Hopefully he's sore but even "re-locating" your should will hurt the next day. He looked to be riding OK after. What really sucks is JV blew by him and were over a minute away before realizing what had happened. At that point there really is no choice but to keep Vingo closer to Pogacar. If I were DS I'd let Primoz free lance on the climbs to force a Pogi response. If Jonas couldn't hang with him that pretty much sums up the Tour.
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He was operating on orders to proceed IMO. What else would you recommend?Some comedy gold today when WVA was escaping from Primoz
OTOH he saved Vinge (and other GC guys by the way) as well.
For sure but I think his form will worsen the next couple days because of this crash. He did seem okay afterwards, but was racing on adrenaline.
If he drops Vingegaard tomorrow though... then yeah.
Red Rick
BANNED
only today?
Yesterday they had 4 guys step of their bike at the same time and it was the best tactical day they had so far.
That was just split second decisions that didn't end up too bad in the end. But today was weird tactics from the start.
Kudos to Jumbo, I don't think it was possible, but they make 2009 Astana seem a cohesive and harmonious team.
They need to fire the person responsible for splitting the team into so many different factions & interests. They're riding like headless chickens out there, or what some call 'rabbits caught in the headlights'.
Pure suicidal delirium today.
Pure suicidal delirium today.
Van Aert's attack, what ever the reason behind was, didn't work out, but it wasn't that bad of a day for them., though it obviously could have been better. Their leaders didn't crash or get dropped, and neither their nor Pogačar's chances of winning have really changed much since yesterday. It could also be helpful that UAE has to work a bit more now, though it might not have any affect on the final outcome.
If they can't drop or at least follow Pogačar in the mountains, they could have been in front of him now and it wouldn't matter anyway. Tomorrow might tell us a lot more than the latest stages.
If they can't drop or at least follow Pogačar in the mountains, they could have been in front of him now and it wouldn't matter anyway. Tomorrow might tell us a lot more than the latest stages.
To me it all makes perfect sense; there are way more riders to chose from nowadays on the market than in the past, and you end up with riders too good to not have their own ambitions.
You have to take Wouts' own will as a factor or he leaves. And the latter would be much worse.
You have to take Wouts' own will as a factor or he leaves. And the latter would be much worse.
all of Jumbo's tactics fail because WVA is an extremely selfish rider. even on the cobbled stage yesterday, yes he did a lot of work for Vingegaard but he was already out of position to do anything on the stage for himself. if he wasn't trying to save his yellow jersey he would've waited for Roglic, I can't think of any other reason why they didn't. stage 4 was a failure to gain time on Pogacar with one of their GC riders. today was just horrible braindead crap.
As van Aert is now contained. I expect JV will try to take on Pogi next. Starting tomorrow on stage 7.
No real excuse to not finish lets say in top 3 on La Super Planche des Belles Filles.
No real excuse to not finish lets say in top 3 on La Super Planche des Belles Filles.
occasionally somebody will mention that the team used to be Rabobank and they remember that and act accordingly.
The team should have been built around Roglic this year. Absolutely no doubt in my mind. Bringing Vingeggard as a coleader and wout van aert as a leader is so stupid.
Not even Team Sky at their peak would dare to bring a guy like Van Aert to the Tour. Nor 2 coleaders. And they were competing against Bardet, Quintana, Aru, Uran, Purito. Not Pogacar.
They did it in 2012 with Cavendish but quickly learned their lesson.
Every year Jumbo send a team built around Roglic to the Vuelta and they succeed. They destroy the race, with Roglic the leader.I don't understand their obsession with multiple leaders in the Tour. They wanted to do it in 2020 with Roglic, Dumoulin and Kruijsvijk. They wanted to do it in 2018 with Roglic and Kruijswijk. Makes no sense.
I would send Vingegaard to the Giro. He can win a grand tour there, if he is so good. He has not won a GT before.
Roglic should have a team around him for the Tour. Kruijswijk, Kuss, Laporte, Van hoojdonck, Benoot, Oomen, and then one of Dennis, Gesink, Bouwman or Vingegaard (after giro, if the Denmark grand depart is so important)
Van Aert should be focused on winning monuments. He was signed to do that and has underperformed slightly despite his extreme talent. I wouldn't say he is super selfish, but his presence in the team leads to something being off
2 leaders on a cobble stage is so dumb. You protect your leader the whole stage. He punctures or crashes and the whole team is there for him, they believe in him , they support him, motivate him. When Roglic crashed, he needed his team, and they were nowhere near him. Instead they were helping this Vingegaard who never won a WT Stage race
Look how Arkea look after Nairoman, Bora looks after Vlasov, even Movistar with Mas
Roglic has beaten pretty much everyone on grand tours, even Pogacar. Vingegaard didn't even manage put time into Carapaz in the mountains at all last year. That's right, he couldn't drop Carapaz. Just made time in the 2 long time trials. Meanwhile Roglic has cracked Climber Carapaz multiple times in the mountains. Because he is the only rider close to Pogacar's level
Roglic joined the team in 2015 , a team languishing in the shadow of Rabobank, changing sponsors every year, and within 5 years had won them grand tours and turned them into the top gc team in the world.
