U23 races and talents

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Re:

Bushman said:
Bernal surely must be the top favourite for the race, no? With Mas as his main threat and then the likes of Geoghegan Hart, Frankiny, Lambrecht and Schackmann and a couple of French guys there trying to spoil the party.

Will Powless go from US team? Would be interesting to see him there
It's way to early for Lambrecht to have a chance here. I wouldn't underestimate the American team with Powless and Costa.
 
Jun 30, 2014
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Re:

Bushman said:
Bernal surely must be the top favourite for the race, no? With Mas as his main threat and then the likes of Geoghegan Hart, Frankiny, Lambrecht and Schackmann and a couple of French guys there trying to spoil the party.

Will Powless go from US team? Would be interesting to see him there
Mas could be a bit tired after Aosta and winning the Tour de Savoie Mont Blanc before it.
Bernal should be th favourite, but Tao Geoghegan Hart and the American team could also do well, maybe Kämna and Schachmann will do well, I don't really know much about the French riders. No idea what to expect from the Italian team, maybe Carboni could do something.
I have to agree with Ryo, the Colombian team looks really odd, but the whole situation between the federation and Saldarriaga seems to be a mess.
 
Re: Re:

Bye Bye Bicycle said:
Samamba said:
It's way to early for Lambrecht to have a chance here. I wouldn't underestimate the American team with Powless and Costa.
Lambrecht is four months older then Costa. :eek:
Costa is more talented... Lambrecht had a great year but he was only 10th in the Savoie en Aosta. Thats great for a first year but not good enough to have a chance in the tour de l'avenir. Plus there is a timetrial that suits Costa way more than Lambrecht.
 
Re: Re:

Mayomaniac said:
Bushman said:
Bernal surely must be the top favourite for the race, no? With Mas as his main threat and then the likes of Geoghegan Hart, Frankiny, Lambrecht and Schackmann and a couple of French guys there trying to spoil the party.

Will Powless go from US team? Would be interesting to see him there
Mas could be a bit tired after Aosta and winning the Tour de Savoie Mont Blanc before it.
Bernal should be th favourite, but Tao Geoghegan Hart and the American team could also do well, maybe Kämna and Schachmann will do well, I don't really know much about the French riders. No idea what to expect from the Italian team, maybe Carboni could do something.
I have to agree with Ryo, the Colombian team looks really odd, but the whole situation between the federation and Saldarriaga seems to be a mess.
Carboni isn't good enough, maybe Ravasi if he doesn't have his typical bad day. Bernal is the favorite but the TT is way better for the Americans, Tao, Mas and ofcourse Schachmann but I don't think he's gonna make it in the mountains. Kamna didn't do anything this year.

For the French. I expect guys like Gaudu, Leo Vincent and Paret Peintre. Gaudu and Vincent are good enough to win a stage but are probably gonna focus on their pro team now cause they will be a stagiair so I don't know how good they are gonna be in l'Avenir.
 
Jun 30, 2014
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Re: Re:

Samamba said:
Mayomaniac said:
Bushman said:
Bernal surely must be the top favourite for the race, no? With Mas as his main threat and then the likes of Geoghegan Hart, Frankiny, Lambrecht and Schackmann and a couple of French guys there trying to spoil the party.

Will Powless go from US team? Would be interesting to see him there
Mas could be a bit tired after Aosta and winning the Tour de Savoie Mont Blanc before it.
Bernal should be th favourite, but Tao Geoghegan Hart and the American team could also do well, maybe Kämna and Schachmann will do well, I don't really know much about the French riders. No idea what to expect from the Italian team, maybe Carboni could do something.
I have to agree with Ryo, the Colombian team looks really odd, but the whole situation between the federation and Saldarriaga seems to be a mess.
Carboni isn't good enough, maybe Ravasi if he doesn't have his typical bad day. Bernal is the favorite but the TT is way better for the Americans, Tao, Mas and ofcourse Schachmann but I don't think he's gonna make it in the mountains. Kamna didn't do anything this year.

For the French. I expect guys like Gaudu, Leo Vincent and Paret Peintre. Gaudu and Vincent are good enough to win a stage but are probably gonna focus on their pro team now cause they will be a stagiair so I don't know how good they are gonna be in l'Avenir.
I don't know if Ravasi is that much better than Carboni, Carboni is also one year younger, a pretty good TT rider and hasn't raced the Giro Ciclistico della Valle d'Aosta right before it and the race is a really big deal for Colpack, so maybe he already peaked for that race.
 
