Landis - repaying his debt - collecting NOW for a good cause?

[hiero2]

I did not give to the Free Floyd Fundraiser. I was only sceptical after the B sample tested positive, given what I knew of Floyd, but by the time he outed himself, I was convinced he was guilty, and thus had finally 'fessed up.

Now he has to repay the half mill he raised amongst fans willing to believe his innocence. Which is a righteous consequence, without doubt. It is also a heavy burden, and Floyd did a lot to help break the omerta.

So, here's the point. How many people think it would be a good idea to start a fundraiser now, to help Floyd pay back the half mill he raised dishonestly? Now he is honest, but he feels pretty bitter, and ostracised by the sport he loved. And he has been ostracised, I don't think we can deny it.

Good idea? Or bad idea?

 

[ElChingon]

It would be better if he went out on tour and had talks about his time in the peloton and collected some non traceable funds then, but not donations but gifts, even if their IOU's negated.

 

[perfessor]

It would be better if he went out on tour and had talks about his time in the peloton and collected some non traceable funds then, but not donations but gifts, even if their IOU's negated.

Great idea --that man can tell a story well.

 

[BroDeal]

I would donate. Seeing him do a speaking tour would be great if he can get the bookings.

 

[D-Queued]

Still a harsh and outspoken critic of the FFF (and must have coined at least 50 variants of the 'Fund), I am also already on record saying that I would contribute to helping pay it back.

Dave.

 

[Arnout]

While I understand the idea, should we? Isn't this like Zirbel saying about Di Luca's one year and three month ban (a nine-month reduction): "I wish I was a doping expert."

Don't people like Bassons, and the many unnamed cyclists financially hurt by the dopers, deserve this money much more? Even though I would like Landis to succeed in life.

 

[Maxiton]

It would be better if he went out on tour and had talks about his time in the peloton and collected some non traceable funds then, but not donations but gifts, even if their IOU's negated.

Great idea. I'd pay to see one of those talks.

 

[the big ring]

The people he owes money to can forgive the debt. Let's see how many people are prepared to do that first?

 

[Cloxxki]

If those who donated go on record and still feel cheated and want their money back, I'll donate to reimburse THEM. Not at random all people studid enough to do so. It's been omerta tuition money well spent.
Also, I want Landis to not them go ahead and make a huge book/film/nascar deal, live the rich life, and me still being broke.

 

[D-Queued]

If those who donated go on record and still feel cheated and want their money back, I'll donate to reimburse THEM. Not at random all people studid enough to do so. It's been omerta tuition money well spent.
Also, I want Landis to not them go ahead and make a huge book/film/nascar deal, live the rich life, and me still being broke.

Those are the random, stupid people.

Dave.

 

[BotanyBay]

I'm willing to help contribute to bailing him out. I really don't want to see him do jail time on this. He did the honorable thing (eventually).

 

[hrotha]

I think it would raise many eyebrows if Floyd did this. Other people are of course free to do whatever they want if they're willing to help, although personally I think this is something Floyd needs to do on his own.

 

[BotanyBay]

I think it would raise many eyebrows if Floyd did this. Other people are of course free to do whatever they want if they're willing to help, although personally I think this is something Floyd needs to do on his own.

I don't think he has a prayer of doing it on his own. He'll need help. He'd better get with Kimmage and co-author another book.

 

[Parrot23]

Absolutely not!

You can't get much lower than taking folks for $450K--yes, defrauding them--after you've already cheated. And then what about the whole hacking thing? Cheating on top of cheating on top of cheating. Really and truly!

This guy still strikes me as devious, skew, and still very much an arrogant smartass, even if he came clean. He hasn't changed that much, just saying carefully calibrated things to gullible observers of his character ("sweet" things they dearly, dearly want to hear about high-level corruption), yet still as foulmouthed as they come. Talk'in the talk.

He still needs to learn that he has to "pay": no more free passes. Not one cent. Otherwise, it's just more of the "doping" mindset writ large for him: free passes and shortcuts and easy ways out. It's all of piece. He'll never learn.
The suggestion to raise money for him is truly ludicrous.