He was the top UCI ranked rider for 2 years straight and has beaten Pogacar on multiple occasions. He is one of only 2 riders to have beaten Pogacar in a GT, the other being 42yo Valverde who is in recovery from a crash.
Roglic didn't lose time to Pogacaar in the Tour de France in the Mountains ever. Vingegaard lost 4 minutes.
Roglic deserved the support. If 5 of his teammates aren't working for Vingegaard in that moment, he probably doesn't crashed in the hay bale
Not even Team Sky at their peak would dare to bring a guy like Van Aert to the Tour. Nor 2 coleaders. And they were competing against Bardet, Quintana, Aru, Uran, Purito. Not Pogacar.
They did it in 2012 with Cavendish but quickly learned their lesson.
Every year Jumbo send a team built around Roglic to the Vuelta and they succeed. They destroy the race, with Roglic the leader.I don't understand their obsession with multiple leaders in the Tour. They wanted to do it in 2020 with Roglic, Dumoulin and Kruijsvijk. They wanted to do it in 2018 with Roglic and Kruijswijk. Makes no sense.
I would send Vingegaard to the Giro. He can win a grand tour there, if he is so good. He has not won a GT before.
Roglic should have a team around him for the Tour. Kruijswijk, Kuss, Laporte, Van hoojdonck, Benoot, Oomen, and then one of Dennis, Gesink, Bouwman or Vingegaard (after giro, if the Denmark grand depart is so important)
Van Aert should be focused on winning monuments. He was signed to do that and has underperformed slightly despite his extreme talent. I wouldn't say he is super selfish, but his presence in the team leads to something being off
2 leaders on a cobble stage is so dumb. You protect your leader the whole stage. He punctures or crashes and the whole team is there for him, they believe in him , they support him, motivate him. When Roglic crashed, he needed his team, and they were nowhere near him. Instead they were helping this Vingegaard who never won a WT Stage race
Look how Arkea look after Nairoman, Bora looks after Vlasov, even Movistar with Mas
Roglic has beaten pretty much everyone on grand tours, even Pogacar. Vingegaard didn't even manage put time into Carapaz in the mountains at all last year. That's right, he couldn't drop Carapaz. Just made time in the 2 long time trials. Meanwhile Roglic has cracked Climber Carapaz multiple times in the mountains. Because he is the only rider close to Pogacar's level
Roglic joined the team in 2015 , a team languishing in the shadow of Rabobank, changing sponsors every year, and within 5 years had won them grand tours and turned them into the top gc team in the world.
He was the top UCI ranked rider for 2 years straight and has beaten Pogacar on multiple occasions. He is one of only 2 riders to have beaten Pogacar in a GT, the other being 42yo Valverde who is in recovery from a crash.
Roglic didn't lose time to Pogacaar in the Tour de France in the Mountains ever. Vingegaard lost 4 minutes.
Roglic deserved the support. If 5 of his teammates aren't working for Vingegaard in that moment, he probably doesn't crashed in the hay bale
Bonimenier
BANNED
Comparing with Sky is useless, mainly because Sky always had the best GC rider or the top favourite for the parcours, whereas JV have the Slovenian Heras and the Danish Peraud. Enjoyable riders, but in the end extremely average.
Also the comparison between Cavendish and van Aert is terrible. Cavendish can go fast for 200m in maybe 25% of the stages, whereas van Aert can go fast for over 100km in 95% of the stages. The latter can be helpful for GC leaders, as shown before. The former needs help to not OTL.
Comparing them to Heras and Peruad proves my point that Roglic should have the full team support. Heras won 4 GTs, Peraud got 1 lucky podium. To call Roglic 'extremely average' is embarrassing.
Van Aert shouldn't be in the race, because he's too busy doing stupid attacks for the cameras and taking 20 green jersey points when it negatively impacts his team leader.
And I was very impressed by Van Aert work yesterday and don't think he is super selfish. But he just gets too excited doing his own thing all the time. He seems just not very intelligent and too ambitious to fit into the teams goal in this race, and his presence makes things too complicated. Look in the vuelta, no van aert, team has one goal, and they dominate the race. Instead of dominating stage 4 and capitulation the next day
They could, maybe should have done this. Or they could go on try something glorious and maybe fail. But the attempt was very entertaining and it's also about the sponsor getting time on air.
Bonimenier
BANNED
Exactly, the Vuelta. That is as high as the ceiling will get for Roglic. Send him to the Giro and the Vuelta next year, and keep the Tour open for the above average riders on the team.
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