Armstrong's lactate threshold

[SpartacusRox]

From Lance to Landis did not refer to a Scientific American study, but to one conducted by a physician whose name I do not recall.

The initial testing was done in 1992, I believe, and the subsequent testing in 1999. Lance claims that he dropped something like 20 lbs. in between, when in fact he actually had gained a bit.

I used to be a huge Lance fan - I even had lunch with him in 2001 - but I've since learned differently about professional cycling. I also reference Ricco, Basso, Ullrich, Pantani, Pellizotti, Hamilton, Valverde, Schumacher, Kohl, Philippe Gilbert (my prediction), etc., etc., etc.

It's a fascinating book, even if you don't believe the premise. I recommend it highly.

Read it. An entertaining read but from a legal standpoint about as watertight as a sieve. Plenty of dodgy extrapolation from ambiguous 'facts'...but yeah, an interesting premise. Perhaps I am just more balanced than some...I am cynical about both sides!

 

[petethedrummer]

1) Post Cancer Mind-Body Transformation

What is this body transformation? Did he take on superpowers from the radioactivity in the Chemo? Was he bitten by a radio active spider?

Seriously though, what is supposed to have changed in his physical make up post cancer?

 

[Eyjafjallajokull]

There is evidence that Armstrong lost weight from his mid 90s size. Frankie Andreu said LA bulked up during this period and started looking like a line backer. Pictures appear to back that up. Whatever his weight a decade before, I believe it's fair to say he lost a lot of that muscle post cancer as he focused on GC.

 

[Le breton]

What is this body transformation?
.........
Seriously though, what is supposed to have changed in his physical make up post cancer?

Nothing to do with cancer treatment.
He changed exactly like Jalabert did ( very fast, 1994 to 95)

It would seem that from having lots of fast-twitch fibers in his muscles in 96 he found himself with lots of slow twitch in 98.

Although L.A.'s efficiency gain is put in doubt by some people due to an error in the methodology used in the paper by Coyle purporting to prove it, there might have been some real gain.

HOWEVER, what is true is that he became unable to sprint decently anymore but gained elsewhere.
The comparison with Jalabert is striking, compare Jalabert pre 94 and Jalabert post-94.

Now, how do you do it is what I would like to know, although for myself I don't seem to have a single fast-twitch fiber in my make-up

 

[Parrot23]

Lance's weight loss post-cancer is not as important as the other factors that led to his TdF Dominance. I have ranked the factors below in order of importance, 1 being the most important:

1) Post Cancer Mind-Body Transformation
2) Lazer-Like Focus on the TdF
3) His Team Mates
4) Training Training Training Training
5) Training at Altitude
666) EPO/Blood Doping
7)Tactical Genius for a DS
8) Focus on Diet, Weighing his Food, Targeted Weight Loss
9) Higher Cadence
10) Sleeping in a Tent
11) Race Course Recons
12) Assos Chamois Creme
13) Inspiration & Motivation from the Fan's.

Hey, Polish, do you have any idea how FUNNY this is? Thanks for this wonderful list: had a great laugh. I don't even have to watch Letterman for his top 10. We need to get Dave L. to give his top 10 reasons for Lance's success.

Have you ever suspected that there are many, many other pros who have done all of this--and more, with far greater baseline physical gifts/genes than Lance has?

Keep these posts up; makes my day.

ROFLMAO

On the Mind-Body Transformation, I wonder if Deepak Chopra was involved? Maybe Madonna? Jim Carrey? Maybe the White House too: "Yes we can"? What about BP? They've been in the news recently; gotta be a link. Training on oil rigs the secret to success?

That said, Vino and some others (Menchov, Cancellara, etc.) make Lance look like a nun. My vote would be with Lance before those dudes, so don't count me a hater. If he's going to ride against those dirt-bags, I don't blame him.

 

[SpeedWay]

An absolute fail of a wiki article.


