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Teams & Riders The official Primož Roglič is the new Rominger thread

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Maybe worth looking at the opposition before declaring TDS a better win than Tirreno and Romandie.
I don't disagree with this statement -- It's really hard to gauge the TdF warm up races like Suisse or Dauphine. On paper the fields always look strong but half of the favorites are only there to test their form. The field in the TdS was pretty weak this year, on top of that. The mighty Patrick Konrad was third at more than 3 min behind Bernal, who only took 19 seconds on nutty Rohan Dennis.

One thing that seems indisputable is that it's a lot harder to win the TdF than the Vuelta. Parcours aside, every single rider in the TdF is going hard, every stage, because they know it's the biggest cycling platform in the world. And teams only send their best riders to the Tour.
 
I don't disagree with this statement -- It's really hard to gauge the TdF warm up races like Suisse or Dauphine. On paper the fields always look strong but half of the favorites are only there to test their form. The field in the TdS was pretty weak this year, on top of that. The mighty Patrick Konrad was third at more than 3 min behind Bernal, who only took 19 seconds on nutty Rohan Dennis.

One thing that seems indisputable is that it's a lot harder to win the TdF than the Vuelta. Parcours aside, every single rider in the TdF is going hard, every stage, because they know it's the biggest cycling platform in the world. And teams only send their best riders to the Tour.
Every single Grand Tour is damn hard to win! TDF probably the hardest, but others are hard too, no doubt.
 
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I don't disagree with this statement -- It's really hard to gauge the TdF warm up races like Suisse or Dauphine. On paper the fields always look strong but half of the favorites are only there to test their form. The field in the TdS was pretty weak this year, on top of that. The mighty Patrick Konrad was third at more than 3 min behind Bernal, who only took 19 seconds on nutty Rohan Dennis.

One thing that seems indisputable is that it's a lot harder to win the TdF than the Vuelta. Parcours aside, every single rider in the TdF is going hard, every stage, because they know it's the biggest cycling platform in the world. And teams only send their best riders to the Tour.
if Steven Kruijswijk comes third I have to question the quality of opposition
 
if Steven Kruijswijk comes third I have to question the quality of opposition
In the end, sure the field in TdF proved to be less competitive for various reasons, the big guns Froome, Dumoulin, Nibali and Roglic were missing for various reasons and the strongest in the race abandoned. Normally SK is top 5 material in Le Tour. Also in Vuelta, as it turned out, Roglic had two opponents, one 39 year old and a kid with no background whatsoever in grand tours but these two put on exceptional performances.

The presumed quality of opposition only matters for some fans who are trying to justify their own ideas regarding their favorite rider, one can only beat the riders who show up and finish the race.
 
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In the end, sure the field in TdF proved to be less competitive for various reasons, the big guns Froome, Dumoulin, Nibali and Roglic were missing for various reasons and the strongest in the race abandoned. Normally SK is top 5 material in Le Tour. Also in Vuelta, as it turned out, Roglic had two opponents, one 39 year old and a kid with no background whatsoever in grand tours but these two put on exceptional performances.

The presumed quality of opposition only matters for some fans who are trying to justify their own ideas regarding their favorite rider, one can only beat the riders who show up and finish the race.
what happened to MAL, looking at the poll he was one of the favorites
 
Disappointment from Rogla. Curious to hear what went wrong. Probably he is spent from the Vuelta. I thought he'll still be good in the ITT and in Lombardia. I guess not. Great season for him, looking forward to the next one.
 
Disappointment from Rogla. Curious to hear what went wrong. Probably he is spent from the Vuelta. I thought he'll still be good in the ITT and in Lombardia. I guess not. Great season for him, looking forward to the next one.
There were reports in the Slovenian media that the Vuelta took a lot out of him. That he wasn't ready for the World Championships.

Still a good ride, all things considered. Too bad about his questionable behavior wrt Dennis. Proving Nibali right, I guess.
 
There were reports in the Slovenian media that the Vuelta took a lot out of him. That he wasn't ready for the World Championships.

Still a good ride, all things considered. Too bad about his questionable behavior wrt Dennis.

Definitely not his finest moment! I can understand his wanting to stay in contact to prove something to himself. But trying to pass him was unwarranted IMO.
 
