Tadej Pogacar and Mauro Giannetti

[hrotha]

Unlike Armstrong, Froome, Contador during previous eras when the speculation was accompanied by enough anecdotal evidence to draw your own conclusions if you were bothered or cared enough about doping.

Which just shows how well UAE and Pog have played this from a PR perspective.

Nah I don't think that's UAE, the same can be said about all their competitors. It's been the rule for many years. We're almost completely in the dark largely because that's how things work in the current era. It's something for the State of the Peloton thread, not about Pogačar or UAE specifically.

 

[noob]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1840698202913157156

View: https://x.com/OutOfCycling/status/1840698202913157156


This makes me a bit nauseated tbh

 

[ontheroad]

Nah I don't think that's UAE, the same can be said about all their competitors. It's been the rule for many years. We're almost completely in the dark largely because that's how things work in the current era. It's something for the State of the Peloton thread, not about Pogačar or UAE specifically.

I agree that it's certainly not specific to UAE and I'd say that Jumbo and Sky before them were indeed much more PR conscious in trying to force a certain narrative upon the public. To some extent the other teams have to hail Pogs brilliance or at worst ignore it because they are all inter linked and are eating from the same pie.

Jumbo for instance aren't going to complain publicly about Pogacars performances when they have produced the only rider who could live with him in the last 4 seasons. If he was dirty then what would that say about Vingegaard. The only response will be to try and figure out a new and better way of competing with him.

Even the riders much lower down the food chain benefit from the money that UAE and Pogacar help to generate. Those with the strongest principles will simply exit the sport.

 

[noob]

Even the riders much lower down the food chain benefit from the money that UAE and Pogacar help to generate. Those with the strongest principles will simply exit the sport.

Also the variable that some doctors/DS probably refuses to do the heavier programs. I still haphazard that Ineos right now falls into that category. It doesn't mean they're clean, just that they don't go all out on the new/heavier things.

But yeah others are definitely phased out.

 

[Krzysztof_O]

Teddy is a super-responder to porridge. Haters will never find anything!

 

[Moose McKnuckles]

well there was weird heated discussion between Pog's tech and commissaire who wanted to take Pog's bike when he was celebrating with Urska - it was just a brief moment of drone/heli shot but it did seemed weird. but can't see it possible that the uci will be so stupid to not check the bike he actually rode. that would be next level stupidity or ridiculous level of corruption.

Three crank arms on Pog's bike should have been a dead giveaway, frankly.

 

[solo80k]

well there was weird heated discussion between Pog's tech and commissaire who wanted to take Pog's bike when he was celebrating with Urska - it was just a brief moment of drone/heli shot but it did seemed weird. but can't see it possible that the uci will be so stupid to not check the bike he actually rode. that would be next level stupidity or ridiculous level of corruption.

Do we have any video available?

 

[Casual cyclist]

Are you Cycling Highlights testing out the script for your next video?

Close. Actually, I am Tom D. from this picture.

 

[Casual cyclist]

I read that but if this is done consistently it's bound to raise some eyebrows and at the very least some protests from other teams.

This was likely just a glitch in the system. As one member has already pointed out, the current s***-show is not simply the crooks from UAE against others eager to expose them. It's more "global" than that. For example, the journalists not even mentioning any suspicions has been rightly noted here on numerous occasions.

 

[glassmoon]

Do we have any video available?

https://tiz-cycling.io/video/world-championships-2024-road-race-last-25-km/?tape=3 starts cca 10:14 before the end

 

[Tim Cahill]

From the Guardian.



This is both a celebration of Pogacar, as well as raising the question of doping. But rather than confront the question Jonathan Lieuw dismisses it for aesthetic reasons.

"None of it has ever remotely interested me, and not out of an indifference to science or sporting morality"

No but see that's exactly what it is Jonathan. He might express it with the kind of faux-magniloquence you see a lot in the guardian, but he's effectively admitting to a dereliction of duty. I can completely understand weary fans like us taking the 'pro wrestling' approach to the sport, I know loads on here do. For one who is meant to be a journalist, admitting that he takes a completely amoral stance towards these matters in the name of enjoyment completely reduces his role to no more than that of a cheerleader. They should be sceptical, they should question and probe, but there are very few journalists left in cycling, it's easier to just write wordy think-pieces from an ivory tower.

[[content deleted]]

 

[AttaqueDeRolland]

"None of it has ever remotely interested me, and not out of an indifference to science or sporting morality"

No but see that's exactly what it is Jonathan. He might express it with the kind of faux-magniloquence you see a lot in the guardian, but he's effectively admitting to a dereliction of duty. I can completely understand weary fans like us taking the 'pro wrestling' approach to the sport, I know loads on here do. For one who is meant to be a journalist, admitting that he takes a completely amoral stance towards these matters in the name of enjoyment completely reduces his role to no more than that of a cheerleader. They should be sceptical, they should question and probe, but there are very few journalists left in cycling, it's easier to just write wordy think-pieces from an ivory tower.