Re: Re:

Mayomaniac said:
Bushman said:
Bernal surely must be the top favourite for the race, no? With Mas as his main threat and then the likes of Geoghegan Hart, Frankiny, Lambrecht and Schackmann and a couple of French guys there trying to spoil the party.

Will Powless go from US team? Would be interesting to see him there
Mas could be a bit tired after Aosta and winning the Tour de Savoie Mont Blanc before it.
Bernal should be th favourite, but Tao Geoghegan Hart and the American team could also do well, maybe Kämna and Schachmann will do well, I don't really know much about the French riders. No idea what to expect from the Italian team, maybe Carboni could do something.
I have to agree with Ryo, the Colombian team looks really odd, but the whole situation between the federation and Saldarriaga seems to be a mess.
Paredes is there from Manzana, he is a motor for the flat/hills guess that is why he is selected. Maybe Reyes and Aguirre did not want to peak for avenir because of Vuelta Colombia/Aosta and soon Juventud or Savoie, thats a big block or racing for guys this age.
Florez showed his climbing skills in Portugal where he had to abandon in the leaders jersey due to sickness. Sosa is an excellent climber and he has been doing well in Italy so far this year. I just dont like the selection of Rodriguez for reasons I will not mention on this forum. But in general I dont think the selection is that weird besides Reyes/Aguirre but as said there could be an explanation for that.
 
Maxi Schachmann repeats his stunt from Aosta by winning today's MTF in Alsace after being in the breakaway all day long - this time he's the overall leader as well. Huge step for him this year from being a ITT expert to winning stages like this.
 
Jun 30, 2014
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Bye Bye Bicycle said:
Maxi Schachmann repeats his stunt from Aosta by winning today's MTF in Alsace after being in the breakaway all day long - this time he's the overall leader as well. Huge step for him this year from being a ITT expert to winning stages like this.
Nice to see him doing well after that horror crash a few years ago, he suffered a skull fracture and a cerebral haemorrhage, but he was abe to come back.
 
So after winning on the Piani di Tavagnasco, Max Schachmann won the queen stage in the Tour d'Alsace today after being in a 5-man breakaway all day. He's probably gonna win the overall too. Really big win for the German showing why he got a pro contract from Lefevre. Disappointment of the day (apart from Mas maybe but he is probably preparing for the Tour de l'Avenir) was Aldemar Reyes who was in the breakaway too (he even had a teammate). He couldn't follow Schachmann & Davies (who came 2nd) and was even overruled by some guys of the bunch.

Honorable mention for the only 19 year old Harm Vanhoucke (Lotto Soudal) who came in first of the bunch crushing the other guys (apart from Frankiny who was only five seconds down). It looks like Lotto Soudal u23 is gonna have a brilliant team for the mountains next year with Lambrecht (if he stays), Cras, Vanhoucke, Vereecken (a bit under the radar but also pretty good for a first year) and maybe some new guy that comes from the junior category (although LTS u23 is focusing more on contracting fast guys like Gerben Thijsen).
 
Jun 30, 2014
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To be fair, Reyes is probably a bit tired after riding the Vuelta a Colombia, the GP Internacional Torres Vedras and Aosta for gc (he also got 4th in the Ronde de l'Isard before the Vuelta), he's probably just a bit worn out.
 
Re:

Mayomaniac said:
To be fair, Reyes is probably a bit tired after riding the Vuelta a Colombia, the GP Internacional Torres Vedras and Aosta for gc (he also got 4th in the Ronde de l'Isard before the Vuelta), he's probably just a bit worn out.
Yeah probably, but still when I saw the breakaway I really thought he was gonna win. But maybe going in the break instead of waiting was already a sign that he hadn't the best legs.
 
Jul 29, 2016
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Valv.Piti said:
Getting very educated here, would otherwise know jackshit about the U23-scene. Thanks guys! So who is the favourite in l'Avenir - Mas, Bernal, Frankiny...?
Time Trial will be key before the Alps, and best Time Trialists are Geoghegan Hart and Mas who for me are alongside Bernal the main favourites.
Between the other contenders Frankiny really lacks on the TT, also i think the swiss is a bit overrated since he's far from the inspiration days of Mas and Ravasi who for me are the best pure climbers right now on the category. On the french side Vincent is good but not Top climber, Gaudu is a Warren Barguil rider type so the mountains are too long for him. Ravasi is more than a bit irregular but has super engine that can perform great on those long alpine climbs so he'll be a tough competitor for stage wins and maybe podium threat. Lambrecht and Costa still very young for aiming overall i think not really prepared yet.