That lactate can be converted to glucose through gluconeogenesis is nothing new. Not so sure that's done directly in the mitochondria, though.

Lactic acid is not a protein as claimed. It's a carbohydrate.

The conversion is done in the liver as part of the Cori cycle. It basically acts as a gluconeogenic precursor to synthesis carbohydrate.

 

[syringelessss]

From a legal standpoint, From Lance to Landis is about as watertight as a submarine designed by the Fiat Spyder engineers.

But to me the book sounds, smells and reads like the truth, sort of like Global Warming, the Atkins diet being unhealthy and nuclear power being a ridiculous energy alternative.

Had the book been legally airtight, Lance would not be riding anymore and Radio Shack still would be selling cheap, Chinese quality garbage. Oh yeah, Radio Shack still does....

 

[TRDean]

The acidosis in muscle tissue is not the result of lactate production...and should not be called lactic threshold or lactic acid...actually the production of lactate consumes protons and slows down acidosis. Acidosis is caused by an increased reliance on nonmitochondrial ATP turnover...not lactate production.

 

[badboygolf16v]

the production of lactate consumes protons

I didn't realise I was nuclear powered. No wonder my legs hurt so much..

 

[Anonymous]

Is lactate threshold the point at which some men excrete milk from their nipples?

 

[Rip:30]

The acidosis in muscle tissue is not the result of lactate production...and should not be called lactic threshold or lactic acid...actually the production of lactate consumes protons and slows down acidosis. Acidosis is caused by an increased reliance on nonmitochondrial ATP turnover...not lactate production.

Whaa?

The reason it's called lactic "acid" is that in solution a H+ dissociates and lowers the pH of the solution.

True that the formation of lactic acid results from the reduction of pyruvate, using a proton from NADH. But that proton was not in solution in the cytosol, it came off glucose and it's downstream glycolytic intermediaries.

The whole point of lactic acid production is to renew the NAD+ supply so you can keep getting 2 ATP per glucose when the mitochondria are swamped/low on O2.

In summary, pretty sure lactic acid lowers the net pH of muscles and blood.

 

[Rip:30]

The conversion is done in the liver as part of the Cori cycle. It basically acts as a gluconeogenic precursor to synthesis carbohydrate.

Thanks! Human Phys 101 is a little rusty...

 

[Le breton]

Whaa?

The reason it's called lactic "acid" is that in solution a H+ dissociates and lowers the pH of the solution.

would you like to rephrase that differently so I can understand?
I'll remind you that an H+ ion is just a proton, so that to dissociate it you would have to separate it into its 3 quarks, 2 u and 1 d. A feat that not even the most powerful particle accelerator is able to do, and therefore not my aching muscles either.

Thanks.

 

[Rip:30]

would you like to rephrase that differently so I can understand?
I'll remind you that an H+ ion is just a proton, so that to dissociate it you would have to separate it into its 3 quarks, 2 u and 1 d. A feat that not even the most powerful particle accelerator is able to do, and therefore not my aching muscles either.

Thanks.

Haha. Ok ya. The H+ dissociates from the the lactic acid molecule into an aqueous solution.

 

[Rip:30]

Whaa?

The reason it's called lactic "acid" is that in solution a H+ dissociates and lowers the pH of the solution.

True that the formation of lactic acid results from the reduction of pyruvate, using a proton from NADH. But that proton was not in solution in the cytosol, it came off glucose and it's downstream glycolytic intermediaries.

The whole point of lactic acid production is to renew the NAD+ supply so you can keep getting 2 ATP per glucose when the mitochondria are swamped/low on O2.

In summary, pretty sure lactic acid lowers the net pH of muscles and blood.

Doh!

Actually, it sounds like this old standby of an explaination is being disputed, and TRDean was putting forth a newer well supported hypothesis.

http://ajpregu.physiology.org/cgi/content/abstract/287/3/R502

So maybe someone who is currently in the exercise phys field can comment on how this mechanism relates to LT, AT, cycling performance ect...