What would you do if you INNOCENTLY tested positive?

[Inner Peace]

- You're a pro-cyclist riding on a Pro Tour team.
- You know the sport has a tainted past, present and possibly future.
- You know you have never touched drugs.
- You know that all it takes is an A-sample non-negative as "proof" of cheating.

I repeat, you absolutely know that YOU NEVER TOUCHED DRUGS...

...BUT

...WADA (or your national governing body) contacts you that you have tested positive for a banned substance in your A-sample.

...then


...WADA (---) contacts you that you have tested positive for a banned substance in your B-sample.

Again, you are 100% certain, that you never took drugs, and never would ever knowingly take drugs.

But, your A and B samples suggest otherwise.

Hence, you are guilty, you are fired from your team, you are given a two year suspension immediately.

So, WHAT WOULD YOU DO?

The thoughts going through my head are:

First instinct - The lab must have fcuked up. Bad call, as we know this excuse cannot prove innocence. BUT - it is a plausible possible explanation...

Second instinct - My team doped me without knowing. Bad call, Omerta hates this one. BUT - it is a plausible, possible explanation...

Third instinct - You unkowningly ingested the drug from a tainted supplement. Bad call, cyclists are not stoopid, they should read all labels carefully. BUT - it is a plausible, possible explanation...

Final instinct - Total conspiracy theory. You are the scapegoat. Bad call tho, makes you look crazy... BUT - it is a plausible, possible explanation...

The first three instinctual (is that a word?) responses have all been used in cycling and, as can be seen by the Zirbel threads, does not wash with the true cycling fans... BUT, EVEN IF IT IS THE SMALLEST PROBABILITY IMAGINABLE, ALL THOSE FIRST THREE RESPONSES ARE A SLIGHTLY POSSIBLE, PLAUSIBLE EXPLANATION OF WHAT HAPPENNED, BECOZ YOU KNOW IN YOUR HEART OF HEARTS YOU DID NOT DOPE!!!!

There must be a reasonable explanation for your positive test if you know you are clean!!!

Some would say I'm an ignorant fan, because I really do trust these guys when they claim there innocence, yet time and time again I am dissappointed when after a month or so from their B result, they confess...

But everytime a rider I kinda like tests positive, and I see them play dumb, I think to myself, what would I do if I tested positive, but I was absolutely sure I did not dope!!

What would you guys/girls do?

It's a scary thought really. It's like you actually saw an alien, but when you try to tell people, they think you're crazy.

Please help me understand what a SANE person would do to prove they were innocent when in fact the 'science' says they are not, and nobody believes your word against the science... You are literally stuck between a rock and a hard place (okay, metaphorically, not literally)

Thanks all...

I especially want to hear from those who regularly post in the Clinic as these will be the most interesting responses for me to read.

 

[issoisso]

Same thing I'd do if I saw a unicorn. Lay off the pipe.

 

[auscyclefan94]

Ask Lance...

 

[Inner Peace]

Same thing I'd do if I saw a unicorn. Lay off the pipe.

Ask Lance...

We don't need this thread to be about Lance, please.


I was really hoping for some serious discussion here (133 views and only 2 responses? c'mon guys!). The Clinic is the perfect place to discuss this kind of thing.

I was also hoping that the thread remain hypothetical and that we not refer to particular riders becoz then we will go off-track and people get their knicks twisted.

It would be a really difficult position to be in if you tested positive, but you knew you were innocent, right?

As I said, it's like you actually saw an alien (or a unicorn), you were completely sober when you saw it, you had no history of mental issues, yet you actually saw an alien (or unicorn)! How could you possibly convince people that you saw it?

Same as in alleged doping. How can you prove you are innocent, if you know you are innocent, yet the science says you are guilty?

I gave four options that are somewhat rational responses, yet they don't wash with the true fans becoz these instinctual responses have been used and abused by cheating drug takers...

so what do you do?

how do you respond to positive samples when you know you were clean?