All in favour of helping folks in need and welcoming ex dopers like Miller, Dekker, etc., but I just don't believe this guy has changed much when he goes on TV, doing his best boy scout impression. Smartass before and still one. Sure he's come clean, but the guy's not changed. Giving this guy more money would be like recommending Bernie Madoff work for an accounting association as a role model and mentor.

(And hell no: I'm no supporter of Armstrong; this has nothing to do with him or the veracity of Floyd's comments about doping, the corrupt system, and the UCI etc.)

 

[Zweistein]

Absolutely not!

You can't get much lower than taking folks for $450K--yes, defrauding them--after you've already cheated. And then what about the whole hacking thing? Cheating on top of cheating on top of cheating. Really and truly!

This guy still strikes me as devious, skew, and still very much an arrogant smartass, even if he came clean. He hasn't changed that much, just saying carefully calibrated things to gullible observers of his character ("sweet" things they dearly, dearly want to hear about high-level corruption), yet still as foulmouthed as they come. Talk'in the talk.

He still needs to learn that he has to "pay": no more free passes. Not one cent. Otherwise, it's just more of the "doping" mindset writ large for him: free passes and shortcuts and easy ways out. It's all of piece. He'll never learn.
The suggestion to raise money for him is truly ludicrous.

All in favour of helping folks in need and welcoming ex dopers like Miller, Dekker, etc., but I just don't believe this guy has changed much when he goes on TV, doing his best boy scout impression. Smartass before and still one. Sure he's come clean, but the guy's not changed. Giving this guy more money would like recommending Bernie Madoff work for an accounting association as a role model and mentor.

(And hell no: I'm no supporter of Armstrong; this has nothing to do with him or the veracity of Floyd's comments about doping, the corrupt system, and the UCI etc.)

He is not participating in the promotion dope or the silencing of people speaking out against it. Being a smart *** is a personally trait and hardly a flaw. Promoting dope is not a trait but a choice. He isn't in anyway part of that system and has done much to take it done.

 

[Parrot23]

Taking people for half a million dollars is criminal. It's one thing to cheat at bike racing; it's quite another to defraud folks of hundreds of thousands of dollars. The feds had no problem making the charges stick in his case.

The cheating on top of cheating on top of cheating (doping, theft, hacking) is way too much: looks like a character/smart-*** issue to me.

He can lead cycle tours, etc., in Italy, whatever, like Tyler Hamilton, to raise money. It's tough, but what he did was criminal.

(Yes, Armstrong's not a great guy either, but we"re talking about Floyd here.)

 

[spalco]

No, he dug his hole, now he has to get out of it himself too. He'll be fine eventually, but this is a terrible cause to donate to imo.

 

[hiero2]

. . .Don't people like Bassons, and the many unnamed cyclists financially hurt by the dopers, deserve this money much more? Even though I would like Landis to succeed in life.

I agree - but Bassons and the others don't have a target to aim at, and how could you possibly aid them? Maybe an annual grant/prize/award to some suffering person who spoke out? That would be pretty hard to manage. I like your idea, I don't know how to make something like that happen.

If those who donated go on record and still feel cheated and want their money back, I'll donate to reimburse THEM. Not at random all people studid enough to do so. It's been omerta tuition money well spent.
Also, I want Landis to not them go ahead and make a huge book/film/nascar deal, live the rich life, and me still being broke.

Totally agree.

I think it would raise many eyebrows if Floyd did this. Other people are of course free to do whatever they want if they're willing to help, although personally I think this is something Floyd needs to do on his own.

I don't think he has a prayer of doing it on his own. He'll need help. He'd better get with Kimmage and co-author another book.

Again, totally agree. I don't think Floyd COULD do this himself at this point. If he did, it wouldn't get any traction, I would think. Cry wolf, you know?

Absolutely not!

You can't get much lower than taking folks for $450K--yes, defrauding them--after you've already cheated. And then what about the whole hacking thing? Cheating on top of cheating on top of cheating. Really and truly!

This guy still strikes me as devious, skew, and still very much an arrogant smartass, even if he came clean. He hasn't changed that much, just saying carefully calibrated things to gullible observers of his character ("sweet" things they dearly, dearly want to hear about high-level corruption), yet still as foulmouthed as they come. Talk'in the talk.

