Teams & Riders Jonas Vingegaard thread: Love in Iberia

[Peyroteo94]

As he has shown multiple times in the early tour stages, he's the only threat to Pogacar in these kind of races. Explain logically why he can perform at that level on the first stage or stages in stage races but can't in a one day race.

Of course he is one of the best hilly one-day racers in the world if he prioritized that.

Tell me when and where he raced 6 hours against Pogacar in a first stage?

 

[tobydawq]

It's also important to note that he did commit to the European championships. It's obviously way less prestigious, but it's a one day race on a route that's reasonably difficult enough, and it actually fits in the schedule much better.

The worst part is that he then already now decides to not stick around for Lombardia six days later.

 

[YavorD]

What UAE brought is irrelevant, this is about Visma not giving their main man peak shape domestiques,

But as I said, having a Giro in your legs isn't a massive problem for the domestiques. Kuss had the Giro in 2023 and he was still amazing.
Jorgenson had the same schedule as last year and he was okay back then. He was very good in the first 2 weeks, until he got sick.
Yates' level was also very good.
Van Aert's general level recently (at least as a helper) isn't very high, so his performance isn't down to the Giro.
Affini did his job.

You can criticise the overall level of the team, if you want, but you can't blame the schedules for that. And of course it matters what UAE brought. If Visma has the better team anyway, it's up to Vingegaard to drop Pogacar.

 

[Netserk]

The disputed claim was whether WC was a season goal for Vingegaard and that he intended to race it

You didn't make the claim not did you dispute it. You are not in a position to tell me what I disputed. Look at the context of the exchange in this thread and the full extent of the exchange, and it's clear that you are now insisting on your own assumptions. It's okay to wander in and misunderstand what's going on, but at least be the least bit humble.

None of what Mørkøv has said supported the disputed claim. I was of course well aware of that when I asked for a source.

 

[Netserk]

Yates' level was also very good.

Eh, I don't think so. But I also blame the team for how he was used.

I think he should have rested far more (like Kuss), and after Soulor already it should've been clear that he was worse than Kuss and had to pull before him.

 

[YavorD]

Eh, I don't think so. But I also blame the team for how he was used.

I think he should have rested far more (like Kuss), and after Soulor already it should've been clear that he was worse than Kuss and had to pull before him.

Yes, I can agree on Yates' usage.
But then again, his level throughout the year, except for Finestre (and perhaps San Valentino), wasn't very impressive, so I don't put his performance down to the Giro.

And even then, his level was high enough to be 5th in the train, which might've been enough if Jorgenson didn't get sick.

 

[E_F_]

Worlds 2027 should be a major career goal for Vingegaard. He very likely won't get as good a chance at wearing the rainbow bands ever again - so I think getting some practice in at racing worlds would probably be a good idea. First off, it's not a waste of time, because he'd be an asset to the Danish team, but also for him personally. He'll have to go to Montreal now (if he wants to win in 2027), but it's not like he's super likely to win there either.

Personally I've just desperately wanted to see him going for one day races ever since he originally said he'd do the Klasikoa after winning the Tour the first time. And he's been talking about it periodically since then.

 

[Red Rick]

As he has shown multiple times in the early tour stages, he's the only threat to Pogacar in these kind of races. Explain logically why he can perform at that level on the first stage or stages in stage races but can't in a one day race.

Of course he is one of the best hilly one-day racers in the world if he prioritized that.

Timing, training load and recovery

 

[Pozzovivo]

You didn't make the claim not did you dispute it. You are not in a position to tell me what I disputed. Look at the context of the exchange in this thread and the full extent of the exchange, and it's clear that you are now insisting on your own assumptions. It's okay to wander in and misunderstand what's going on, but at least be the least bit humble.

None of what Mørkøv has said supported the disputed claim. I was of course well aware of that when I asked for a source.

You don't own the forum, and I'm not insisitng on any personal assumptions. I did read the context and responded in a relevant way by pointing to what the danish coach said. And exactly what is the disputed claim if not for the priority and attendance of Vingegaard in the WC which was exactly what was being discussed?

