Ineos environmental credentials

[jmdirt]

I agree with CF about the criticism of Ineos. There are other sponsors in cycling as well as other sports who deserve similar criticism. That doesn't let Ineos off the hook, it just hangs them with others.

 

[rick james]

A company many didn't know of, now has its name is plastered all over the press....Great success,

 

[Parker]

Re:

I agree with CF about the criticism of Ineos. There are other sponsors in cycling as well as other sports who deserve similar criticism. That doesn't let Ineos off the hook, it just hangs them with others.

What specifically have Ineos done wrong?
They and other companies like them provide the chemicals that build our very privileged world. Including clean water, insulation, pharmaceuticals and lightweight energy saving carbon fibre. Any of us would struggle without them.

Fracking is largely controversial due it taking place in first world countries and on the door step of consumers rather than out of sight in a distant land. Wherever Wind Farms have been built there have also been protests - there's quite a movement against them in France. And calling Ineos a fracking company is like calling Amazon a movie studio - it's something they dabble in at the moment.

A lot has been made of the contrast with Sky's Ocean Rescue project, yet the plastics industry have an equivalent programme called Operation Clean Sweep.

Climate change is the biggest challenge facing humanity at the moment. Protesters will raise awareness and hopefully change the responsibility of the public, particularly towards political will.

But ultimately who is going provide the solutions to maintain lifestyles at a level the privileged will accept while addressing the gathering storm. It will be industry - just as it quietly has been all along. And they're ahead of the market.

 

[pastronef]

Re: Team Ineos Discussion thread

Be interesting to see how this issue develops. Total and Gasprom have far worse environmental records than Ineos but little questioning of their teams and riders. So far I get the feeling this is just another stick to beat Sky/Ineos with

https://www.twitter.com/petercossins/status/1123199873090768896

 

[TourOfSardinia]

Re: Team Ineos Discussion thread

Be interesting to see how this issue develops. Total and Gasprom have far worse environmental records than Ineos but little questioning of their teams and riders. So far I get the feeling this is just another stick to beat Sky/Ineos with

https://www.twitter.com/petercossins/status/1123199873090768896

But Total and Gasprom are not trying to Frack in Kirby Misperton Yorkshire are they?

 

[Bolder]

Cycling are not yet at the point of F1, which can afford to ban tobacco and alcohol advertising -- teams have to take what they can get. That said, you do what you can to reduce your carbon footprint. Oh, and that Pinarello -- stunning!

If I had to rank sponsors for their evildoing, I'd put FdJ way up there. I hate lotteries -- they are nothing but a regressive tax on the poor. And what exactly is the source of the money for Astana and Katusha? I'm guessing it's way dirtier than Ineos's or even Emirates (petrodollars are petrodollars)

 

[macbindle]

Re: Team Ineos Discussion thread

Be interesting to see how this issue develops. Total and Gasprom have far worse environmental records than Ineos but little questioning of their teams and riders. So far I get the feeling this is just another stick to beat Sky/Ineos with

https://www.twitter.com/petercossins/status/1123199873090768896

But Total and Gasprom are not trying to Frack in Kirby Misperton Yorkshire are they?

No, but Ineos arent shooting people dead in the street, kidnapping them, imprisoning them without charge or torturing them.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_rights_in_Bahrain

Didnt hear much forum noise about Nibali's team, did we. But all of a sudden Ineos is a problem.

Kind of a neat demonstration of how people allow their thinking to be clouded by sheer prejudice.

 

[HelloDolly]

Re: Re:

I agree with CF about the criticism of Ineos. There are other sponsors in cycling as well as other sports who deserve similar criticism. That doesn't let Ineos off the hook, it just hangs them with others.

What specifically have Ineos done wrong?
They and other companies like them provide the chemicals that build our very privileged world. Including clean water, insulation, pharmaceuticals and lightweight energy saving carbon fibre. Any of us would struggle without them.

Fracking is largely controversial due it taking place in first world countries and on the door step of consumers rather than out of sight in a distant land. Wherever Wind Farms have been built there have also been protests - there's quite a movement against them in France. And calling Ineos a fracking company is like calling Amazon a movie studio - it's something they dabble in at the moment.

A lot has been made of the contrast with Sky's Ocean Rescue project, yet the plastics industry have an equivalent programme called Operation Clean Sweep.

Climate change is the biggest challenge facing humanity at the moment. Protesters will raise awareness and hopefully change the responsibility of the public, particularly towards political will.

But ultimately who is going provide the solutions to maintain lifestyles at a level the privileged will accept while addressing the gathering storm. It will be industry - just as it quietly has been all along. And they're ahead of the market.

