting the record a few years back but I dont know if he has.

Chris Martin was another rower who made the switch to cycling and is a reasonably good TT'er. He placed 6th at nationals last year against a very strong field compared to this years, raced in Italy for six months. Rowers however do seem to come into cycling with very unrealistic expectations and leave quickly if they don’t succeed or cannot master bunch riding skills. I heard that one former rower said that if he didn't place top three he would pull out of cycling... that's just f-ing stupid from a guy with no team mates riding his first national road race.

 

[blaxland]

Bulky girls need love too!

agreed.....and being australian and following cycling for over 25 years,its funny how most Aussie women cyclists(road/track)always seem to be overweight?what does everyone else think?(Rochelle gilmore is the exception)

 

[blaxland]

I think rowers make good road timetrialers not only because of vo2 max readings but LEVERAGE.Have you ever seen rowers under 6 foot in height?When i was a juinor road rider all the extremely tall kids seemed to have a lot more power then me(5 ft 10)What do you think ?