German Cyclist Stefan Schumacher Admits Years of Doping

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I see that there is a court case coming up between Schumacher and Holczer. How well does Schumacher's accounts match those of Kohl? Also, does Schumacher say that the drugs were in the medical bag all the time at Gerolsteiner or did things change in later years?

2008 article said:
Lang's Schumacher suspicions

Sebastian Lang of Team Gerolsteiner said that the team had its suspicions of Stefan Schumacher during the Tour de France when they observed his reaction to news of the new CERA test.

"When it was announced that there was a new test for CERA, we were all happy. We sat on the bus and really celebrated," Lang told the Thueringer Allgemeine. "The whole team... except Stefan. He was suddenly very quiet and withdrawn."

Schumacher was "suddenly totally changed. So we other riders got together and discussed it. Finally we and the team management openly asked him whether there was something we should worry about." The response? "He just openly lied in our faces and said that everything was OK."

Lang was glad that his teammate was caught. "Cheats must be caught and punished. All of them. Even when it is another heavy blow for cycling."

http://autobus.cyclingnews.com/news.php?id=news/2008/oct08/oct08news
Would seem to be a bit of contradiction there.

Begs the question of where Kohl was but i think its been said before that he wasnt there?
 
May 27, 2012
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BroDeal said:
It certainly is surprising. This admission strikes a blow against everything I have learned about the wisdom of cycling forums during the last year.

Back in the day when Schumacher was smashing the field in breaks day after day and had a huge boost in time trialing capability to boot, there were a few--some say as little as twelve--nutters on cycling forums who laughed about how obvious the doping was. In forums in the Fatherland there were the German equivalents of del1962 and martinvickers who knew Schumachers's sudden rise and surprising performance relative to other pros was the result of good clean living and a Deutschland work ethic. There was probably even a German Krebs Cycle who proved with geometric logic that Schumacher was not doping and that a duplicate key to the wardroom icebox containing the strawberries did exist. Since most English speakers don't sprechte da German, English speaking cycling forum dwellers were deprived of guidance from Schumacher's countrymen, who were the ones best able to give unbiased and, more importantly, undeluded guidance on whether their man was doping. The suspicion and accusations were a tragic example of cynicism brought about by a lack of communication.

Luckily that situation does not exist today. The riders smashing the field now are English speakers, so pathetic forum types get the benefit of being told in a language they understand which unnatural cycling performance should be ignored because they are actually the result of working in ways that no one else in the history of the sport has ever considered. The situation has improved dramatically, and I think we should all be thankful of that.

But this admission has caused some bit of doubt. Maybe, just maybe, those forum nutters were on to something back then.
These nutters sound wise beyond their years...for a group of bone idle c*^ts that is.
 
May 27, 2012
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spalco said:
I appreciate what you're saying, but I really don't think Schumacher had many defenders. I mean, that was beyond ridiculous. I think he was far more ridiculous than even Ricco.

Smashing fully-in-his-prime-Cancellara twice in TTs like that, I think those wins are overlooked in the "most doped performances ever" discussions. You could have made a lot of money betting on Schumacher there...
The fact that he smashed the farce that is Luigi almost makes me wish he hadn't gotten caught...
 
Apr 20, 2012
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It is just in tha name:

Harald Schumacher: Battiston is still waiting for an excuse mate
Michael Schumacher: need I say more?
Stefan Schumacher: the numbers said he was clean, but wait, my eyes said something different

West Germans do not dope!
 
Fearless Greg Lemond said:
It is just in tha name:

Harald Schumacher: Battiston is still waiting for an excuse mate
Michael Schumacher: need I say more?
Stefan Schumacher: the numbers said he was clean, but wait, my eyes said something different

West Germans do not dope!
Toni also missed his world cup gold medal because he told about bundesliga doping in a autobiography. He was suspended from the national team because of that.

For me the confirmation about Stefans doping is as little surprising, as if you got one about; Indurain, Froome, Stephen Roche, Sean Kelly, Lemond, Jalabert, or Bettini, and so on..

Or really, It would be as as less surprising, if it came from any Elite Pro cyclist. Remember a funny quote from tour Doctor. Miserez; In the 1977 tour there had been rumor about a list with the names of 5 guys with a positive test, to that Doctor Miserez answered: " If you want to find the names on the doped riders, you can just look at the 54 who completed the race"
 
Mar 13, 2009
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Fearless Greg Lemond said:
It is just in tha name:

Harald Schumacher: Battiston is still waiting for an excuse mate
Michael Schumacher: need I say more?
Stefan Schumacher: the numbers said he was clean, but wait, his head and my eyes said something different

West Germans do not dope!
damn strraight.

and dont forget schumi's jaw too.
 