I agree with this post 100%

The hypocrisy of the rich countries to all things environmental is staggering
But we want our flash cars, single apartments heated and our cheap flights.
Industry will find the solutions ,not governments and not middle class kids in tents availing of cheap products and foods from the other side of the world with the consciences of the righteous

 

[Ricco']

Chris Froome, 2018: It's staggering to hear figures like how much plastic goes into the ocean every year. I mean, we've got like 8 million tonnes of plastic that goes into the seas every year so this is a huge campaign to try and reduce that number as much as possible.

https://news.sky.com/video/square-video-chris-froome-001-mp4-11391231

Chris Froome, 2019: Regarding pollution, global warming and the environment, I don’t know enough to say if the world is in danger or not.

 

[Red Rick]

Re:

Chris Froome, 2018: It's staggering to hear figures like how much plastic goes into the ocean every year. I mean, we've got like 8 million tonnes of plastic that goes into the seas every year so this is a huge campaign to try and reduce that number as much as possible.

https://news.sky.com/video/square-video-chris-froome-001-mp4-11391231

Chris Froome, 2019: Regarding pollution, global warming and the environment, I don’t know enough to say if the world is in danger or not.

Lololol nice catch

 

[Pricey_sky]

Re:

Chris Froome, 2018: It's staggering to hear figures like how much plastic goes into the ocean every year. I mean, we've got like 8 million tonnes of plastic that goes into the seas every year so this is a huge campaign to try and reduce that number as much as possible.

https://news.sky.com/video/square-video-chris-froome-001-mp4-11391231

Chris Froome, 2019: Regarding pollution, global warming and the environment, I don’t know enough to say if the world is in danger or not.

Well, he’s hardly going to put down his new employers paying him millions is he? Just like other riders riding for companies/nations that also aren’t squeaky clean don’t speak up. Every rider tends to tow the company line.

 

[jmdirt]

Re: Team Ineos Discussion thread

Be interesting to see how this issue develops. Total and Gasprom have far worse environmental records than Ineos but little questioning of their teams and riders. So far I get the feeling this is just another stick to beat Sky/Ineos with

https://www.twitter.com/petercossins/status/1123199873090768896

But Total and Gasprom are not trying to Frack in Kirby Misperton Yorkshire are they?

No, but Ineos arent shooting people dead in the street, kidnapping them, imprisoning them without charge or torturing them.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_rights_in_Bahrain

Didnt hear much forum noise about Nibali's team, did we. But all of a sudden Ineos is a problem.

Kind of a neat demonstration of how people allow their thinking to be clouded by sheer prejudice.

When I typed my post above, that was one of the teams I was thinking of. Other than Ineos, I didn't name any names, or state any reasons because I figured the political and environmental discussions belong in other threads. Really the point of my post was to say that I agree with CF that there is plenty of finger pointing to go around (as pointed out, even the fans/consumers). I guess the core decision is: Take the money and have a team vs. pass on the money and fold the team vs. look for other money.

 

[IndianCyclist]

Re: Team Ineos Discussion thread

Be interesting to see how this issue develops. Total and Gasprom have far worse environmental records than Ineos but little questioning of their teams and riders. So far I get the feeling this is just another stick to beat Sky/Ineos with

https://www.twitter.com/petercossins/status/1123199873090768896

But Total and Gasprom are not trying to Frack in Kirby Misperton Yorkshire are they?

No, but Ineos arent shooting people dead in the street, kidnapping them, imprisoning them without charge or torturing them.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_rights_in_Bahrain

Didnt hear much forum noise about Nibali's team, did we. But all of a sudden Ineos is a problem.

Kind of a neat demonstration of how people allow their thinking to be clouded by sheer prejudice.

When I typed my post above, that was one of the teams I was thinking of. Other than Ineos, I didn't name any names, or state any reasons because I figured the political and environmental discussions belong in other threads. Really the point of my post was to say that I agree with CF that there is plenty of finger pointing to go around (as pointed out, even the fans/consumers). I guess the core decision is: Take the money and have a team vs. pass on the money and fold the team vs. look for other money.

The problem with Sky/Ineos is that they say one thing and then exactly do the opposite.
Statement - Zero Tolerance Do - Leinders, Jiffygate,Froome
Its similar to the statement that Froome gives about plastic as noted on the earlier posts.

 

[macbindle]

Said the man, typing on his mobile phone, whose production involved heavy planetary contamination.

The world is a bad place full of hypocrisy and double-standards. You can see it in Sky's PR machine but you can also see it here in this very thread with people suddenly condemning a chemical company whilst not changing their own lifestyles one iota to avoid using said company's products (or indeed other polluting companies)

This sudden environmental concern, with no real world actions in their own lifestyle is bad-faith BS.

 

[Ricco']

I appreciate if you don't put yourself in my shoes, because you don't know me to know what are my efforts to reduce my environmental footprint.

Thanks in advance.

 

[pastronef]

Re: Team Ineos Discussion thread

Be interesting to see how this issue develops. Total and Gasprom have far worse environmental records than Ineos but little questioning of their teams and riders. So far I get the feeling this is just another stick to beat Sky/Ineos with

https://www.twitter.com/petercossins/status/1123199873090768896

But Total and Gasprom are not trying to Frack in Kirby Misperton Yorkshire are they?

