State of the peloton 2022

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I'm just annoyed with how many people say that today's peloton is cleaner than before when everything hints at the exact opposite. It appears there's a new "generation" of cycling fans coming into the sport, attracted by new riders, who want to believe this. I thought cycling had reached a level of awareness about doping that other sports don't have (minus the Sky fans), but at the moment I don't see this anymore.
 
I'm just annoyed with how many people say that today's peloton is cleaner than before when everything hints at the exact opposite. It appears there's a new "generation" of cycling fans coming into the sport, attracted by new riders, who want to believe this. I thought cycling had reached a level of awareness about doping that other sports don't have (minus the Sky fans), but at the moment I don't see this anymore.
Everything?

Like the zero doping cases there have been in the pro peloton the last many years compared to the almost daily cases that were going on in the early noughties?
 
Everything?

Like the zero doping cases there have been in the pro peloton the last many years compared to the almost daily cases that were going on in the early noughties?
That just means teams and their doctors have worked out how to not trigger adverse findings. Plenty has been written on this including the use of EPO microdosing to fool the ABP.

In the noughties the sport wasn’t as sophisticated.

Then look at climbing times. In this years TdF Pog, Vingo and Thomas climbed the Alpe in 38 minutes which was the fastest in a long time and similar to Floyd 2006. When Thomas won on the Alpe in 2018 he climbed the mountain in about 41 minutes. Also notice how poor Nairo got nabbed at a smaller team who doesn’t have the money and resources to avoid that happening.
 
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That just means teams and their doctors have worked out how to not trigger adverse findings. Plenty has been written on this including the use of EPO microdosing to fool the ABP.

In the noughties the sport wasn’t as sophisticated.

Then look at climbing times. In this years TdF Pog, Vingo and Thomas climbed the Alpe in 38 minutes which was the fastest in a long time and similar to Floyd 2006. When Thomas won on the Alpe in 2018 he climbed the mountain in about 41 minutes. Also notice how poor Nairo got nabbed at a smaller team who doesn’t have the money and resources to avoid that happening.
After consideration I came to the conclusion that I'm not going to engage in a discussion in this hole of the internet. Sorry for having wasted your time.
 
Unfortunately, if anything, anti-doping is only more cynical today, the objective of which isn't to clean up sport, but catch only as many small fish as is necessary to make the naif and distracted public think it is working, without, however, catching too many and certainly not any big fish as to infringe upon revenues and profits. So let's put it this way, in the 90s and early 2000s it was a doping Far West, with controls needing to prevent more deaths and it was necessary to send a message. Today, by contrast, it's all about capitalizing on that sent message, but not rock the boat too much as cycling probably won't survive another Festina or Operacion Puerto or Armstrong scandal. The sport, as far as doping is concerned, is on life probation and anti-doping acts accordingly I think.
 
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Everything?

Like the zero doping cases there have been in the pro peloton the last many years compared to the almost daily cases that were going on in the early noughties?
It's almost like the speed of the peloton dropped when they were catching dopers, and that the speed is high and on the rise again now that they don't.

You get your hands dirty when you clean up something incredibly filthy. Better anti-doping leads to more doping scandals.

You can keep you hands clean if you sweep the filth under the rug, or if you just straight ignore it.

...

Another way to frame it is that you could have made that very same response to the very same statement in 1995. Was a lack of positives back then an indicator of the peloton being cleaner?
 
So let's put it this way, in the 90s and early 2000s it was a doping Far West, with controls needing to prevent more deaths and it was necessary to send a message.
So speaks someone who wasn't there. Or if they were there was too stoned to remember reality. No one was being caught in the 90s. In the noughties, there was no test for the primary doping method of the day. In the 00s it was back to being an IQ test, with the UCI educating riders on how not to get caught.

The authorities in particular never believed there was a link between doping and deaths. The UCI investigated the spate of deaths in in the early 90s and concluded there was nothing going on.
 
An important point to remember about what is happening today is that we have higher thresholds for drugs that used to require a TUE, there is a wider 'grey area' than there has ever been, a semi-legalised arena. Add to that the ABP and its high thresholds and it is harder to the well financed athletes to fall foul of the rules.
 
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So speaks someone who wasn't there. Or if they were there was too stoned to remember reality. No one was being caught in the 90s. In the noughties, there was no test for the primary doping method of the day. In the 00s it was back to being an IQ test, with the UCI educating riders on how not to get caught.

The authorities in particular never believed there was a link between doping and deaths. The UCI investigated the spate of deaths in in the early 90s and concluded there was nothing going on.
You do know what Far West means in this context? Exactly what you alluded to in the absence of effective controls in the 90s. However, while Festina didn't "catch" anyone, it blew the lid off the pot and, while it was coordinated outside anti-doping, it did send a message. It eventually led to investing heavily in a ln EPO test, which led to micro-dosing, better doping, etc. So I was there alright, and for some time before actually.

They knew EPO could kill, when a bunch of Dutch guys died in their sleep and, therafter, from Mr. 60 percent and others getting up in the middle of the night to ride stationary to keep the blood flowing.
 
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An important point to remember about what is happening today is that we have higher thresholds for drugs that used to require a TUE, there is a wider 'grey area' than there has ever been, a semi-legalised arena. Add to that the ABP and its high thresholds and it is harder to the well financed athletes to fall foul of the rules.
So, the less-financed athletes will be fed to the lions (the anti-doping agencies) rather than the well-financed ones, is that what you basically are saying?

Just trying to make sure I understand you, English is my third language, after all. :)
 
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So, the less-financed athletes will be fed to the lions (the anti-doping agencies) rather than the well-financed ones, is that what you basically are saying?

Just trying to make sure I understand you, English is my third language, after all. :)
Doing well for your 3rd language :). Yes what you write is also what I understand. Perhaps this contributed to Quintana getting caught?
 
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Doing well for your 3rd language :). Yes what you write is also what I understand. Perhaps this contributed to Quintana getting caught?
I can't really speak about Quintana fairly because he was one of my fave riders back when he was still young. Have no idea what had happened to his career since because I just didn't have the time to follow it, but yeah, apparently Quintana is being fed to the lions now due to... what exactly is he being popped for? Something that may or may not have been legal at the time?

You may need to refresh (or update) my memory, please. :)
 
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I can't really speak about Quintana fairly because he was one of my fave riders back when he was still young. Have no idea what had happened to his career since because I just didn't have the time to follow it, but yeah, apparently Quintana is being fed to the lions now due to... what exactly is he being popped for? Something that may or may not have been legal at the time?

You may need to refresh (or update) my memory, please. :)
Tramadol
 
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