Doubts about creatine

[lenric]

Creatine has some benefits, not only physical benefits, but also cognitive ones. Everybody knows this, that's not the reason I created this topic.

I know that, when we take creatine, we'll accumulate a little bit more water in our muscle cells, so they get bigger and that's why one might appear kind of "bloated". My doubt is: if you do a bio-impedance test, the weight you won because of the supplement is accounted as fat free mass, or fat mass?
I'm asking this, because some time ago I did two bio-impedance tests in the same week, same schedule, same conditions (not only sleep, but also what I ate the day before, etc), the only difference being the second time I was tested, I was using creatine, and my body fat was almost 1% higher than the first test, while my muscle mass was almost the same.

 

[carolina]

bio impedance scales have an error of more then 5%, the difference you saw on the scale is totally irrelevant.

also, you probabily don't understand how creatine works. to have some benefit you need to be completly saturated. you can achieve this by consuming 5g creatine every day for 30 days or you can do a load phase of 1 week, taking 20g every day and then cycle it. I suggest you do the first. 5 grams every day and there's no need to cycle. If you this, you won't feel bloated at all.

 

[CheckMyPecs]

Creatine has some benefits, not only physical benefits, but also cognitive ones. Everybody knows this, that's not the reason I created this topic.

The problem is many creatine supplements are packed with nasty contaminants.

 

[carolina]

just stick to creapure, distributed by a reputable brand. it's really cheap.

 

[ray j willings]

I take it. Best time is about 20mins before I hit the weights. I have it with a cup of tea. The benefits would be better for size gains if I stopped riding my bike nearly everyday for 2 hours .
But my strength is good and I lift a decent amount of weight for a cyclist and my pull up and chin ups are good " I'm like a monkey"
I take it in pills monohydrate 1000mg x 4

 

[lenric]

Re:

bio impedance scales have an error of more then 5%, the difference you saw on the scale is totally irrelevant.

also, you probabily don't understand how creatine works. to have some benefit you need to be completly saturated. you can achieve this by consuming 5g creatine every day for 30 days or you can do a load phase of 1 week, taking 20g every day and then cycle it. I suggest you do the first. 5 grams every day and there's no need to cycle. If you this, you won't feel bloated at all.

The load phase is completely irrelevant.
Thanks, but I know how to take creatine. I don't ingest a single supplement without knowing all the pros, cons and the way they work.

No matter how irrelevant the difference I saw may be, my question still stands. Which is, how is the excess of water accounted. Whether as fat free mass, or fat mass. I believe in the first one, since it's the one that makes more sense, but you seem to know this stuff, so correct me if I'm wrong please.

 

[carolina]

Well, it's really hard to answer your question, really.

Bio impedance scales work by sending an electric signal through your body and, based on the time it takes to go from one foot to the other, it estimates your fat mass. The faster it goes, the less fat you supposedly have.

Considering water is a very good conductor, the more water you have in your body, the faster the signal will go through. For instance, if you're dehydrated you should probably see a higher %bf number on the scale.

I can't really tell you if the fact that the water is stored in the muscle cells will influence the %bf value on the scale, but I would guess so.

 

[CheckMyPecs]

http://www.brinkzone.com/articles/whats-in-your-creatine/

 

[twothirds]

Re: Re:

The load phase is completely irrelevant.
Thanks, but I know how to take creatine. I don't ingest a single supplement without knowing all the pros, cons and the way they work.

No matter how irrelevant the difference I saw may be, my question still stands. Which is, how is the excess of water accounted. Whether as fat free mass, or fat mass. I believe in the first one, since it's the one that makes more sense, but you seem to know this stuff, so correct me if I'm wrong please.

The weight is registered as fat-free mass. Water and fat have different resistances to conduction. Since the water retained from creatine use is in the muscles, the impedance test will register this as an increase in muscle mass, not fat mass. Since you know all the pros, cons, and how a supplement works before you ingest it, you would've known this to begin with, as the principles behind an impedance test are simpler than the physiological interactions of creatine within the body.

You can chug a ton of water before doing the test, without creatine use, and it will register the same way. The state of your hydration is something that can easily screw with this test.

 

[ray j willings]

Re: Re:

bio impedance scales have an error of more then 5%, the difference you saw on the scale is totally irrelevant.

also, you probabily don't understand how creatine works. to have some benefit you need to be completly saturated. you can achieve this by consuming 5g creatine every day for 30 days or you can do a load phase of 1 week, taking 20g every day and then cycle it. I suggest you do the first. 5 grams every day and there's no need to cycle. If you this, you won't feel bloated at all.

