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Team Astana

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Mayomaniac

Mayomaniac

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GenericBoonenFan said:
Does he live there? Because PCS says he was born on the mainland?
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The nearest hospital is on the mainland. That's pretty usual in rural areas, the place of birth is often the nearest hospital and not your hometown.
An example from Biathlon would be Lisa Vittozzi. Born in the nearest hospital in Pieve di Cadore, but from Sappada.

Back to Astana, most of them are riding like they haven't been payed in months, sadly that's probably not far from the truth...
 
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ciranda

ciranda

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GenericBoonenFan said:
Does he live there? Because PCS says he was born on the mainland?
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Yes I think so but not sure. This newspaper follows him during the TDF.
www.elbapress.it

Tour de France, è il giorno dell’esordio di Simone Velasco

Parte venerdì 1 luglio il Tour de France, e gli elbani si preoccupano degli orari in cui verranno trasmesse le tappe. Si, perché ci sarà da fare il tifo per primo elbano nella storia del ciclismo che…
www.elbapress.it www.elbapress.it
img_dkElba6.jpg
 
Lequack

Lequack

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Meanwhile Astana is losing it's sunglasses sponsor. Scicon is the brand that also sponsors UAE and Pogacar.

Scicon pulls out of Astana sponsorship amid Mark Cavendish Oakley conflict
Italian brand looking to sue for damages as several teammates join Cavendish in Oakleys
www.cyclingnews.com

Scicon pulls out of Astana sponsorship amid Mark Cavendish Oakley conflict

Several teammates join Cavendish in Oakleys
www.cyclingnews.com www.cyclingnews.com
 
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Lequack

Lequack

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Meanwhile Superman Lopez is also suing Astana

Miguel Ángel López takes Astana to CAS
Colombian confident as 'team of specialist lawyers' prepare his case of unfair dismissal
www.cyclingnews.com

Miguel Ángel López takes Astana to CAS

Colombian confident as 'team of specialist lawyers' prepare his case of unfair dismissal
www.cyclingnews.com www.cyclingnews.com

All these lawsuits amid the lack of wins and points really is not good news for the team.
 
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Unchained

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I can only hope that Astana gets sued for millions over a fundamental example of cycling sponsorship basics. And the team doesn't have a chance if an old sprinter is running the team. Cav shows up and there is a sunglasses mutiny.
For the team ownership and management to say that it's not a big deal to in your face, in this case on your face,disrespect a sponsor by letting King Cav wear Oakley and letting others follow suit,absolutely absurd.
Sure maybe Cavendish may have had a stand alone contract exception, that allowed his equipment choices to be different, because of previous commitments. But that would have been thoughtfully and respectfully been agreed to before signing.. and if the team told him do whatever you want.. I hope Scicon and even a dirty Lopez get a big pay out.
The UCI needs to protect the sponsors, and riders interests.

B&B and other snafus are not just regular.. Now Silicon Valley Bank and Credit Suisse have interests in teams and the reaction will be interesting to see..EF Education will be the first at the crossroads because so far nobody wants to pick up Silicon Valley Bank as one thing, possibly sell off divisions.. and as banks are bought and restructuring, wonder if pro cycling sponsorship is part of their future plans.
Unlike SVB, Scicon paid their bills and gave Astana the promised support.. Not lots of real estate on a skinny pro racer..helmet and sunglasses are some of the most prominent features while racing aside from the fabric of the kits..disgraceful.
Sponsorship is the backbone of pro bike racing
 
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Lequack said:
Will they win anything this year? They are really in need of points. Shame that they sacked the only man who would've got them a lot of points, that is Superman Lopez. Way to sabotage your own team.

Frb_UXMXwAIRPiJ
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Looking more and more like Cavendish was a seat of the pants,last minute, let's make the best of left over Lopez money. Astana is not even trying to put a quality product out on the road
 
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samhocking

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Rankings mean very little this year as it's now a 3 year cycle where points from 2023, 2024 and 2025 will combine to relegation or not. If all goes normal with the increased weighting on GTs Cavendish will probably come away with similar points anyway. Lopez won 647 points last season, v Cavendish 571 and obviously 2021 Cavnedish was nearly double points to Lopez.
 