TOTAL has a 60% working stake in UK Fracking sites. Not only that, but Total sold Ineos a % of their Fracking licences too
TOTAL invested £30M in the UK’s shale industry

 

[bigcog]

Re: Re:

I agree with CF about the criticism of Ineos. There are other sponsors in cycling as well as other sports who deserve similar criticism. That doesn't let Ineos off the hook, it just hangs them with others.

What specifically have Ineos done wrong?
They and other companies like them provide the chemicals that build our very privileged world. Including clean water, insulation, pharmaceuticals and lightweight energy saving carbon fibre. Any of us would struggle without them.

Fracking is largely controversial due it taking place in first world countries and on the door step of consumers rather than out of sight in a distant land. Wherever Wind Farms have been built there have also been protests - there's quite a movement against them in France. And calling Ineos a fracking company is like calling Amazon a movie studio - it's something they dabble in at the moment.

A lot has been made of the contrast with Sky's Ocean Rescue project, yet the plastics industry have an equivalent programme called Operation Clean Sweep.

Climate change is the biggest challenge facing humanity at the moment. Protesters will raise awareness and hopefully change the responsibility of the public, particularly towards political will.

But ultimately who is going provide the solutions to maintain lifestyles at a level the privileged will accept while addressing the gathering storm. It will be industry - just as it quietly has been all along. And they're ahead of the market.

I agree with this post 100%

The hypocrisy of the rich countries to all things environmental is staggering
But we want our flash cars, single apartments heated and our cheap flights.
Industry will find the solutions ,not governments and not middle class kids in tents availing of cheap products and foods from the other side of the world with the consciences of the righteous

I was under the impression that the vast majority of the worlds ocean plastic pollution comes from 7 or 8 rivers in China and India, where plastic is just dumped into those rivers, that could be solved fairly easily but these countries have other concerns and environmental protection is way down the list. In terms of greenhouse gas emissions China is tops with 27%, US with 15%, India with 6.4%. Eu countries: Germany 2%, UK 1.2%, France 1%, Italy 0.9%. Given China is still building coal powered power stations I don't see their emissions dropping any time soon so all this protesting in the UK about our emissions etc will do sod all for the core problem, apart from penalising the poor in society who no doubt will be hit hardest by any new emission policies as they won't be able to afford a nice new electric car.

 

[macbindle]

Yes it will...because the link has to be made between Chinese production and western consumption, are well as our sending our rubbish back to Asia for 'recycling'.

 

[macbindle]

A place to discuss the ethics of Team Sky's acceptance of Ineos sponsorship

 

[jmdirt]

IMO, your scolding of 'everyone' is off because you have no idea how "everyone' lives. I can promise you that I have made 'real world actions' in my own life for 20+ years. I am certainly not pollution free though.

EDIT: Your quote: "The world is a bad place full of hypocrisy and double-standards. You can see it in Sky's PR machine but you can also see it here in this very thread with people suddenly condemning a chemical company whilst not changing their own lifestyles one iota to avoid using said company's products (or indeed other polluting companies).

This sudden environmental concern, with no real world actions in their own lifestyle is bad-faith BS."

EDIT 2: The point of my original post wasn't to condemn anyone or any company as stated in the previous thread.
"I agree with CF about the criticism of Ineos. There are other sponsors in cycling as well as other sports who deserve similar criticism. That doesn't let Ineos off the hook, it just hangs them with others."

 

[macbindle]

You'll notice that my OP was in response to Tour of Sardinia, hence the inclusion of a quote from him in my post.

IMO, your scolding of 'everyone' is off because you have no idea how "everyone' lives. I can promise you that I have made 'real world actions' in my own life for 20+ years. I am certainly not pollution free though.
"

I didnt say "everyone".

That is your invention.

 

[Jagartrott]

Yes, there are plenty of people that do try to alter their habits and lifestyle to lower pollution. No need to paint everyone as hypocrites, that's quite lazy reasoning. Ineos, with their lobbying to allow fracking, is the opposite - they actively push to do something that is good for them, and harmful for the environment and society. In the north of the Netherlands, natural gas exploitation has caused earthquakes and damage to houses at a massive scale. Shell profited for decades, but is baring very little of the cost. Ineos is trying to follow examples such as these, of course waving 'jobs' and 'economic growth' in the face of the locals along with the right PR greenwashing gibberish.

 

[macbindle]

See the above.

I didnt paint "everyone as hypocrites". I neither used the word 'everyone', nor implied it.

 

[Jagartrott]

Well, saying 'people' (here) are hypocrites for not doing anything to change their lifestyle, is questionable arguing as I don't think you personally know many here.

 

[Libertine Seguros]

macbindle, actually there was plenty of talk about Bahrain and its human rights at the time the team was set up. To the point where the mods started having to issue warnings for graphic content and the team thread was even closed for a while iirc, and - like here - conversation about the sponsor as opposed to the team was moved to the Café/Sidebar, where it petered out eventually.