The load phase is completely irrelevant.
Thanks, but I know how to take creatine. I don't ingest a single supplement without knowing all the pros, cons and the way they work.

No matter how irrelevant the difference I saw may be, my question still stands. Which is, how is the excess of water accounted. Whether as fat free mass, or fat mass. I believe in the first one, since it's the one that makes more sense, but you seem to know this stuff, so correct me if I'm wrong please.

Body builders use creatine in the cutting up process . Creatine fills your muscles and it certainly does not give you any layer of water fat. You can get ripped using it and a lot of body builders do. Proven and tested.
You must take it with a hot drink so it dissolves otherwise it will just go through your system. You don't need to take it if your not training its best to take 20 minutes before you start training. If you miss a day it will not make a difference. The best benefits come from your ability to utilise it whilst training.
The only people who say it makes them look fat are the ones eating to much ,simple.

 

[carolina]

Getting ripped with creatine?! Why? I'm honestly confused with this part.

Creatine is mainly used to help you get one more rep or lift a little bit more weight. These tiny increments allow you to train better, which will eventually get you a little bit better results.

The time of day to take creatine is irrelevant.

And I never needed to use warm water, I just use tap water. Never had or knew someone that had a problem with it. Works fine.

 

[ray j willings]

Re:

Getting ripped with creatine?! Why? I'm honestly confused with this part.

Creatine is mainly used to help you get one more rep or lift a little bit more weight. These tiny increments allow you to train better, which will eventually get you a little bit better results.

The time of day to take creatine is irrelevant.

And I never needed to use warm water, I just use tap water. Never had or knew someone that had a problem with it. Works fine.

I was making a point about the myth of creatine giving you a water bloated belly if your cutting. It does not.

Look at this. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SqY_JtJazyw

It makes a big difference when you take it for getting the most out of it regarding muscle mass and recovery.

I use Rich Pianas kill it pre work out " be careful its very strong" its a very well thought out product and gives your body optimum ingredients for a great work out.

If I go for a ride I use creatine with tea. I f I am lifting the I use "Kill it"

 

[carolina]

LOLOLOL rich piana is my favorite natural vegan bodybuilder XD

The only "pre-workout" I use is a cup of black coffee. I've tried some pre-workouts, but I don't see any advantage in using them.

 

[ray j willings]

Re:

LOLOLOL rich piana is my favorite natural vegan bodybuilder XD

The only "pre-workout" I use is a cup of black coffee. I've tried some pre-workouts, but I don't see any advantage in using them.

Check out this review . If your hitting the weights its about the best pre workout out there . The blend of products that it has is superb . It definitely will give your body everything it needs .
Its not to expensive as well per drink.
highly recommend . I take 1 and a half scoops but 1 should be enough for most people. I found it takes about 35/40 minutes to kick in for me.

it's really worth a go and you wont need to buy any creatine this will give you all you need.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-7jqn_wWxVs

 

[CheckMyPecs]

I haven't used it, but I also heard Rich Piana is really good.

 

[ray j willings]

Re:

I haven't used it, but I also heard Rich Piana is really good.

I like Rich. He takes loads of "gear" but is at least honest about it. He does not sell "snake oil"
I have no idea if he puts the ingredients in his products or someone else but they are pretty good and its pretty clear that you need to get on the "gear" if you want outstanding results . You are limited to your genetics and how your body works. People don't realise that diet pills won't make you slim you need to diet. Protein will not make you huge you need steroids unless you have freaky genetics where you can pack some size on. Once you go the steroid route then that's it really. Once you stop taking steroids then your gains will go. You will see some pro body builders completely come off the gear in the off season and look like normal blokes. Soon as they hit the drugs again they get super human again. Some guys stay on all year but just cycle their drugs to stay big but stay healthy as possible. A lot of hollywood stars will gear up for film roles and then come off them again after.
A tell tale sign is receding hairline. If you look at a lot of the guys who play super hero's Captain America. superman etc their hairline is receding. If your going to go bald then the gear will speed the baldness up.
some good before after steroids pics.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6IJx1W5JYbU

 

[carolina]

Why would I trade creatine for a pre-workout? Creatine is way cheaper. I don't need any pre-workout, apart from a cup of coffee. My training sessions are usually really good, there's really no point in wasting money on any other supplements.

Rich is one of my favorite youtubers, it's impossible not to laugth with his videos and the comments section is just hilarious. I also appreciate his honesty about steroids, it's a shame not many people in the industry have the courage to be honest about it.

 

[lenric]

I prefer to take creatine after my workouts. On off-days, first thing in the morning.
Carolina, creatine is good to take whehter you're bulking up, or cutting down. Precisely because it helps you to push one extra rep, which is crucial in whatever phase you're going through.
When cutting, you'll lose muscle anyway, so taking creatine is useful too.