Definitely not his finest moment! I can understand his wanting to stay in contact to prove something to himself. But trying to pass him was unwarranted IMO.
He said morally it was a big hit getting passed by Dennis that's why he wanted to get the same time (so that in his mind he didn't get passed).
He also mentioned that his power levels were as planned, not sure what he meant by that really, clearly he couldn't have planned to win with those levels.
 
He said morally it was a big hit getting passed by Dennis that's why he wanted to get the same time (so that in his mind he didn't get passed).
He also mentioned that his power levels were as planned, not sure what he meant by that really, clearly he couldn't have planned to win with those levels.
Thanks, I can understand the morale hit. But even if he crossed the line with Dennis he was still 3 minutes down.

It didn't 'look' good. Let the man celebrate his Worlds Win!

Maybe something was lost in translation about power levels or was he speaking English? Even if he was it is still difficult sometimes to get his meaning :).
 
I just think Primož had a really hard final week in the Vuelta. He crashed for the third time, and the riding was hard all the way through stage 20. He really did look exhausted finishing that stage and did great to win GC, but the body was probably saying "enough for a while." Regarding the finish with Rohan Dennis in the ITT today, I'm going to give Roglic a pass on that. He remains very competitive. I also think he is an introvert, and his entire line of thinking was probably focused on giving as much effort as he could (when it would have looked better if he could have just accepted reality and laid back a bit in the final 50 meters or so to give Rohan his due). I don't think it was intended to be an unsporting move. If something like that happens again, maybe Roglic will approach it differently (not that I expect to see this happen again).
 
I just think Primož had a really hard final week in the Vuelta. He crashed for the third time, and the riding was hard all the way through stage 20. He really did look exhausted finishing that stage and did great to win GC, but the body was probably saying "enough for a while."
We knew that when he pulled out of the Team Relay citing he wasn't recovered from the Vuelta.

He has shown us he's a much better TTer when fresh than when he's tired and recovering from crashes.
 
A race too far but he has been hot since the start of the year (UAE Tour). The length of the ITT and the tough course proved too much. Just goes to show what an underrated ride Froome did in 2017 to take bronze behind Big Tom and Rogla after completing the Tour-Vuelta double.
 
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Just viewed the TT again. I like PR in general, but it is a bit beyond a last minute brain f@rt to have kept so much in the frame. He was more or less tagging on to RD for quite a number of km, so with the finish in sight, staying to one side, even if not backing off pace, would have been good enough. May not have had intent behind it, but douchie none-the-less. :p
 
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What i feel happen is Roglič and his coach decided, to start relatively slow, due to the length of the time trial. Likely due to the fact, Roglič didn't prepare for this race, as a podium contender should. At minimum two months of preparations. The competition went in full gas. The rest is history.

It would be hard to win this year. Rohan Dennis had to prove something to himself and to the rest of the world. And he did manage to do that. As for Roglič staying close to Dennis. Likely that was just about gathering some useful data and experience for the future races. Roglič likes to test himself against the best. This year and on this race Rohan Dennis was the best.
 
Don't think it was a deliberate slow start. There's just a very big difference between one day ITTs and stage race ITTs, and different riders perform very differently in buildup, at peak, and after peak.

Especially in an ITT like this you have to be mentally ready to put yourself through a mountain of pain and Roglic probably didn't have the morale to do so until he saw Dennis flying by.
 
What i feel happen is Roglič and his coach decided, to start relatively slow, due to the length of the time trial. Likely due to the fact, Roglič didn't prepare for this race, as a podium contender should. At minimum two months of preparations. The competition went in full gas. The rest is history.

It would be hard to win this year. Rohan Dennis had to prove something to himself and to the rest of the world. And he did manage to do that. As for Roglič staying close to Dennis. Likely that was just about gathering some useful data and experience for the future races. Roglič likes to test himself against the best. This year and on this race Rohan Dennis was the best.
Don't think it was a deliberate slow start. There's just a very big difference between one day ITTs and stage race ITTs, and different riders perform very differently in buildup, at peak, and after peak.

Especially in an ITT like this you have to be mentally ready to put yourself through a mountain of pain and Roglic probably didn't have the morale to do so until he saw Dennis flying by.
Things I don't understand:
Roglič has said multiple times after the ITT that he actually could hold the wattage he wanted to and that he executed the tactics he and his coach decided before the race. So he wasn't that disappointed after the ride.