Video isn't meant to be a political statement, more a comment on the nature of journalism in England;

It's a general issue in cycling journalism. A lot of the journalists buddy up with the riders, they keep in touch privately and maintain an almost friend-like relationship that makes it borderline impossible for the journalists to start asking uncomfortable and unpleasant questions.

 

[Shakes]

what? FORGIVEN? who are we to forgive a rider or not?
I've come to learn that athletes INSIDE the sport do not think like us, do not behave like WE want them to, do not weight their priorities like we do. "he'd have left UAE". that's veeery delusional. really. pro cycling is not fair, is not good vs bad. it a pro sport without the nuance we'd wish as fans. we can imagine, paint a rider as we wish, but it's a cut-throat sport and they ALL know what they are doing

He'd care if he was clean.

 

[pastronef]

He'd care if he was clean.

a cycling career is short and you have to make a living as best as you can. I find surreal that we judge what athletes should or should not do based on our point of view OUTSIDE of the peloton

 

[ashhutch1997]

It's a general issue in cycling journalism. A lot of the journalists buddy up with the riders, they keep in touch privately and maintain an almost friend-like relationship that makes it borderline impossible for the journalists to start asking uncomfortable and unpleasant questions.

Journalism has been dead in the west for a long time IMO, the truth isn't what's most important for them..

 

[ashhutch1997]

I do wonder how far Pogacars dominance will be able to go, I genuinely wouldn't be supeised if he won Giro/Tour/Vuelta in the same year.

 

[AmRacer]

I do wonder how far Pogacars dominance will be able to go, I genuinely wouldn't be supeised if he won Giro/Tour/Vuelta in the same year.

63 days of racing. He won't do much before, between and after the GT's.

 

[Ilmaestro99]

There have to be plenty of people out there who believe that pogacar is a clean rider

I wonder how good they think he would be if he started doping ? He would actually take flight in the climbs

 

[Oldermanish]

I agree that it's certainly not specific to UAE and I'd say that Jumbo and Sky before them were indeed much more PR conscious in trying to force a certain narrative upon the public. To some extent the other teams have to hail Pogs brilliance or at worst ignore it because they are all inter linked and are eating from the same pie.

Jumbo for instance aren't going to complain publicly about Pogacars performances when they have produced the only rider who could live with him in the last 4 seasons. If he was dirty then what would that say about Vingegaard. The only response will be to try and figure out a new and better way of competing with him.

Even the riders much lower down the food chain benefit from the money that UAE and Pogacar help to generate. Those with the strongest principles will simply exit the sport.

Same as it ever was.

 

[Oldermanish]

There have to be plenty of people out there who want to believe that pogacar is a clean rider

I wonder how good they think he would be if he started doping ? He would actually take flight in the climbs

That is the undercurrent of Faith on each rider's fan platform, isn't it?

 

[Krzysztof_O]

There have to be plenty of people out there who want to believe that pogacar is a clean rider

I wonder how good they think he would be if he started doping ? He would actually take flight in the climbs

A lot of people want to believe in irrational things..[[content deleted]]

 

[pastronef]

once again (I already asked before) where does the NEED to believe of some come from? many watch the races without needing to believe in this or that view. they just watch it. is the small-world-view of the aura around an athlete so important to some?
example: Pog gave that bottle to the kid. fine, great gesture, very photographic. if I was a Pog fan that would give me joy expecially because the anti-Pog fans would hate that picture (look at that he acts this way they are scamming us with the good boy stuff)

but I have no dog in the fight with Pog. so I look at that pic as a thing that happened, in a Giro I didn't enjoy that much. but i didn't hate it nor him.

I think the desire to believe involves a small part of the fans, and all the others that want them to "open their eyes" are just wasting their time arguing.

 

[Extinction]

For me it's not about the "cleanliness", but who is behind the operation and where does the money come from. Don't get me wrong, everywhere the corporate world has a million skeletons in the closet. So it's not about morality in the strictest sense, but when something goes beyond all decency. When the quantity of money and special interests allow something so surreal and thus so farcical to get passed off as legitimate sport, despite the talent, the hegemony becomes intolerable. Too much is too much, in other words. Let the arms race continue and pretend as if it's not happening. Are you not entertained?

 

[Extinction]

Power Analysis: Pogačar's Outrageous 100km Attack on Worlds Is Crazier Than You Thought

Power analysis of Tadej Pogačar's world championship road race win in Zürich, Switzerland. Just how impressive was his performance?

velo.outsideonline.com

 

[peterfin]

Power Analysis: Pogačar's Outrageous 100km Attack on Worlds Is Crazier Than You Thought

Power analysis of Tadej Pogačar's world championship road race win in Zürich, Switzerland. Just how impressive was his performance?

velo.outsideonline.com

Sivakov doing +500 watts (7.4 watt/kg) for almost 10 minutes while drafting in Pogacar's wheel Are we sure that a motor in Pogacar's bike can't be part of the explanation? A rich team with access to official control equipement (x-ray, tablets...) and a lab to test the e-bike in all possible conditions could find ways to hide the motor, battery and gears.