Rich is laughable. Too bad that loads of guys (including actors) don't admit their steroid use, but they have contracts depending on their image, so if there is any bad rumor, they're screwed.

 

[ray j willings]

Re:

Why would I trade creatine for a pre-workout? Creatine is way cheaper. I don't need any pre-workout, apart from a cup of coffee. My training sessions are usually really good, there's really no point in wasting money on any other supplements.

Rich is one of my favorite youtubers, it's impossible not to laugth with his videos and the comments section is just hilarious. I also appreciate his honesty about steroids, it's a shame not many people in the industry have the courage to be honest about it.

I appreciate that. Its not just the creatine that's in the pre work out its the other stuff in there to.
I personally like to try new stuff to see how things work, we are all looking for that perfect workout/ recover /gain scenario. I just started taking something else to day " just legal" It needs a few days to work and I am starting on a low dose and going from there. I let you know how it works and what it is in a week or 2.
The chat on here is good. No fighting just listening and trying to learn new stuff . Great input from everyone.
I salute you all .

 

[carolina]

I've seen the nutritional information for Kill It. The problem with it, which is a common thing among supplements, is the use of proprietary blends. They tell you the ingredients, but don't tell you the amount that is present. For example, there is beta-alanine in Kill It, but you don't know how much.

Most pre-workouts that don't have proprietary blends are under dosed in one or more ingredients. With proprietary blends there's a greater chance of that happening. The supplement industry is not regulated so I try to be careful with what I buy.

The only pre-workouts I tried were from free samples. I only try new supplements if I find enough research to support the claims. I only use creatine and fish oil daily. I use protein powder 3 or 4 times a week and I use a intra-workout during the longer bike rides (exceed from myprotein, it's their version of scivation's extend).

 

[ray j willings]

Re:

I've seen the nutritional information for Kill It. The problem with it, which is a common thing among supplements, is the use of proprietary blends. They tell you the ingredients, but don't tell you the amount that is present. For example, there is beta-alanine in Kill It, but you don't know how much.

Most pre-workouts that don't have proprietary blends are under dosed in one or more ingredients. With proprietary blends there's a greater chance of that happening. The supplement industry is not regulated so I try to be careful with what I buy.

The only pre-workouts I tried were from free samples. I only try new supplements if I find enough research to support the claims. I only use creatine and fish oil daily. I use protein powder 3 or 4 times a week and I use a intra-workout during the longer bike rides (exceed from myprotein, it's their version of scivation's extend).

I think your right. You don't get exact amounts of some ingredients just the ones that a guide is more helpful with.
I'm sure though looking at the amount that your getting enough beta. Kill it has Creatinol-O-Phosphate which alongside beta should give a really good effect to your lactic clearance. Extra reps /push a bit harder. Its very well thought out product.
I do enjoy the buzz some of the preworkouts can give you although I tried this Zombie stuff " raise zombies from the dead" and it was disappointing . Kill it is great and if you want to really get off your face " rage" works really well. I overdosed on the stuff last xmas " brilliant" I was high as a kite half the day.

 

[lenric]

I only used one pre-workout some years ago, it was Assault from Muscle Pharm.
A friend of mine bought Hemo rage ultra black concentrate and he told me it was the best pre-workout he has ever experienced.

Anyway, regarding what's being said about this subject:
http://metabolicmasterpiece.com/the-pre-workout-supplement-scam/

 

[carolina]

Good article. It explains well why pre-workouts are a waste of money.

 

[ray j willings]

Re:

Good article. It explains well why pre-workouts are a waste of money.

For some pre work outs maybe . Kill it for instance has everything, in-fact a superb amount of everything you need and combines ingredients for great effect as I have posted. It would be more expensive and not at all convenient to get the amount of ingredients at the levels and combinations supplied in kill it separately.
It works out very cheap per drink.

Perhaps a good idea would be to try kill it and see how it go's rather than dismiss it. The article does not mention kill it which does have effective doses and well thought out combinations of ingredients that work to maximum effect.

 

[carolina]

You don't know if it has effective doses, because you don't know what the dosages are. It's full of propriatery blends. It's also impossible to know if it's more expensive or not, because you don't know the quantities for each ingredient.

Also, I don't really see any advantage in taking any pre-workout. I don't get why people buy them. Most of the "effects" people get are from the excessive amounts of caffeine.

Either way, I would guess I can make a cheaper pre-workout. Myprotein sells almost every ingredient on it's own and I always get a 30% discount.