Dekker's book.

[doperhopper]

Yet another nice piece about "dirty past" that was not so long ago, actually

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/thomas-dekker-book-details-doping-at-rabobank/

Absolute bombshell: Dekker cheated! (well, cheated by prostitutes that appeared a lot less beautiful than on their website...)

 

[ClassicomanoLuigi]

Thank you.

 

[Shame]

I never want to see these dopers get money for a book.
I have always said this guy was a cheater, always.
He still looks smug rather than apologetic, especially to those he beat with drugs.

I'm not unreasonable. I'm fine with Armstrong, Ulrich, and others keeping their TdF wins.

I would bet any money he self-medicated before his world record attempt.
So happy he failed. Now, can we all forget him forever and make sure he never works in cycling?

 

[gillan1969]

Re:

I never want to see these dopers get money for a book.
I have always said this guy was a cheater, always.
He still looks smug rather than apologetic, especially to those he beat with drugs.

I'm not unreasonable. I'm fine with Armstrong, Ulrich, and others keeping their TdF wins.

I would bet any money he self-medicated before his world record attempt.
So happy he failed. Now, can we all forget him forever and make sure he never works in cycling?

it's all part of the circus...enjoy

 

[veganrob]

Re:

I never want to see these dopers get money for a book.
I have always said this guy was a cheater, always.
He still looks smug rather than apologetic, especially to those he beat with drugs.

I'm not unreasonable. I'm fine with Armstrong, Ulrich, and others keeping their TdF wins.

I would bet any money he self-medicated before his world record attempt.
So happy he failed. Now, can we all forget him forever and make sure he never works in cycling?

Yet you are fine with Armstrong, and others? WTF??? Did Dekker beat you in a Cat 3 years ago?

I'm not real happy about crooks making money on their cheating but the *** show that is pro cycling has to be exposed for the fraud it is. What do you want, another Froome or Wiggins book?

 

[GJB123]

Re:

I never want to see these dopers get money for a book.
I have always said this guy was a cheater, always.
He still looks smug rather than apologetic, especially to those he beat with drugs.

I'm not unreasonable. I'm fine with Armstrong, Ulrich, and others keeping their TdF wins.

I would bet any money he self-medicated before his world record attempt.
So happy he failed. Now, can we all forget him forever and make sure he never works in cycling?

Actually I very much doubt that he is in it for the money as he basically doesn't need that anymore. He is hitched to a very wealthy US lady and I think he should still have some money left form his cycling days. Also I don't think he looks smug in his TV interviews. He actually looks quite authentic and genuine, something that we could never say about LA, yet you are fine that he keeps his TdF wins. Go figure!?

Also we can at least be relatively certain that Dekker started using PED's once he turned pro and not before that (given that Hanegraaf went to his parents to spell out the necessity of doping once he turns pro) and that means that Dekker actually shows real talent without using PED's. Again something we can't possibly claim for LA, yet you are fine with him keeping his TdF wins. Go figure!?

 

[IndianCyclist]

Hypothesis destroyed- "doping stopped in 2006"
Evans clean ????
Gilbert triple - cortisone effect

 

[pastronef]

Re:

Hypothesis destroyed- "doping stopped in 2006"
Evans clean ????
Gilbert triple - cortisone effect

well, if someone still believed that, I can´t help. what I mean is I dont care what people say about 2006. I am surprised both by people who believe it and both by people who say: look! oh wtf Dekker confirms it didnt stop in 2006. I knew it, I knew it!
we don´t need Dekkers book to open our eyes
it´s an interesting read nevertheless

but I wouldnt say "hypothesis destroyed" because I never cared about any hypothesis

 

[kingjr]

Who has ever said doping stopped in 2006?

 

[sniper]

JV has suggested that some antidoping truce among teams was agreed upon in 2006.

The Garmin riders who got a six month ban all said they'd stopped in 2006.

In 2005, Heiko Salzwedel claimed doping stopped after Festina.

etc.

 

[sniper]

Re: Re:

Hypothesis destroyed- "doping stopped in 2006"
Evans clean ????
Gilbert triple - cortisone effect

well, if someone still believed that, I can´t help. what I mean is I dont care what people say about 2006. I am surprised both by people who believe it and both by people who say: look! oh wtf Dekker confirms it didnt stop in 2006. I knew it, I knew it!
we don´t need Dekkers book to open our eyes
it´s an interesting read nevertheless

but I wouldnt say "hypothesis destroyed" because I never cared about any hypothesis

agree with the sentiment.
still, from time to time it is useful to recall the endless lies from the likes of JV and others.
and since there are always people asking "show me the evidence", well testimonies such as Dekkers' provide such evidence.

 

[kingjr]

Re:

JV has suggested that some antidoping truce among teams was agreed upon in 2006.

The Garmin riders who got a six month ban all said they'd stopped in 2006.

In 2005, Heiko Salzwedel claimed doping stopped after Festina.

etc.

That's some riders claiming somehing about themselves, not stating that doping itself has stopped in 2006. And what Salzwedel said in 2005 was already irrelevant by 2007.

 

[sniper]

You always skip the first 1/3 of a post?

 

[kingjr]

Re:

You always skip the first 1/3 of a post?

I don't recall Vaughters ever claiming that doping had stopped in 2006 and I don't see how him saying that there was an antidoping truce between teams in 2006 leads to that conclusion.

Anyway, do you remember which teams were part of this truce?

("What you say has been alleged and claimed, has not been alleged or claimed.")

 

[vedrafjord]

Re:

I never want to see these dopers get money for a book.
...
I'm not unreasonable. I'm fine with Armstrong, Ulrich, and others keeping their TdF wins.

