United Kingdom | 6 TDF Wins in 10 Years?

Sep 15, 2010
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After none over the last 100+ years?

(6 in 7! I stand corrected!)

Oh boy... What is the probability? Statisticians/Gamblers can you calculate the odds?

Discuss.

By the way, inspired by Wales!

I hope GT is clean... but... hard to believe in miracles.
 
May 21, 2010
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Thomas will be clean british winner untill he gets poped and then he will be dirty welsh sheepshagger
 
Decades of immensely promising French riders training for GTs all their life to finally break the French duck at the race that is the pride of the nation and UK just saunters along and does it three times with a couple of track guys and a domestique.
 
Jul 24, 2015
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Saint Unix said:
Decades of immensely promising French riders training for GTs all their life to finally break the French duck at the race that is the pride of the nation and UK just saunters along and does it three times with a couple of track guys and a domestique.
In all fairness, the French duck at the race indicates that whatever their riders were doing over recent decades might not have been ideal.
 
Thomas would get popped pretty soon after the Tour had Froome finished second so that the UCI can have their cake and eat it but they cannot allow that to happen now as Dumoulin would win.
 
Aug 2, 2012
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brownbobby said:
Awesome....so what new angle are we going to use the bash the Brits/Sky in this thread that we haven’t covered in the previous ones?
actually ........3 different winners in so few years is rather surprising

so have team sky beaten the odds and found 3 perfect responders?

do team sky have a magic cocktail and could in fact turn any decent pro into a tour winner?

in a clean race it's the marginal gains/ dedication of all involved making it possible?

Mark L
 
Sep 27, 2017
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ebandit said:
brownbobby said:
Awesome....so what new angle are we going to use the bash the Brits/Sky in this thread that we haven’t covered in the previous ones?
actually ........3 different winners in so few years is rather surprising

so have team sky beaten the odds and found 3 perfect responders?

do team sky have a magic cocktail and could in fact turn any decent pro into a tour winner?

in a clean race it's the marginal gains/ dedication of all involved making it possible?

Mark L
Yep, all legitimate questions debated endlessly in every other Froome/Wiggins/Thomas/Sky/Brits don’t dope threads...but eh why not have another option, can never have too many I guess
 
Aug 2, 2012
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brownbobby said:
Actually, to be accurate shouldn’t it be 6 TDF wins in 7 years?
optimism! 3 next winners will be french............and ALL fully signed up members of MPCC

Mark L
 
TubularBills said:
After none over the last 100+ years?
Producing three different individual winners is much more surprising.

The next Eddy Merckx could be sitting on a bicycle for the first time right now, and a mega talent who wins 5 Tours in a row can come from anywhere. But having three different guys win Tour de Frances in such a short amount of time?

When no Frenchman has won the Tour in 30 years, no Dutch no Belgian in 40, only two different Italians in 50 years, only one German ever?
I mean, potential Tour de France winners are really rare...
 
Aug 15, 2016
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The case for the defence here is that you could equally write this as "6 TDF wins for Team Sky in 7 years". But I take the point - it's part of a wider context. It's Cavendish. It's the Yates brothers. It's the track cycling team since Sydney. It's Britain's unprecedented success in other sports at the same time. If sport in the late 2000s belonged to Spain and the early 2000s belonged to Australia, the mid-2010s has been Britain's

I think I must be one of the few sceptics that doesn't believe each of the three winners' transformations are as inexplicable as some make out. I mean yeah, they're all incredibly suspicious. But I do think their pre-Sky successes (on the track for Wiggins and Thomas, and at the Commonwealth Games for Froome) count for something, even if it isn't much

Wiggins is the interesting one for me. Even if his final step up came at Sky, he was still living with Contador, the Schlecks and Lance at the 2009 Tour while still at Garmin. It was one of the most bizarre, inexplicable performances at the Tour I can remember, because it largely came out of nowhere. And yet later he proved it wasn't a total fluke. I suppose the great What If is if he'd avoided trouble in 2011 - history since then suggests he may have had a good chance of winning it

Over time I've learned to accept the cognitive dissonance that you need to put up with all of this. But there does need to be a bit of a change, and certainly more competition. Once again we've had a Sky rider win the Tour without really being attacked or facing too much of a challenge. That's the big issue for me. But granted, Froome went out and won the Giro himself - in that performance, he proved a lot more than he ever did winning his Tours, because he actually went on the offensive for once

That sort of thing matters more to me than team or nationality - it's the manner of the victory that makes the difference. Michael Schumacher made F1 boring not just by winning 5 years in a row but the way he won. Similarly, Sky winning the Tour every year hasn't been boring in and of itself, but the way they have won it has been totally tedious. That's the bigger issue for the sport of cycling - its headline event has been turned into a procession because of the way Sky have controlled it and the way other teams have been too weak or cowardly to challenge them
 
Sep 15, 2010
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spalco said:
TubularBills said:
After none over the last 100+ years?
Producing three different individual winners is much more surprising.

The next Eddy Merckx could be sitting on a bicycle for the first time right now, and a mega talent who wins 5 Tours in a row can come from anywhere. But having three different guys win Tour de Frances in such a short amount of time?