 

[my username is flish]

this?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_mccann

 

[BroDeal]

You are basically screwed because of all those who have professed innocence in the past but found to be lying sacks. No one will believe you if you say are clean. If you use the wrong language when denying dope use then you risk being mocked and made the b-utt of jokes for years. Unless you are one of the riders near the top who get paid very well, the cost to fight charges will affect your ability to ride out the suspension.

Your best bet is probably to accept the charges after the B sample is found positive unless there is something obvious that caused a false positive. Make sure your ban starts as early as possible.

Having a "come to Jesus" conversion and becoming an outspoken and reformed anti-dope crusader like David Millar might not be a bad idea. Otherwise get some tats, a skanky girl, and make friends with Michael Ball.

Also it is a good idea to make sure your girlfriend does not test positive.

 

[blackcat]

hope to hell my reputation in a future career is not besmirched by this. Give up cycling.

 

[Susan Westemeyer]

This is actually a question I have wondered about in the past.

I would have to agree with this:

You are basically screwed because of all those who have professed innocence in the past but found to be lying sacks. No one will believe you if you say are clean. If you use the wrong language when denying dope use then you risk being mocked and made the b-utt of jokes for years. Unless you are one of the riders near the top who get paid very well, the cost to fight charges will affect your ability to ride out the suspension.

Your best bet is probably to accept the charges after the B sample is found positive unless there is something obvious that caused a false positive. Make sure your ban starts as early as possible.

Susan

 

[Wailing Floating Head]

Assuming that since I wasn't doping, my performance shouldn't be increased above normal levels. Upon my return to cycling I'd get stronger and faster than ever before, as well as following a very strict testing regimen that I would voluntarily make available for public viewing, all the while claiming my innocence.

There's a few reasonable outcomes in that event I suppose. Either people assume I wasn't doping and the test was bogus or that I was doping and now I've gotten stronger than I was while doping but clean.

Or, I suppose, they say I've been doping for my whole career and now I'm still doping and just hiding it better. That would blow.

 

[lostintime]

This question of "What would you do if you INNOCENTLY tested positive?" goes to the very core of each of us. Cycling may be the venue ..... but our view of life itself is the subject matter.

In particular to cycling ....... there are good guys(anti-dopers) vs. bad guys(dopers). They are one and same. Guilty. From the moment a cyclist consents to ride for a team, they are presumed guilty. From the moment a person consents to work for a anti-doping agency, all riders are presumed guilty. If a rider believes they are wrongly accused of guilt, the anti-doper is presumed guilty. There is just no end...... it's a closed loop of accusations and guilt.

Depending on my attachment to the sport and the guilt, walking away and/or taking the ban would likely be in my best interest.

 

[IntheMidwest]

Like Bro said above, they're not much you can do because of the past. Innocent or not, the media associated with the positive probably wouldn't help your case neither will the people's opinion's reading the news. Do the time as early as possible, make damn sure you know what's going into your body.

I'm going to throw this out there as well. As much as I want to believe Zirbel, I simply can't. Look at Joe Papp, same scenario. You just never know.

 

[BikeCentric]

Okay, as per the OP's request all the following assumes the rider to not knowingly take anything illegal of their own volition:

First off don't blame the lab - there is close to zero statistical probability that the lab screwed up. Second, request the test documents and have them reviewed by someone like Ashenden to ensure they were interpreted properly- this is a shot in the dark but you would want to cover all bases.

Next, if you tested positive for a drug that can be ingested orally then you must have ingested a tainted supplement or something your team gave you. Have all supplements you take tested and everything your team gave you to eat tested. This, as an aside, is another reason not to take supplements or munch random pills that your DS says "are good."

Next, if it is a blood-boosting drug that must be injected then you know your team doped you. This, as an aside, is another reason not to take injections. Determine whether or not you have the evidence to blow the whistle on your team and get them busted. If not, take your suspension immediately and decide whether it's time to hang up the bike as a pro or train for 2 years and come back.

 

[Cobblestones]

Inner Peace:

If I had experienced what you describe in the thread starter, there's only 2 conclusions: (i) genuine memory loss (ii) self delusion. Either way, you'd have to check yourself in a mental hospital.