 

[Pozzovivo]

Timing, training load and recovery

Which Vingegaard seem to manage just fine?

 

[Pozzovivo]

Tell me when and where he raced 6 hours against Pogacar in a first stage?

Never. But if he did, he would be the only threat to Pogacar.

 

[Netserk]

You don't own the forum, and I'm not insisitng on any personal assumptions. I did read the context and responded in a relevant way by pointing to what the danish coach said. And exactly what is the disputed claim if not for the priority and attendance of Vingegaard in the WC which was exactly what was being discussed?

You insist that your assumption of which claim that was disputed is correct, and that reference to the original dispute is somehow moving the goalposts. When I tell you that you are wrong, you insist that you are right, when you get shown the previous exchange that you at first were ignorant of, you double down.

And you also failed to highlight the disputed claim when you tried to summarise the exchange.

Do you still insist that you know better than I what it was that I asked for a source of? Because I won't bother to answer your question if you can't admit that you didn't know what was going on. And no, that's not about "owning" the forum, it's about "owning" my own posts and their context.

 

[Red Rick]

Which Vingegaard seem to manage just fine?

Preparing for a GT is different than for a one day race, and Vingegaard responds really well to that. But to go for a 6.5h 1 day race 2 weeks after the Vuelta when many riders there have done specific preperation for a 260km race full of 2 minute intervals while he's just trying to get his legs back under him does not bode well for him.

He tried CSS last year after hte Tour and he DNF'd it. Even Pogacar has skipped the Vuelta every season since 2019 because he does not believe he can do a good fall season if he goes to the Vuelta.

Vingegaard knows he's likely gonna lack the freshness for a race like Kigali 2025.

 

[Peyroteo94]

Preparing for a GT is different than for a one day race, and Vingegaard responds really well to that. But to go for a 6.5h 1 day race 2 weeks after the Vuelta when many riders there have done specific preperation for a 260km race full of 2 minute intervals while he's just trying to get his legs back under him does not bode well for him.

He tried CSS last year after hte Tour and he DNF'd it. Even Pogacar has skipped the Vuelta every season since 2019 because he does not believe he can do a good fall season if he goes to the Vuelta.

Vingegaard knows he's likely gonna lack the freshness for a race like Kigali 2025.

I believe doing a GT is a great prep for one day races to be honest. Not 2 GTs like Vingegaard though.
But for years, I have believed the TdF (for example) is the best prep race for Olympics.
Valverde was the most competitive rider in WC and rode the Vuelta every time.
Remco won both Olympics and WC after doing a GT.
I think Vingegaard isn't a one day racer at all and suffers after 200 km just like Roglic.

 

[SHAD0W93]

Nice list that only proves my point. A key ingredient for Jonas previous two Tour wins was having a team in super shape and for Visma to give Jonas the best chance at beating Pogacar he needs to have domestiques in peak condition. Racing Giros and all of the spring classics, believe it or not, takes away from team strength.

And this is me, I root for Pogacar and I can put rivalry aside and acknowledge Visma didn't do enough for their man. They didn't put all the eggs in one basket for the Tour. If I'm Jonas and realize this and I know other teams are dying to sign a good GC rider I know where I'm going.

The riders all rode similar schedules as the previous years, the only difference was Affini who I think wasn’t supposed to ride the Tour at first. Simon was always going to be fourth in the train. The huge disappointment was WVA. Maybe you have too high of an expectation on their level.

 

[noob]

The comment no one asked for; what in the over combing world of official vuelta pics did they chose for Jonas?! Who ever did that to him must really hate him. 💔

 

[scribers]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1959900549140140461

View: https://x.com/cycletips123/status/1959900549140140461?s=46&t=X4NqNG7J5ZQ-MxPOi53ECQ

 

[SHAD0W93]

Vingegaard with some 2023 Paris-Nice flashbacks.

 

[noob]

He did seem a bit frustrated in his post race interview but I get the feeling he's frustrated by himself only.

The only rider who has gotten to him apart from Pog seems to be Gaudu and Almeida. Which makes the race even more interesting!

I love la vuelta!