That's a bizarre attitude - you're ok with dopers keeping their mouths shut and cheating clean riders out of wins, but not with them spilling the beans. People like Floyd and Tyler not only naming names, but describing their methods in detail is probably the second best tool (after direct police investigation) that we have to try and achieve a clean sport. One reason things are as preposterous as ever is nobody big has been busted and confessed in a long time, so antidoping knowledge is way behind.

Hypothesis destroyed- "doping stopped in 2006"

I hate to see this brought up out of context over and over again - even at the time it was obvious it was a necessary fiction to get Armstrong's teammates to testify against him without cratering their own careers. As for Vaughters, he's been saying year x is cleaner than year x-1 for the last two decades, for all values of x.

As for Dekker, I think there's a better case for him being clean after his ban than almost anyone else. Why? Because unlike Valverde, Basso, Contador, Millar, etc., when he came back he was absolutely lousy. And he stayed lousy:

 

[kielbasa]

I wonder how he would react if someone posted the entire book online for free. I think that would be fitting punishment for dopers. Rules? What rules?

 

[doperhopper]

I wonder how he would react if someone posted the entire book online for free. I think that would be fitting punishment for dopers. Rules? What rules?

you have to post ALL the dopers' books online, otherwise it's not fair... the level should be the same for everyone

 

[Kwibus]

Im really sad for Boogerd as his chances of his career in cycling are completely gone now, but this book breaks open the omerta completely.

In those years when everyone looked away it was freaking crazy what happened. A world of madness. I'm pretty sure it's not that crazy anymore. Doping still happens, sure, but I think it's no longer such *** house as it was back then.

I think this book is interesting for anyone who likes cycling.

 

[red_flanders]

Re:

JV has suggested that some antidoping truce among teams was agreed upon in 2006.

The Garmin riders who got a six month ban all said they'd stopped in 2006.

In 2005, Heiko Salzwedel claimed doping stopped after Festina.

etc.

Someone claims doping stopped just after the last big bust...every...single...time. If anyone believes this stuff they're naive, ignorant (in a non-pejorative sense of the word), wildly prejudiced in favor of some doper or just not paying attention.

 

[red_flanders]

Re: Re:

I hate to see this brought up out of context over and over again - even at the time it was obvious it was a necessary fiction to get Armstrong's teammates to testify against him without cratering their own careers. As for Vaughters, he's been saying year x is cleaner than year x-1 for the last two decades, for all values of x.

The problem with context is not that anyone with any sense actually thought doping stopped in 2006, but rather that there is a large contingent of fans of teams which arose after that who actually believe that doping (with rare exceptions from "bad" guys) was a thing from a different era. From different teams. From different countries. That their guy was from the "clean era".

Comedy.

 

[red_flanders]

Im really sad for Boogerd as his chances of his career in cycling are completely gone now, but this book breaks open the omerta completely.

In those years when everyone looked away it was freaking crazy what happened. A world of madness. I'm pretty sure it's not that crazy anymore. Doping still happens, sure, but I think it's no longer such **** house as it was back then.

I think this book is interesting for anyone who likes cycling.

What makes you think it's different now? I'm always fascinated by this. What fundamental change in the structure or incentives of the sport have facilitated this? I see none.

 

[hfer07]

despite how discouraging is the topic, I'm cool with TD's book disclosing the whole Rabobank's pandora's box. I wonder if in his book Oscarito's name came up.....

 

[Sciatic]

Re: Re:

You always skip the first 1/3 of a post?

I don't recall Vaughters ever claiming that doping had stopped in 2006 and I don't see how him saying that there was an antidoping truce between teams in 2006 leads to that conclusion.

Anyway, do you remember which teams were part of this truce?

("What you say has been alleged and claimed, has not been alleged or claimed.")

Kingr--
You're missing the fact that this that this has been a staple joke in the clinic for years now--whenever someone is NOT surprised by a media doping revelation, you would hear the tongue-in-cheek, "But, wait, that can't be . . . because we all know everyone stopped doping in 2006". Sometimes they might forget to put the winky face after it And once a joke like that has become common parlance, the original factual or faux nature of the statement is glossed over.

 

[kingjr]

Re: Re:

Kingr--
You're missing the fact that this that this has been a staple joke in the clinic for years now--whenever someone is NOT surprised by a media doping revelation, you would hear the tongue-in-cheek, "But, wait, that can't be . . . because we all know everyone stopped doping in 2006". Sometimes they might forget to put the winky face after it And once a joke like that has become common parlance, the original factual or faux nature of the statement is glossed over.

I thought that, but the statement is so utterly senseless that I wondered what the origin of the joke was.

 

[kingjr]

despite how discouraging is the topic, I'm cool with TD's book disclosing the whole Rabobank's pandora's box. I wonder if in his book Oscarito's name came up.....

Don't know about Oscarito, but Ten Dam's Name came up:

"Ik ken hem al jaren: we zijn begonnen met wielrennen bij hetzelfde Noord-Hollandse wielerclubje. Lau is een van de weinige renners voor wie ik mijn handen in het vuur zou steken wat betreft doping. Hij doet niks. Hij zegt dat hij er het type niet voor is. Hij fietst voor de lol, hij is geleidelijk aan beter geworden. Hij voelt niet de druk om grote koersen te winnen. Niet van de ploeg, niet van zichzelf."

Rough translation

"I have known him for years: we started racing at the same Club in North Holland. He is one of the few for who I would put my hands in the fire with regards to doping. He is not doing anything. He says he's not the type for that. He rides his bike for fun, and he became better step by step. He is under no pressure to win a big race, neither from the team, nor from himself.


He also says that Ten Dam helped him clean up the room after a messed up Infusion, so Ten Dam was of course not in the dark about what was going on.