 

[luckyboy]

Wouldn't you be thinking of actively stopping anything that might get you into that scenario in the first place? Don't take injections, don't take supplements. The Moncoutie way

 

[Dr. Maserati]

Okay, as per the OP's request all the following assumes the rider to not knowingly take anything illegal of their own volition:

First off don't blame the lab - there is close to zero statistical probability that the lab screwed up. Second, request the test documents and have them reviewed by someone like Ashenden to ensure they were interpreted properly- this is a shot in the dark but you would want to cover all bases.

Next, if you tested positive for a drug that can be ingested orally then you must have ingested a tainted supplement or something your team gave you. Have all supplements you take tested and everything your team gave you to eat tested. This, as an aside, is another reason not to take supplements or munch random pills that your DS says "are good."

Next, if it is a blood-boosting drug that must be injected then you know your team doped you. This, as an aside, is another reason not to take injections. Determine whether or not you have the evidence to blow the whistle on your team and get them busted. If not, take your suspension immediately and decide whether it's time to hang up the bike as a pro or train for 2 years and come back.

Excellent post - said it better than I could.

The only thing I would add to the OP's original hypothetical - is to find out all relevant information on the product you were caught for.

 

[ElChingon]

Eat it, say you did the deed and rat out all the riders that have beat you in the past year as fellow dopers. Then pass on the name of the local dunk as your supplier, turn in anyone who ever looked at you funny as casualties of the war on drugs. UCI goes on a month long investigation, you get a slap on the wrist as they decide even after water-boarding the others are not going to break and announce any additional info.

Then you donate any remaining funds you have even if its a couple quids to the UCI war on drugs. At every interview there after you denounce drugs and that you will not rest till its out of the sport! (all the time you just play xbox with your remaining friend).

After that you'll get the special call/message/note-on-rock to not beat anyone higher up on the omerta list to be allowed back in the real peleton. Once you satisfy the omerta quota you are allowed to race without any subsequent rock in window (figuratively speaking) and are helped by lower ranked riders on the omerta list, boosting your palarmes in the long run. Not to mention a healthy contract for a few more years if you're decent.

Remember you asked a general open ended question, don't get all riled up if you don't agree. Besides, it is what we see.

 

[Ninety5rpm]

Okay, as per the OP's request all the following assumes the rider to not knowingly take anything illegal of their own volition:

First off don't blame the lab - there is close to zero statistical probability that the lab screwed up. Second, request the test documents and have them reviewed by someone like Ashenden to ensure they were interpreted properly- this is a shot in the dark but you would want to cover all bases.

Next, if you tested positive for a drug that can be ingested orally then you must have ingested a tainted supplement or something your team gave you. Have all supplements you take tested and everything your team gave you to eat tested. This, as an aside, is another reason not to take supplements or munch random pills that your DS says "are good."

Next, if it is a blood-boosting drug that must be injected then you know your team doped you. This, as an aside, is another reason not to take injections. Determine whether or not you have the evidence to blow the whistle on your team and get them busted. If not, take your suspension immediately and decide whether it's time to hang up the bike as a pro or train for 2 years and come back.

+1

Well said.

 

[Clemson Cycling]

were there any doping convictions from that past that seemed somewhat fishy (there was a pretty legitimate chance that the rider really was clean)?

 

[Hugh Januss]

Perhaps a better question: Is it possible for a professional cyclist to "innocently" test positive?

 

[BikeCentric]

were there any doping convictions from that past that seemed somewhat fishy (there was a pretty legitimate chance that the rider really was clean)?

The only one I know of was Simoni for coke. And he got his ban turned over by getting some candy his Mom got him tested and sure enough the candy had cocaine in it.

 

[Dr. Maserati]

were there any doping convictions from that past that seemed somewhat fishy (there was a pretty legitimate chance that the rider really was clean)?

Actually I was thinking of pretty much the same question earlier today.

