The Grand 2022 Wollongong UCI Road World Championships Thread, September 18th-25th

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Uh, no. The other star riders were not trying to get into the break when he did...
And why didn't they? Because they thought they had a better shot at winning/beating him by saving themselves in the bunch and hope someone else would do the dirty work, so when it came to a show off, they would be fresher than him. Yes, they all could have followed him when he went, the question is if they would then still have been able to follow him 40km later when it was 1v1. And obviously, they didn't care too much to find out. This is what i've been stressing for the past 3 years now. Evenepoel's time to attack is as soon as all the domestiques are getting tired and can't hold him down, but still too soon for the other big names to fancy their chances and go in the attack with him, knowing they will face a hard time when they do. But of course, you don't believe he would drop other riders like he casually dropped Lutsenko, so you may have a different view on the matter. But surely at one point in time you have to start considering this is no coincidence anymore.
 
And why didn't they? Because they thought they had a better shot at winning/beating him by saving themselves in the bunch and hope someone else would do the dirty work, so when it came to a show off, they would be fresher than him. Yes, they all could have followed him when he went, the question is if they would then still have been able to follow him 40km later when it was 1v1. And obviously, they didn't care too much to find out. This is what i've been stressing for the past 3 years now. Evenepoel's time to attack is as soon as all the domestiques are getting tired and can't hold him down, but still too soon for the other big names to fancy their chances and go in the attack with him, knowing they will face a hard time when they do. But of course, you don't believe he would drop other riders like he casually dropped Lutsenko, so you may have a different view on the matter. But surely at one point in time you have to start considering this is no coincidence anymore.
Obviously that's a question but it was very easy to see when the break went that he was going to have it as easy as possible in a WCRR.

When I see him ride Pogacar or Van der Poel out his wheel, it will be a different matter, but he always, always, always goes so early that the biggest rivals don't dare try to follow him (in Liège and San Sebastián this year, that was just because he was the strongest at that moment, though).
 
Obviously that's a question but it was very easy to see when the break went that he was going to have it as easy as possible in a WCRR.

When I see him ride Pogacar or Van der Poel out his wheel, it will be a different matter, but he always, always, always goes so early that the biggest rivals don't dare try to follow him (in Liège and San Sebastián this year, that was just because he was the strongest at that moment, though).
That's the entire point. He goes so early and they all know he is able to follow through. So they all pee their pants and don't want to go with him so early because they don't know if they themselves will be able to follow through, so they wait hoping the bunch will hold him down. But when it turns out the bunch didn't/couldn't hold him down, they are screwed. But they all very well know the terms of the scenario. So the entire point of "they could have followed him" is completely moot. That's not what matters.
 
Is this the Roglic thread?
The main theory here is that several of the "big hitters" had a brain fart and let Remco ride away. They then let him build a 2 minute gap and 'cause it was too late they gave up.
Here's another take:
Remco stormed up the climb.
Wout, his teammate didn't try to follow. The others either couldn't or weren't prepared to go super deep that far out. They couldn't catch him afterwards.
Remco was the strongest and won.
Wout looked like the second strongest.
Pog, Ala and the rest were outgunned.
Generally, professional cyclists whinge a lot less than forum members.
 
That's the entire point. He goes so early and they all know he is able to follow through. So they all pee their pants and don't want to go with him so early because they don't know if they themselves will be able to follow through, so they wait hoping the bunch will hold him down. But when it turns out the bunch didn't/couldn't hold him down, they are screwed. But they all very well know the terms of the scenario. So the entire point of "they could have followed him" is completely moot. That's not what matters.
Hmm. I think today was different because he didn't go solo. They could at least have marked him into the front group.
 
n other words: most riders didn't have it, and simply would have burnt their legs trying to follow Remco when they saw him going.
Keyword "most".
Point is that other teams put themselves in a situation where there best riders couldn't even try to follow Remco. And this happens way too often with Remco. Smart guy, but you could say that other big guns are incredibly stupid to not atleast try to ride on Remco's wheel in a race like this. If Pogacar or Van Aert goes everyone immediately reacts, if Remco goes for some reason everyone just looks at eachother. This time it was even worse, the- what should be the best - team in the race helped Remco create a gap instead of chasing him.

A guy like Campenaerts is always getting called dumb but atleast he has known for years now to mark Remco's wheel if he's in a race and try to follow it as long as he can.
 
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Keyword "most".
Point is that other teams put themselves in a situation where there best riders couldn't even try to follow Remco. And this happens way too often with Remco. Smart guy, but you could say that other big guns are incredibly stupid to not atleast try to ride on Remco's wheen in a race like this. If Pogacar or Van Aert goes everyone immediately reacts, if Remco goes for some reason everyone just looks at eachother. This time it was even worse, the- what should be the best - team in the race helped Remco create a gap instead of chasing him.