Frosty said:
I see that there is a court case coming up between Schumacher and Holczer. How well does Schumacher's accounts match those of Kohl? Also, does Schumacher say that the drugs were in the medical bag all the time at Gerolsteiner or did things change in later years?



Would seem to be a bit of contradiction there.

Begs the question of where Kohl was but i think its been said before that he wasnt there?
Kohl is just a better actor.
 
Schumacher tells about how he passed the doping tests( until he didn't): http://sporten.tv2.dk/2013-04-01-’sådan-tog-jeg-fusen-på-dopingkontrollen’

The main points is: - He took micro doses of EPO in the night, and the EPO could then not be traced the next morning.

- Normal EPO could easily be traced, so he( and many others) took another kind of EPO he did not believe could be traced.

- He say that he could not go crazy with his doping, because of the biological pass.



The bilogical pass thing, I suspect to be BS, that he have to tell, since he also have to tell a story about that he now do not dope, and that the sport have changed.
 
Samson777 said:
Schumacher tells about how he passed the doping tests( until he didn't): http://sporten.tv2.dk/2013-04-01-’sådan-tog-jeg-fusen-på-dopingkontrollen’

The main points is: - He took micro doses of EPO in the night, and the EPO could then not be traced the next morning.

- Normal EPO could easily be traced, so he( and many others) took another kind of EPO he did not believe could be traced.

- He say that he could not go crazy with his doping, because of the biological pass.



The bilogical pass thing, I suspect to be BS, that he have to tell, since he also have to tell a story about that he now do not dope, and that the sport have changed.
Thanks.

Hate to think that there could be any suggestion of fallibility with the BP.

We should all just agree that its certainty could never be compromised.

Dave.
 
Oh well.. he was traying to say that he did the same than others when he won ITT in the Tour the France to Cancellara, yes, yes, very credible....He was not bad at his come back when he was really as the others...but not so good to beat Cancellara...we are not stupids, if you use the same, just the things you say, or the others didn't use anyting or that make for you better effect.
 
Mar 17, 2012
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Atm, there is the trial Holczer vs. Schumacher. It´s a fraud trial, Holczer wants 150.000 EUR back, because Schumacher doped and Holczer claims he, Holczer, was cheated by him.

At today´s trial day, something came out that honestly is sth I for myself would never have believed. Schumacher claims that at the Vuelta Pais Vasco in 2008, Gerolsteiner doctor Peruzzi injected IGF-1 (!) to the riders Zaugg (OK...) and Matthias Russ (!!). I mention this because Russ was someone I would have rated as a guy almost like Moncoutie, a person that I believed that, if there are any clean riders, he is one of them.

Matthias Russ was (at least one time) on IGF1, that is one of the saddest and strangest and scariest stories I heard in pro cycling since I started following it in 1997. Just unbelieveable.

:eek::eek::eek:

Edit.: To explain my reaction, Russ finished his cycling career end 2010 at Milram, aged 27, never was really successful, always a domestique, and for sure one of the "weakest 100" ProTour riders each year. He was and is a very Christian and Catholic guy, humble and down to earth, intelligent (became a fulltime student after cycling, for engineering).
 
RHRH19861986 said:
Atm, there is the trial Holczer vs. Schumacher. It´s a fraud trial, Holczer wants 150.000 EUR back, because Schumacher doped and Holczer claims he, Holczer, was cheated by him.

At today´s trial day, something came out that honestly is sth I for myself would never have believed. Schumacher claims that at the Vuelta Pais Vasco in 2008, Gerolsteiner doctor Peruzzi injected IGF-1 (!) to the riders Zaugg (OK...) and Matthias Russ (!!). I mention this because Russ was someone I would have rated as a guy almost like Moncoutie, a person that I believed that, if there are any clean riders, he is one of them.

Matthias Russ was (at least one time) on IGF1, that is one of the saddest and strangest and scariest stories I heard in pro cycling since I started following it in 1997. Just unbelieveable.

:eek::eek::eek:

Edit.: To explain my reaction, Russ finished his cycling career end 2010 at Milram, aged 27, never was really successful, always a domestique, and for sure one of the "weakest 100" ProTour riders each year. He was and is a very Christian and Catholic guy, humble and down to earth, intelligent (became a fulltime student after cycling, for engineering).
Thanks.

Now step forward Mr Russ and tell us what you know about other riders, doctors, DSs and team owners.

That would help the sport get cleaner moving forward.
 
RHRH19861986 said:
Schumacher claims that at the Vuelta Pais Vasco in 2008, Gerolsteiner doctor Peruzzi injected IGF-1 (!) to the riders Zaugg (OK...) and Matthias Russ (!!)
Thank you for posting. Please add anything else that might be relevant, even if it doesn't seem important.

We're 5 years on from 2008, so peptide doping must be very advanced inside UCI cycling.
 