This is where it gets complicated for me to understand. He was openly aiming for a medal before the event. Preferably gold because he already has silver. Did he really think those watts would bring him gold? How can he miscalculate it for 3 minutes? Maybe you can if you don't have enough experience. But here we are talking about a multiple ITT stage winner. He has won short, long, flat, hilly time trials in his career, four of them just this season. He beat Bevin, Craddock and Oliveira comfortably just a couple of weeks ago during the Vuelta. In Harrogate it was the other way around.

It's different in stage races, you say. I know. But shouldn't a ITT during the 2nd or 3rd week of a GT penalise even more GC riders who fight day in and day out to stay in front on every stage. Non GC riders (who aim for a TT) on the other end can just pick a spot or two where they show themselves otherwise they just try to preserve as much energy as possible to perform well in the ITT stage.

One explanation could be that the ITT specialists are that much better prepared for Worlds than they are for time trials during the rest of the season. This could be true but I don't think there's a big difference if any. Let's take a look at this year's Tour de Romandie. Campenaerts was in super form at the time. He'd just beaten the hour record a couple of weeks earlier. I think we can all agree that he is one of the best TT riders in the World right now, probably top 5. He would probably take the bronze without the misfortunes at the WC. In Romandie he and some other ITT specialists (Ganna, Kung, Martin, Bevin) were comfortably beaten by Roglič on a course that was similar to the one in Harrogate as far as altimetry goes (just 3 times shorter lol).

So the most logical explanation is that Roglič actually lied about the watts after the ITT Elite race. He was physically and especially mentally spent after the Vuelta. Only when he saw Dennis in front of him, he could push the way he was supposed to, but it was too late.
 
Things I don't understand:
Roglič has said multiple times after the ITT that he actually could hold the wattage he wanted to and that he executed the tactics he and his coach decided before the race. So he wasn't that disappointed after the ride.

This is where it gets complicated for me to understand. He was openly aiming for a medal before the event. Preferably gold because he already has silver. Did he really think those watts would bring him gold? How can he miscalculate it for 3 minutes? Maybe you can if you don't have enough experience. But here we are talking about a multiple ITT stage winner. He has won short, long, flat, hilly time trials in his career, four of them just this season. He beat Bevin, Craddock and Oliveira comfortably just a couple of weeks ago during the Vuelta. In Harrogate it was the other way around.

It's different in stage races, you say. I know. But shouldn't a ITT during the 2nd or 3rd week of a GT penalise even more GC riders who fight day in and day out to stay in front on every stage. Non GC riders (who aim for a TT) on the other end can just pick a spot or two where they show themselves otherwise they just try to preserve as much energy as possible to perform well in the ITT stage.

One explanation could be that the ITT specialists are that much better prepared for Worlds than they are for time trials during the rest of the season. This could be true but I don't think there's a big difference if any. Let's take a look at this year's Tour de Romandie. Campenaerts was in super form at the time. He'd just beaten the hour record a couple of weeks earlier. I think we can all agree that he is one of the best TT riders in the World right now, probably top 5. He would probably take the bronze without the misfortunes at the WC. In Romandie he and some other ITT specialists (Ganna, Kung, Martin, Bevin) were comfortably beaten by Roglič on a course that was similar to the one in Harrogate as far as altimetry goes (just 3 times shorter lol).

So the most logical explanation is that Roglič actually lied about the watts after the ITT Elite race. He was physically and especially mentally spent after the Vuelta. Only when he saw Dennis in front of him, he could push the way he was supposed to, but it was too late.
  1. They probably looked at the WT ITTs Roglic usually wins and extrapolated from that, indeed missing the big difference between a one day ITT and an ITT after a few days in a stage race. Maybe he did indeed perform in line with his Vuelta ITT win, but that was a much worse field after 10 days.
  2. It was a really long ITT, 3 minutes isn't as big of a difference as it seems.
  3. Required ITT power outputs are probably pretty hard to estimate given parcours change and some riders keep their ITT powers secret cause it indirectly says something about the aerodynamics.
  4. Rohan Dennis is a best. Roglic was barely a minute from bronze.
  5. Roglic rode significantly faster after he was caught compared to before, despite the fact he was probably up to date on intermediate times, which leads me to believe it was partially a mental issue.
  6. Roglic still has 2 weeks of racing left on the season. This could simply be a lie to save face and keep up some expectations for the rest of the season.
 

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