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jmdirt

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Unchained said:
I can only hope that Astana gets sued for millions over a fundamental example of cycling sponsorship basics. And the team doesn't have a chance if an old sprinter is running the team. Cav shows up and there is a sunglasses mutiny.
For the team ownership and management to say that it's not a big deal to in your face, in this case on your face,disrespect a sponsor by letting King Cav wear Oakley and letting others follow suit,absolutely absurd.
Sure maybe Cavendish may have had a stand alone contract exception, that allowed his equipment choices to be different, because of previous commitments. But that would have been thoughtfully and respectfully been agreed to before signing.. and if the team told him do whatever you want.. I hope Scicon and even a dirty Lopez get a big pay out.
The UCI needs to protect the sponsors, and riders interests.

B&B and other snafus are not just regular.. Now Silicon Valley Bank and Credit Suisse have interests in teams and the reaction will be interesting to see..EF Education will be the first at the crossroads because so far nobody wants to pick up Silicon Valley Bank as one thing, possibly sell off divisions.. and as banks are bought and restructuring, wonder if pro cycling sponsorship is part of their future plans.
Unlike SVB, Scicon paid their bills and gave Astana the promised support.. Not lots of real estate on a skinny pro racer..helmet and sunglasses are some of the most prominent features while racing aside from the fabric of the kits..disgraceful.
Sponsorship is the backbone of pro bike racing
Click to expand...
I 100% agree that sponsors should be valued and protected, but the riders must also be considered. IMO, things like eyewear and shoes should be decided by the rider. Certainly have an equipment agreement with a company for riders who don't have a sponsorship, or a specific need (which will be most).

In this case, Cav has been with O since 2008, and they make specific models for him, and special colors of existing models. He also wears their optics off of the bike.

From Scicon's standpoint I can see them wanting Cav to have their glasses on if/when he wins another TdF stage, but would having him at least wearing their backpack be better than nothing? They also have a guy who could be racing for yellow so...

Some questions I still have: does Scicon make an acceptable RX for Cav (their website does not show their cycling glasses available with RX, but they have a spot RX (think small goggles), and a casual line of RX)? Was there an agreement for Cav to continue with O? Did anybody really expect Cav to end a 15+ year relationship with O?

Bad deal for sure.
 
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Unchained

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jmdirt said:
I 100% agree that sponsors should be valued and protected, but the riders must also be considered. IMO, things like eyewear and shoes should be decided by the rider. Certainly have an equipment agreement with a company for riders who don't have a sponsorship, or a specific need (which will be most).

In this case, Cav has been with O since 2008, and they make specific models for him, and special colors of existing models. He also wears their optics off of the bike.

From Scicon's standpoint I can see them wanting Cav to have their glasses on if/when he wins another TdF stage, but would having him at least wearing their backpack be better than nothing? They also have a guy who could be racing for yellow so...

Some questions I still have: does Scicon make an acceptable RX for Cav (their website does not show their cycling glasses available with RX, but they have a spot RX (think small goggles), and a casual line of RX)? Was there an agreement for Cav to continue with O? Did anybody really expect Cav to end a 15+ year relationship with O?

Bad deal for sure.
Click to expand...
Could not disagree more.. been riding Specialized,new team uses BH..you ride team bike.. had Bell on your head for decades, new team uses Rudy Project ..team clothing is Craft..and on and on and on and been a dirty secret in all kinds of racing. Equipment that is made unbranded, or equipment that is labeled w the current sponsors brand and to the untrained eye is authentic.
Riders have been using and winning on falsely flagged bikes and other equipment for decades. Standard stuff.
Cavendish has a long successful relationship with Oakley. Surely profitable for all involved. When sponsors try to equip teams they often come up short because of lack of products in their line.. Campy finds itself odd man out because of limited products. Oakley makes everything and anything.. Look to the NFL and pro hockey!!