Mar 17, 2012
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Dazed and Confused said:
Thanks.

Now step forward Mr Russ and tell us what you know about other riders, doctors, DSs and team owners.

That would help the sport get cleaner moving forward.
You´re welcome.

Yeah, Russ´ reaction will be interesting, I hope there will be reaction at all.

First I thought that maybe he got injected IGF1 and maybe didn´t know what was in the syringe. That´s however hard to believe, when even Schumi knew and witnessed it, and Russ is an intelligent guy.

Getting injected 500 IE of EPO from your doctor during one of his most important stage races of the year, well, OK, that´s something that "can happen", though I believed that this wouldn´t happen to a rider like him, especially.

But IGF1 is so hardcore (it´s not even available to every single one (maybe for half of them) on the Mr Olympia stage, the most important professional heavyweight pro Bodybuilding competition in the world)...

Russ on IGF1, that´s like a Catholic priest being male actor in a hardcore gangbang porn scene.
 
RHRH19861986 said:
But IGF1 is so hardcore (it´s not even available to every single one (maybe for half of them) on the Mr Olympia stage, the most important professional heavyweight pro Bodybuilding competition in the world)...
I don't know about that. Judging by the number of testimonials in the body building forums, (U.S. maybe?) it sure seems popular.
 
Mar 17, 2012
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DirtyWorks said:
Thank you for posting. Please add anything else that might be relevant, even if it doesn't seem important.

We're 5 years on from 2008, so peptide doping must be very advanced inside UCI cycling.
Yeah, I keep you informed. My source, by the way, is Sueddeutsche Zeitung of Germany.

Still can´t believe this. :eek: It even makes me laugh now, almost. Didn´t make my day, made my year. :eek:

Say Schumacher, Zberg brothers, Hondo, Wrolich, Haselbacher, I´d be like, "that´s clear".

Say Fröhlinger, Wegmann, Frank, it would be like, "OK, good guys, with ambition, they do what they have to do".

But Russ? If anyone would have asked on 17th of April 2013, I´d have said that I´d rate the chance that Lang, Ordowski, Scholz, Frösi and Westphal were doping as higher as the chance that Russ did it.

For me, Russ seemed like almost 100% clean. Now, it seems we can delete it from the clean Gerolsteiner list.

Second-to last man is Thomas Ziegler, a good friend of Niermann.

Last man standing is Steffen Weigold. Weigold is someone I´m still convinced remained clean.

So bread and water team Gerolsteiner seems to have had one or two clean riders from 1999-2008, maybe few more, but certainly not more than 5-8.
 
Mar 17, 2012
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DirtyWorks said:
I don't know about that. Judging by the number of testimonials in the body building forums, (U.S. maybe?) it sure seems popular.
Haha, I knew these forums... :D The thing is, these 16-23 yr old boys THINK they inject IGF1, but no one knows what he or she actually injects, because 90% of the fluid solutions sold as IGF1 are fakes. That´s even worse than the situation with HGH is.

China seems to offer a broad IGF1 market, but majority of this stuff also might be fake.
 
RHRH19861986 said:
Edit.: To explain my reaction, Russ finished his cycling career end 2010 at Milram, aged 27, never was really successful, always a domestique, and for sure one of the "weakest 100" ProTour riders each year. He was and is a very Christian and Catholic guy, humble and down to earth, intelligent (became a fulltime student after cycling, for engineering).
Personal ambition and catholicism: The two most significant indicators for a strict anti-doping attitude.
 
el chava said:
RHRH19861986 said:
.... He was and is a very Christian and Catholic guy, humble and down to earth, intelligent (became a fulltime student after cycling, for engineering).
Personal ambition and catholicism: The two most significant indicators for a strict anti-doping attitude.
RHRH19861986 said:
You´re welcome.

...

Russ on IGF1, that´s like a Catholic priest being male actor in a hardcore gangbang porn scene.
I realize we shouldn't stray into religious discussion here, but I loved these colorful bits. So please humor me.

1. You said Christian and Catholic. Are typical Catholics buddhists or something?

2. I have heard somewhere that to err is human, and to forgive devine. Apparently Russ erred. But, does his faith exclude that possibility? Don't Catholics benefit from some sort of structural form of confession and atonement?

In other words, please tell me where religion has been an incorruptible and unquestionable shield against vice, corruption, human frailty or sin?

Dave.
 
Mar 17, 2012
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Yeah, you guys are right, ofc being Catholic doesn´t make you a good or better person. There are as many Cathloic a..holes as non Catholic a..holes.

But being countryman of Russ, only three years younger and also having been student and having made myself an impression of him via media, one gets a feeling about a person. He seemed (still seems) a good and nice guy, someone you´d like to have as your neighbour. So this story of today in Schumi´s trial really left me speechless. Don´t trust anyone, one could say.
 

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