So yes my money is on Mas or Geoghegan Hart unless Bernal superperform on the mountains.
 
Jun 30, 2014
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Re: Re:

Charly_Gaul said:
Valv.Piti said:
Getting very educated here, would otherwise know jackshit about the U23-scene. Thanks guys! So who is the favourite in l'Avenir - Mas, Bernal, Frankiny...?
Time Trial will be key before the Alps, and the best Time Trialists are Geoghegan Hart and Mas who for me are alongside Bernal the main favourites.
Between the other contenders Frankiny really lacks on the TT, also i think the swiss is a bit overrated sice he's far from the inspiration days of Mas and Ravasi who for me are the best pure climbers right now on the category. On the french side Vincent is good but not Top climber, Gaudun is a Warren Barguil rider type so the mountains are too long for him. Ravasi is more than a bit irregular but has super engine that can perform great on those long alpine climbs so he'll be a tough competitor for stage wins and maybe podium threat. Lambrecht and Costa still very young for aiming overall i think not really prepared yet.
Yeah, it's probably going to be a fight beetween those 3 guys for the overall win.
Frankiny can have bad days in the mountains (he cracked on the final stage of Aosta and was lucky that Mas had lost a minute because of a mechanical), but Ravasi is also a rider who can be brilliant in the mountains, but often has one bad day in those races.
Giovanni Carboni is a young Italian rider (one year younger than Ravasi) whou could surprise people, he's strong allrounder who's good at climbing and good in time trials. I don't expect him to fight for the win, but top 10 is a realistic goal for him, maybe even top 5.
No idea what to expect from the Germans, Schachmann should be tired and while I had really high hopes for Kämna his season has been rather unimpressive so far, but at the start of the season he said that he wants to peak for this race, so it's hard to say.
 
Re: Re:

Mayomaniac said:
Charly_Gaul said:
Valv.Piti said:
Getting very educated here, would otherwise know jackshit about the U23-scene. Thanks guys! So who is the favourite in l'Avenir - Mas, Bernal, Frankiny...?
Time Trial will be key before the Alps, and the best Time Trialists are Geoghegan Hart and Mas who for me are alongside Bernal the main favourites.
Between the other contenders Frankiny really lacks on the TT, also i think the swiss is a bit overrated sice he's far from the inspiration days of Mas and Ravasi who for me are the best pure climbers right now on the category. On the french side Vincent is good but not Top climber, Gaudun is a Warren Barguil rider type so the mountains are too long for him. Ravasi is more than a bit irregular but has super engine that can perform great on those long alpine climbs so he'll be a tough competitor for stage wins and maybe podium threat. Lambrecht and Costa still very young for aiming overall i think not really prepared yet.
Yeah, it's probably going to be a fight beetween those 3 guys for the overall win.
Frankiny can have bad days in the mountains (he cracked on the final stage of Aosta and was lucky that Mas had lost a minute because of a mechanical), but Ravasi is also a rider who can be brilliant in the mountains, but often has one bad day in those races.
Giovanni Carboni is a young Italian rider (one year younger than Ravasi) whou could surprise people, he's strong allrounder who's good at climbing and good in time trials. I don't expect him to fight for the win, but top 10 is a realistic goal for him, maybe even top 5.
No idea what to expect from the Germans, Schachmann should be tired and while I had really high hopes for Kämna his season has been rather unimpressive so far, but at the start of the season he said that he wants to peak for this race, so it's hard to say.

Carbonni has been doing great among pros already, I think Italy will be good if they bring him, Ravasi, and Consonni for sprints. Any good Russians riding? They seem to always fly under the radar until this race, do well, and then fly under the radar again (Foliforov is starting to become good though).
 
Jul 29, 2016
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Re: Re:

Mayomaniac said:
Samamba said:
Mayomaniac said:
Bushman said:
Bernal surely must be the top favourite for the race, no? With Mas as his main threat and then the likes of Geoghegan Hart, Frankiny, Lambrecht and Schackmann and a couple of French guys there trying to spoil the party.

Will Powless go from US team? Would be interesting to see him there
Mas could be a bit tired after Aosta and winning the Tour de Savoie Mont Blanc before it.
Bernal should be th favourite, but Tao Geoghegan Hart and the American team could also do well, maybe Kämna and Schachmann will do well, I don't really know much about the French riders. No idea what to expect from the Italian team, maybe Carboni could do something.
I have to agree with Ryo, the Colombian team looks really odd, but the whole situation between the federation and Saldarriaga seems to be a mess.
Carboni isn't good enough, maybe Ravasi if he doesn't have his typical bad day. Bernal is the favorite but the TT is way better for the Americans, Tao, Mas and ofcourse Schachmann but I don't think he's gonna make it in the mountains. Kamna didn't do anything this year.