A guy like Campenaerts is always getting called dumb but atleast he has known for years now to mark Remco's wheel if he's in a race and try to follow it as long as he can.
I think the difference is just at what distance from the finish he goes. Noone really responed to Pogacar the one time he tried a 50km solo in Strade Bianche.
 
I think the difference is just at what distance from the finish he goes. Noone really responed to Pogacar the one time he tried a 50km solo in Strade Bianche.
Didn't he just ride everyone of his wheel on a sterrato section, I think even on a downhill part where he just took a lot of risks? Not sure, but the difference is that Remco by now should be known to be able to do solo's like that. He has been doing them for a pretty long time now. You give him 30 seconds and he's gone. You either ride on his wheel (and if he drops you fair play he was stronger) or multiple teams need to immediately react when he has a gap and sacrifice multiple riders to close the gap as fast as possible.
 
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So you honestly believe that Pogacar wasn't interested in a break of 20 riders with Remco Evenepoel in it.
And when WVA went a few laps later, he wasn't interested in that either, because he got dropped on that occasion as well.
Pogacar started that climb pretty far back tbf, don't get me wrong I don't think he had good legs but obviously a lot of riders could've followed the initial move.
 
No, Eenkhoorn and co were the first to attack, so they were like 50 meters in front of Evenepoel when he went. The others couldn't follow Evenepoel and by the them he was on top, he caught Eenkhoorn and the others. Does anyone really think that Pogacar just let Evenepoel ride if he was able to follow?
Yes, it most of all about positioning. All favourites at that time let it happen yes, but good for Evenepoel that he seized that opportunity. It was perfect, but we never got to see the battle of the best riders. How could anyone deny that?

Stop all the bs that it was because Evenepoel dominated everyone and won that way. He never had to fight vs the best riders. It's as simple as that. That was most of all a failure of all the other best riders yes. Just like it was Evenepoel who earned the title because he saw an opportunity and took it.
Nobody is denying that Evenepoel deserved this title. It's just a shame it never was a real battle of the best and that made the race uninteresting and frustrating to watch for me personally. I'm sure if you are a Belgian it wasn't for obvious reasons, but so far only Belgians are claiming it was because of Evenepoels incredible power that he was in that group and that all other favourites were not able to follow him at that point. Come on.. please, don't lose reality.
 

fox

Sep 29, 2021
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And why didn't they? Because they thought they had a better shot at winning/beating him by saving themselves in the bunch and hope someone else would do the dirty work, so when it came to a show off, they would be fresher than him. Yes, they all could have followed him when he went, the question is if they would then still have been able to follow him 40km later when it was 1v1. And obviously, they didn't care too much to find out. This is what i've been stressing for the past 3 years now. Evenepoel's time to attack is as soon as all the domestiques are getting tired and can't hold him down, but still too soon for the other big names to fancy their chances and go in the attack with him, knowing they will face a hard time when they do. But of course, you don't believe he would drop other riders like he casually dropped Lutsenko, so you may have a different view on the matter. But surely at one point in time you have to start considering this is no coincidence anymore.

Evenepoel took 50 seconds on Lutsenko from mount Pleasant to the finish. 8 km. The guy was 7th in the TDF. That is not a second tier rider
Pogacar started that climb pretty far back tbf, don't get me wrong I don't think he had good legs but obviously a lot of riders could've followed the initial move.
Maybe a few more and they all would have gotten the Lutsenko treatment. It just bothers me that a lot of people here a trying to downplay the victory by stating that the others riders were stupid. That's just wrong. Nobody has the guts to follow him because they know they won't be able to follow him until the finish. They just can't hold his wheel.
 
And why didn't they? Because they thought they had a better shot at winning/beating him by saving themselves in the bunch and hope someone else would do the dirty work, so when it came to a show off, they would be fresher than him. Yes, they all could have followed him when he went, the question is if they would then still have been able to follow him 40km later when it was 1v1. And obviously, they didn't care too much to find out. This is what i've been stressing for the past 3 years now. Evenepoel's time to attack is as soon as all the domestiques are getting tired and can't hold him down, but still too soon for the other big names to fancy their chances and go in the attack with him, knowing they will face a hard time when they do. But of course, you don't believe he would drop other riders like he casually dropped Lutsenko, so you may have a different view on the matter. But surely at one point in time you have to start considering this is no coincidence anymore.
This is exactly the point most are trying to make. Why in the world did they let the group with Evenepoel get such a big gap and some countries even helped that group (France and Denmark), while a lot of other teams didn't pull in the group behind because they had riders upfront. All this while pretty much everyone by now should know that you can't give Evenepoel such a gap.
So it never became a real race as the other favourites never raced against Evenepoel.