Cavendish and Astana had an obvious decision to make at signing.. Cav,here's our bike,group,wheel,seat,cockpit,head end,tire,helmet, clothing sponsors.
Is there a contractual conflict? If yes what is the work around.
Cycling News and others often get up close in tech reporting and show close up photos of bikes and most often downplay that components are marked differently or a team is using something outside the sponsors stable.
There was a contract between Astana and Scicon for riders when using eyewear that it would be from their line of products, unless some special circumstances like unavailable in prescription or TT specific eye shields that the company doesn't make. Everyone knew the lay of the land,contracts were signed, products and money changed hands.
Cavendish late to the party thought that he would be an exception, because he is exceptional.. He and Astana are 100% wrong.. If there were a contract exception approved by Scicon it would be in the publics face.. As it is now.. Astana has changed the original sponsorship agreement and according to the eyewear maker are violated the contract.
If I was an executive at Scicon would have went directly to the bank as soon as Cavendish was signed to ensure the a press budget was available asap..get the best photographer in the world snapping photos of Cav using team issued products.. don't know the budget spike, but guarantee there was one at Wilier and they are accumulating as many flattering photos featuring Cavendish aboard their bicycles.
There are probably hundreds of equipment deals in the peloton that are not Michael Jordan big..but you know that Sagan, Roglic, and all household names have stand alone endorsement deals.. Again standard.. This says something about Astana not so much Cavendish, he has been in the game long enough to know this would be a problem, his agent showed Astana his existing endorsement obligations, along with salary and drag alongs..trainer, coach,mechanics, guaranteed starts at his favorite races,ect.
Someone at Astana told team Cavendish not to worry about it, winked, and everyone went on their way.
Now you can guess at the phone calls.. Scicon marketing rep to Astana " wtf saw Cav at the race XYZ, he was wearing Oakley!!! " Astana " Oh I didn't notice, I will bring it up immediately, don't worry, I will call you back "
and now they are here..
Funny that as an old man going to a lesser team, Sagan says, sure I will come, need this bike, these components, my brother, my trainer, Daniel Oss and additional demands.. Cavendish is going full Van Halen and asking to get 20 pounds of M&MS w all brown ones be removed..
What can really happen? Astana doesn't have the huevos to tell him what to do.. He is going to wear what he wants period. Just guessing but Astana starting this many legal fires says that they are done.
 
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pastronef

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Cavendish wore Oakley in 2020 at Bahrain, while Rudy Project was their glasses sponsor. I think it was agreed with the team and Rudy. I don't see how Astana and SciCon couldn't make the same agreement.
Remember when Sagan rode his first year with Bora? He wore 100% glasses while Bora had a deal with Adidas glasses. no problems in that case too
Contador wore a Giro helmet in 2011 at Saxo while his team was sponsored by Specialized.
Adam Hansen wore his own made shows at Lotto while the whole team wore Gaerne shoes.
there was a woman rider with Wiggle Sport team using Shimano group while the whole team rode Campagnolo
Quintana in 2021 wore Fizik shoes at Arkea while the team wore Shimano shoes (and he sometimes had Oakley while the team was sponsored by Ekoi in 2021 too)
 
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staubsauger

staubsauger

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Soccer players with private sponsorship wear their own shoes all the time. Even at Bayern Munich where there's a special contract with Adidas.

Usually it's noted in the contract that it's allowed. Both in the players contract and in the agreement with Adidas as well that a soccer player is allowed to wear Nike shoes for example of he's got private sponsorship. Even though there were disputes with Adidas in the past about it.

The problem here it seems is that even other Astana riders like Lutsenko started wearing Oakley suddenly.
 
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jmdirt

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staubsauger said:
Soccer players with private sponsorship wear their own shoes all the time. Even at Bayern Munich where there's a special contract with Adidas.

Usually it's noted in the contract that it's allowed. Both in the players contract and in the agreement with Adidas as well that a soccer player is allowed to wear Nike shoes for example of he's got private sponsorship. Even though there were disputes with Adidas in the past about it.

The problem here it seems is that even other Astana riders like Lutsenko started wearing Oakley suddenly.
Click to expand...
I wonder if they didn't like the glasses? Why else would they switch? Or maybe they already knew that Scicon was out.
 
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skippo12

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samhocking said:
Rankings mean very little this year as it's now a 3 year cycle where points from 2023, 2024 and 2025 will combine to relegation or not. If all goes normal with the increased weighting on GTs Cavendish will probably come away with similar points anyway. Lopez won 647 points last season, v Cavendish 571 and obviously 2021 Cavnedish was nearly double points to Lopez.
Click to expand...

GTs were the main source of points for them. 4th Giro, 8th Tour, 4th Vuelta. Lopez and Nibali are gone. That leaves Lutsenko to fight for another top 10 (probably would score more points if he would focus on smaller stage races).
As far as points go Battistella finishing 7th in Poland was the 4th best result of 2022.

Obviously cannot be relegated this season but based on last seasons relegation battle it´s really difficult to overcome a large deficit. Even more because other teams won´t repeat the same mistakes again. Teams like EF or Lotto are collecting a lot of points in .1 races.
 
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