One point to note - the WADA code (to which the UCI use) is explicit, "Athletes are responsible for what they ingest and for the conduct of those Persons to whom they entrust access to their food and drink".
So - the old line of "I didn't know it was a banned product" does not wash anymore.

However - WADA has a provision 10.5.2 No Significant Fault or Negligence, if an athlete can prove they did not intentionally take or benefit then they may be able to get a reduced ban.

There have been a few athletes who have benefited from this - mainly showing contaminated products.

I would be interested to know if there is any case where an athlete has been completely cleared - not on a technicality - but where an obvious miscarriage of justice occurred?

 

[Alpe d'Huez]

Presuming you have no potentially tainted supplements to have tested, and didn't get any injections you can point to, you're going to have to say you don't know how it happened, but accept the tests and deal with the suspension, as BC and BroDeal said. During the time of your suspension, you could look into helping USADA/WADA, etc. to fight doping and making the sport cleaner. After all, you were riding clean, and being beaten by cheats. I'd also look into just how you actually ended up positive, and try to get that aspect of the test refined/fixed, if possible.

I think this brings up another point. Any rider today who is riding clean, really should speak out about it, and speak out against doping, and even volunteer for extra testing. The reason being that it would somewhat raise questions about your test. It would also give you the ability to completely break the omerta once you were positive and tell officials every last thing you saw or heard of, helping rid doping in the sport. No one would expect any less from you, actually, as you were anti-doping in the first place.

Although the test has since been verified, refined, and everything else, there were valid concerns and criticisms about EPO tests as recent as five years ago returning false positives. Worth a read. Please don't cherry pick from the article and extrapolate.

 

[IntheMidwest]

Just another thought, but most pro teams are sponsored by reputable supplement companies (i.e. cervelo & zipfit). Most of these companies should be well aware that professional athletes are using these products and are subject to controles. Not only that, that some products may or may not produce false positives for anabolic steroids but typicly have disclaimers all over them (i.e. Antonio Silva tested positive for boldenone and tried to blame it on Novedex XT - which can be bought at GNC here in the states). As along as you know exacly what goes into your body, like Simoni did with the candy, it could possibly be a saving grace for a legitimate accident. Bummer that sanctions cannot be undone in this case, only reduced.

 

[Martin318is]

I'd agree with a lot of comment about just copping the penalty and doing what you can to assist the drug fight.

However, my initial reaction in the background would be to make no initial declarations or loud protestations of innocence that claimed anyone else was at fault (such as team or lab). instead I would make a simple statement that I am surprised by the finding and will accept the penalty whilst working with WADA to determine the cause and then:

1) immediately get myself tested that very day and perhaps again over the next few days. BUT never, ever release the findings of these tests - they are to help me understand what is going on - publishing them would be dumb.

2) Make a list of everything I could think of that I ingested in the last few weeks and then use that to help me to think of anything I may have ingested in the weeks leading up to the positive test (If it was a race then this would need to include all the foods at team hotels, mussettes, etc).

3) Get anything from 2) that seemed a likely candidate tested

4) If in the unlikely event I did find the source, present that quietly to WADA/UCI etc and see what they say.


All of this does assume a couple of things though.

Firstly, that the thing I tested for is not CERA or some other clear cheat compound. By that I mean, that the positive is for something like testosterone or HGH or something that may have been added to a food or supplment during production and not a listed ingredient - not injected.

Secondly, that I haven't been dumb enough to take injections of ANYTHING other than tetanus,etc from a normal hospital (not a team doc).

 

[the big ring]

I am not a pro, yet have all the data files from all my training available from the last 4+ years since I got back on the bike. The last 2 years are power-based traning files. I can imagine with someone funding my cycling addiction, I personally, would have even better records.

I would also have all the blood test results from all the blood tests conducted for the last 4 years.

I would look at plotting training / stimulus vs response and show that my improvements or otherwise were natural and within normal parameters. I would also have no qualms posting my blood / urine test results online, and leaving them there even if they looked weird. I would do this from day 1 - before I mysteriously got done for doping.