Nobody is arguing that Evenepoel isn't a fantastic rider and he might have won as well when the favourites were in the first group, but we will never know now because they all just gave it away like this.
 
Evenepoel took 50 seconds on Lutsenko from mount Pleasant to the finish. 8 km. The guy was 7th in the TDF. That is not a second tier rider


Maybe a few more and they all would have gotten the Lutsenko treatment. It just bothers me that a lot of people here a trying to downplay the victory by stating that the others riders were stupid. That's just wrong. Nobody has the guts to follow him because they know they won't be able to follow him until the finish. They just can't hold his wheel.
Sigh. It was a huge group it's not about holding Evenepoels wheel. Also you don't really think that an good Evenepoel can ride a good Pogacar, vd Poel, van Aert, Roglic (some 20 more really good riders) of his wheel when they only follow?
It's just that if you let Evenepoel get the gap you will never be able to close it anymore. The more frustrating it was they gave that gap to him.
 
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fox

Sep 29, 2021
51
108
380
This is exactly the point most are trying to make. Why in the world did they let the group with Evenepoel get such a big gap and some countries even helped that group (France and Denmark), while a lot of other teams didn't pull in the group behind because they had riders upfront. All this while pretty much everyone by now should know that you can't give Evenepoel such a gap.
So it never became a real race as the other favourites never raced against Evenepoel.

Nobody is arguing that Evenepoel isn't a fantastic rider and he might have won as well when the favourites were in the first group, but we will never know now because they all just gave it away like this.

They did't give it away. I mean, Pogacar his best time on mount pleasant was slower than when Evenepoel went in the breakaway. He just couldn't do any better. And on the steepest part he was even faster than Van Aert. He took the KOM for 400meters in the climb to the top. Saying that his attack was not fast is just not true. It looked easy but he went really fast.
 
This is exactly the point most are trying to make. Why in the world did they let the group with Evenepoel get such a big gap and some countries even helped that group (France and Denmark), while a lot of other teams didn't pull in the group behind because they had riders upfront. All this while pretty much everyone by now should know that you can't give Evenepoel such a gap.
So it never became a real race as the other favourites never raced against Evenepoel.

Nobody is arguing that Evenepoel isn't a fantastic rider and he might have won as well when the favourites were in the first group, but we will never know now because they all just gave it away like this.
The point i was making, is that nobody is interested in burning matches 70k from the finish when the odds are against you in a face-off with Evenepoel. So they chose not to, hoping they won't need to, that others/teams will close the gap or keep the gap down.
 
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Sigh. It was a huge group it's not about holding Evenepoels wheel. Also you don't really think that an good Evenepoel can ride a good Pogacar, vd Poel, van Aert, Roglic (some 20 more really good riders) of his wheel when they only follow?
It's just that if you let Evenepoel get the gap you will never be able to close it anymore. The more frustrating it was they gave that gap to him.
Another thing is that Evenepoel has the opposite effect when weaker riders try everything to hang on they completely blow up when they do drop. That's why you get gaps blowing out very quickly when people drop off Evenepoels wheel.
 
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Sigh. It was a huge group it's not about holding Evenepoels wheel. Also you don't really think that an good Evenepoel can ride a good Pogacar, vd Poel, van Aert, Roglic (some 20 more really good riders) of his wheel when they only follow?
It's just that if you let Evenepoel get the gap you will never be able to close it anymore. The more frustrating it was they gave that gap to him.
...but...the question is...why did they let him get that gap. He always seems to get that gap for some reason. People know what he's going to do and he does it anyway. From the front. But there's always some reason...other than he's just dropping everyone. It's very odd.

He got away when he did because others weren't ready or willing to spend the energy to be up front at that point. They had to know it was a risk, but they needed to save the energy. He didn't. He was stronger early, he was stronger late.

Dominant ride.
 
Extremely disappointing race, in the Worlds you want a showdown between the best riders, we didn't have that this time (thanks to very strange French tactis) which left me with an empty feeling. Happy for all the Remco fans though, great job.
 
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Looking back, it was also unsatisfactory to get away from front peloton where Belgium only had Serry and Van Aert while France had four riders with Serry and Sivakov. France should probably have tried to keep the pace up in that group for a bit longer, and to exit it with more riders attacking than Belgium.
 
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