For the French. I expect guys like Gaudu, Leo Vincent and Paret Peintre. Gaudu and Vincent are good enough to win a stage but are probably gonna focus on their pro team now cause they will be a stagiair so I don't know how good they are gonna be in l'Avenir.
I don't know if Ravasi is that much better than Carboni, Carboni is also one year younger, a pretty good TT rider and hasn't raced the Giro Ciclistico della Valle d'Aosta right before it and the race is a really big deal for Colpack, so maybe he already peaked for that race.
I think Ravasi is clearly the preminent of the two, has already shone on Trentino also we should not miss the fact that he was in position to completely SMASH the Giro Valle d'Aosta queen stage, but he was forced to slow down several times on Cervinia final ascent due to Padun weakness. I estimate that he would have won the stage by 20" advantage to Mas and 30" to Padun more or less.
Must be for me Italy GC leader.
 
Re:

TMP402 said:
Any opinions on Davies? I thought he was a TTist but clearly he can climb too.
Decent climber (already won the queen stage in the Ronde de l'Isard if I'm right), but still more of a TTer. His engine helps him to do long range attacks, but he can't follow accelerations when he's with the favourites.
 
Re: Re:

BalearicBeats said:
Mayomaniac said:
Charly_Gaul said:
Valv.Piti said:
Getting very educated here, would otherwise know jackshit about the U23-scene. Thanks guys! So who is the favourite in l'Avenir - Mas, Bernal, Frankiny...?
Time Trial will be key before the Alps, and the best Time Trialists are Geoghegan Hart and Mas who for me are alongside Bernal the main favourites.
Between the other contenders Frankiny really lacks on the TT, also i think the swiss is a bit overrated sice he's far from the inspiration days of Mas and Ravasi who for me are the best pure climbers right now on the category. On the french side Vincent is good but not Top climber, Gaudun is a Warren Barguil rider type so the mountains are too long for him. Ravasi is more than a bit irregular but has super engine that can perform great on those long alpine climbs so he'll be a tough competitor for stage wins and maybe podium threat. Lambrecht and Costa still very young for aiming overall i think not really prepared yet.
Yeah, it's probably going to be a fight beetween those 3 guys for the overall win.
Frankiny can have bad days in the mountains (he cracked on the final stage of Aosta and was lucky that Mas had lost a minute because of a mechanical), but Ravasi is also a rider who can be brilliant in the mountains, but often has one bad day in those races.
Giovanni Carboni is a young Italian rider (one year younger than Ravasi) whou could surprise people, he's strong allrounder who's good at climbing and good in time trials. I don't expect him to fight for the win, but top 10 is a realistic goal for him, maybe even top 5.
No idea what to expect from the Germans, Schachmann should be tired and while I had really high hopes for Kämna his season has been rather unimpressive so far, but at the start of the season he said that he wants to peak for this race, so it's hard to say.

Carbonni has been doing great among pros already, I think Italy will be good if they bring him, Ravasi, and Consonni for sprints. Any good Russians riding? They seem to always fly under the radar until this race, do well, and then fly under the radar again (Foliforov is starting to become good though).
Maybe Cherkasov for a top 10 but I don't think he can hold on for a week.
 
Re: Re:

Charly_Gaul said:
Valv.Piti said:
Getting very educated here, would otherwise know jackshit about the U23-scene. Thanks guys! So who is the favourite in l'Avenir - Mas, Bernal, Frankiny...?
Time Trial will be key before the Alps, and best Time Trialists are Geoghegan Hart and Mas who for me are alongside Bernal the main favourites.
Between the other contenders Frankiny really lacks on the TT, also i think the swiss is a bit overrated since he's far from the inspiration days of Mas and Ravasi who for me are the best pure climbers right now on the category. On the french side Vincent is good but not Top climber, Gaudu is a Warren Barguil rider type so the mountains are too long for him. Ravasi is more than a bit irregular but has super engine that can perform great on those long alpine climbs so he'll be a tough competitor for stage wins and maybe podium threat. Lambrecht and Costa still very young for aiming overall i think not really prepared yet.

So yes my money is on Mas or Geoghegan Hart unless Bernal superperform on the mountains.
Lambrecht won't ride the Tour de l'Avenir. He wants to be European Champion in September.
 

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