When no Frenchman has won the Tour in 30 years, no Dutch no Belgian in 40, only two different Italians in 50 years, only one German ever?
I mean, potential Tour de France winners are really rare...
Great Points!

Regarding nationalism... It seems reminiscent and familiar... Imperialist Doping? We do have a global history for evidence...

What have we called it in the past? ...systemic... sophisticated...

Examples and historical evidence point to a clear determinant for unusual success that defies reason.
 
Sep 15, 2010
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staubsauger said:
Ain't it funny how the only Brit with natural talent to contest grand tours, Pete Kennaugh, ended up with absolutely zero achievements in them!?
Could you expand on Pete?

Not familiar.

Another Tyler Phinney?

Hopefully!
 
i remember laughing when Sky announced they wanted to win the Tour with a British rider in 5 years time.

It seemed so far fetched with the talent they had at their disposal at that time (climbing wise especially). Now look who's laughing. They now won the Tour with 3 british riders. 2 of them ex-track olympic champions as well. And 1 freak of nature.

Wonder who's next.
Tao?
Stephen Williams?
Or good ol Harry Tanfield?
 
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Dekker_Tifosi said:
i remember laughing when Sky announced they wanted to win the Tour with a British rider in 5 years time.

It seemed so far fetched with the talent they had at their disposal at that time (climbing wise especially). Now look who's laughing. They now won the Tour with 3 british riders. 2 of them ex-track olympic champions as well. And 1 freak of nature.

Wonder who's next.
Tao?
Stephen Williams?
Or good ol Harry Tanfield?
All thanks to hard work, attention to details and sports science according to blind British fans. Frankly the arrogance with which they think they can manufacture Grand Tour winners is sickening. Time for a Zwift session I think.
 
Sep 15, 2010
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Bwlch y Groes said:
The case for the defence here is that you could equally write this as "6 TDF wins for Team Sky in 7 years". But I take the point - it's part of a wider context. It's Cavendish. It's the Yates brothers. It's the track cycling team since Sydney. It's Britain's unprecedented success in other sports at the same time. If sport in the late 2000s belonged to Spain and the early 2000s belonged to Australia, the mid-2010s has been Britain's

I think I must be one of the few sceptics that doesn't believe each of the three winners' transformations are as inexplicable as some make out. I mean yeah, they're all incredibly suspicious. But I do think their pre-Sky successes (on the track for Wiggins and Thomas, and at the Commonwealth Games for Froome) count for something, even if it isn't much

Wiggins is the interesting one for me. Even if his final step up came at Sky, he was still living with Contador, the Schlecks and Lance at the 2009 Tour while still at Garmin. It was one of the most bizarre, inexplicable performances at the Tour I can remember, because it largely came out of nowhere. And yet later he proved it wasn't a total fluke. I suppose the great What If is if he'd avoided trouble in 2011 - history since then suggests he may have had a good chance of winning it

Over time I've learned to accept the cognitive dissonance that you need to put up with all of this. But there does need to be a bit of a change, and certainly more competition. Once again we've had a Sky rider win the Tour without really being attacked or facing too much of a challenge. That's the big issue for me. But granted, Froome went out and won the Giro himself - in that performance, he proved a lot more than he ever did winning his Tours, because he actually went on the offensive for once

That sort of thing matters more to me than team or nationality - it's the manner of the victory that makes the difference. Michael Schumacher made F1 boring not just by winning 5 years in a row but the way he won. Similarly, Sky winning the Tour every year hasn't been boring in and of itself, but the way they have won it has been totally tedious. That's the bigger issue for the sport of cycling - its headline event has been turned into a procession because of the way Sky have controlled it and the way other teams have been too weak or cowardly to challenge them
Wow!

Great post with heartfelt insights... thought provoking...

Maybe? They're all just honest blokes, doing what they do best?

Winning 3-Week Tours...

With zero history.
 
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Bwlch y Groes said:
The case for the defence here is that you could equally write this as "6 TDF wins for Team Sky in 7 years". But I take the point - it's part of a wider context. It's Cavendish. It's the Yates brothers. It's the track cycling team since Sydney. It's Britain's unprecedented success in other sports at the same time. If sport in the late 2000s belonged to Spain and the early 2000s belonged to Australia, the mid-2010s has been Britain's
You can add China to that. Since Sydney they've been killing it at the Olympics, and especially at the Beijing Games, although to be fair they dominate in traditionally "Eastern" sports like martial arts, gymnastics, badminton, weightlifting and table tennis, as well as niche sports like diving and shooting, where the competition isn't as hard. Russia also killed it on their home turf in Sochi.

And we know how they did it. All the money and science in the world didn't stop Spain, Russia and China from relying heavily on the old dopity-dope-doping in the end, and Australian sport has its fair share of controversies. It isn't exactly a massive leap to assume that Team GB and Team Sky, behind the smokescreen of sports science and marginal gains, is just another country doping their athletes to the eyeballs to impress the home crowd at their Olympics, and that they're still reaping the benefits of it to this day.
 

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