He still needs to learn that he has to "pay": no more free passes. Not one cent. Otherwise, it's just more of the "doping" mindset writ large for him: free passes and shortcuts and easy ways out. It's all of piece. He'll never learn.
The suggestion to raise money for him is truly ludicrous.

All in favour of helping folks in need and welcoming ex dopers like Miller, Dekker, etc., but I just don't believe this guy has changed much when he goes on TV, doing his best boy scout impression. Smartass before and still one. Sure he's come clean, but the guy's not changed. Giving this guy more money would be like recommending Bernie Madoff work for an accounting association as a role model and mentor.

(And hell no: I'm no supporter of Armstrong; this has nothing to do with him or the veracity of Floyd's comments about doping, the corrupt system, and the UCI etc.)

Would you like to tell us how you REALLY feel?
I'm not surprised that a person could feel this way, not at all. However, I still believe his Mennonite upbringing is inside there somewhere. A lot of the ways he has acted have roots in that environment. Somebody told me once we always model our behaviour based on our parents. We choose, either to act LIKE them, or NOT act like them. It takes strong character traits to break out of a strong home environment. And such don't necessarily include being a good listener. That would mean that once he started acting dishonestly, his ability to do it would be hampered, and his ability to judge how far to go would also be warped.

He demonstrated poor judgement. He got snapped - consequences have happened to him, and happened, and happened again. It seems to me that he indicates real remorse - and that he has done the true thing in his apologies. Being that an HONEST apology is one that leads to a change in behavior. Anything else is just talk and kissing up. He has done more than talk and kiss up. He has taken responsibility for this judgement, and said he will pay the people back.

So, I understand how you feel, and what you base your thinking on. I don't happen to agree. Nae problemo!

 

[Parrot23]

And such don't necessarily include being a good listener. That would mean that once he started acting dishonestly, his ability to do it would be hampered, and his ability to judge how far to go would also be warped.

That's an interesting way of looking at it, Hiero. Thanks.

 

[BroDeal]

Thom Weisel, basically the Bond supervillain of doping in U.S. cycling, gave the FFF $50K. Three other investors in Tailwind also contributed.

http://www.velonation.com/News/ID/1...-to-get-him-not-to-testify-against-Texan.aspx

 

[shojii]

Count me in as a donor....if anything I think he deserves some $$$ for the laughs I got after the 'leaked' e-mails to Hein and Fat Pat. Oh....and for establishing Grey Manrod.

 

[Bushranger]

No, he dug his hole, now he has to get out of it himself too. He'll be fine eventually, but this is a terrible cause to donate to imo.

Well said. Winning a race with a lie is one thing, but sqeezing money out of people desparate to believe in him is a whole new level of deception. I wouln't donate a cent. Let him use truth to raise the money.
Get all the us postal outcasts together and write a book. We'd all buy that!

 

[wendybnt]

So Landis has escaped any punishment for his enormous deceitful scam:

http://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/news/2015/aug/26/cycling-floyd-landis-lawsuit-san-diego-restitution/

......and I expect he is now hoping to pocket enough millions from his Qui Tam suit to cover his remaining debt and give him a tidy retirement fund.

Personally, if there is any justice in this world, I feel Landis should be left as penniless as Armstrong.

 

[Dear Wiggo]

I am glad Landis is finally starting to see some justice. He is clearly keen to pay the money back, and if he comes out of it with some spare change, it won't be because he doped. It will be because he blew a whistle. I will feel less concern for his windfall than I do for Wiggins', Froome's, Valverde's, etc.

Landis' will come from Lance. The others' all came from rightful winners.

 

[gillan1969]

Re:

So Landis has escaped any punishment for his enormous deceitful scam:

http://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/news/2015/aug/26/cycling-floyd-landis-lawsuit-san-diego-restitution/

......and I expect he is now hoping to pocket enough millions from his Qui Tam suit to cover his remaining debt and give him a tidy retirement fund.

Personally, if there is any justice in this world, I feel Landis should be left as penniless as Armstrong.

probably just as well you are not in charge of the justice system then...