Leopard-Saxo Bank rivalry

[kease7]

I saw this today on cyclingweekly and thought I would compare the teams at the TDU and the teams are below. Will anyone care about this apart from Mr Riis! If anything the Leopard team looks really weak here at the start of the season, I guess they can brag that will do well in the Tour and the Classics.

TDU TEAMS

TEAM LEOPARD - TREK (LUX)
71. O'GRADY Stuart AUS
72. PEDERSEN Martin DEN
73. DENIFL Stefan AUT
74. VIGANO Davide ITA
75. KRISTEN MORTENSEN Martin DEN
76. CLARKE William AUS
77. SILVA PIRES Bruno Manuel POR

SAXO BANK SUNGARD (DEN)
141. PORTE Richie AUS
142. HAEDO Juan Jose ARG
143. COOKE Baden AUS
144. SORENSEN Nicki DEN
145. TANNER David AUS
146. HAEDO Sebastian ARG
147. VANDBORG Brian DEN

Who will have the better season??? It has to be Leopard, if Contador is suspended.

 

[kease7]

http://www.cyclingweekly.co.uk/news/latest/512065/leopard-saxo-bank-rivalry-already-hot.html

 

[rxgqgxnyfz]

http://www.cyclingweekly.co.uk/news/latest/512065/leopard-saxo-bank-rivalry-already-hot.html

Classic modern journalism, ladies and gentlemen.

Misleading title to make it "exciting", 100% fluff with 0% substance, not even the slightest effort of trying to back one's facts, and good old simple "making the sh!t up".

 

[hfer07]

and I thought we could avoid this early nonsense at least for a couple months.....
I have to quote here Brian Nygaard when he said during the team presentation that nowadays there is a lot of bvllsh!t in cycling due to the nasty and over speculating journalism & media just filling pages with crap like that & not concentrating in what matters the most: R A C I N G

lets get the rivalry going only on the road while racing-please stop this bvllsh!t

 

[Ruxen1989]

When we talk abour rivalry between the two teams as your title is then I would like to hear your opinion in the major debate in the danish medias and among cyclingfans in DK where he majority thinks that Team Leopard-Trek should have been called team Judas.

http://www.sporten.dk/cykling/leopard-trek-er-team-judas

With google translate it says:

Leopad-Trek is Team Judas

Sporten.dk choose predominantly Riis and Saxo Bank SunGard rather than class new boy, Team Leopard Trek

Team Leopard Trek so Thursday unveiled for the first time when they know a large-scale press conference presented the riders and jerseys for the upcoming season.

The team with Brian Nygaard and Kim Anderson led a Danish flavor, but Danish support to the team look very far behind.

A vote and discussion here on sporten.dk shows that Danes do not have anything left for the new team and Bjarne Riis and Team Saxo Bank SunGard continues to have the Danish support.

When asked which team you want to stick with the sport of cycling in future products across 88 percent. That the sympathy and support base lies with Bjarne Riis and Team Saxo Bank SunGard. Nearly 4000 users have responded to vote.

The debate shows that it is Kim Anderson and Brian Nygaard establishment of the new team, which creates resentment in Denmark. Therefore, hold you still with Riis and Team Leopard Trek gets nicknamed "Team Judas".

- Of course Riis. First, the Danish team he owns, and partly the brothers Schleck and the other showed that they contain no loyalty, but only goes after the money. Nygaard and Andersen have spent their time with Riis to learn the concept, then steal both it and riders. Hope they get failure in the Tour, writes one user.

- Of course, Team Saxo Bank SunGard our favorites. Team Judas - we should not just forget them - the less attention and publicity the better, writes another user.

- I think the way the "new" team emerged is beneath contempt. They have so much Bjarne stabbed in the back if you ask me, writes a third user.

The few supporters, which after all are the new team with the Schleck brothers, find it difficult to penetrate with their arguments against Riis supporters.

- It must be Leopard, do not understand people so much against them, writes one user.

See all the pictures from the presentation of Team Leopard Trek

Today a new article shows up:

http://www.sporten.dk/cykling/cykel-eksperter-danskerne-er-provinsielle

The headline: The danes are provincial and in short it's about two cycling reporters from outside Denmark who can't see what Leopard-Trek has done to **** of the danes that much.

As a dane myself I think it's ridicolous. Bjarne Riis has been out in the danish medias and has said how dissapointed he is in most of the people going to team Lux and how they have let him down. The danes has eaten that raw!
So apperantly I'm between a few 12% who will support Team Leopard-Trek.

Throughout the season I think Leopard-Trek will do best. I have a feeling that no matter if Contador is doing the tour or not this year the young Schleck will win. It's like his attitude has changed slightly to the more serious in the past few months. And if Contador goes and can't beat Andy it is a big dissapointment for team Saxobank-Sungard.
Without Contador we are back in the good old times of who has the best legs and condition we will go for on Saxobank-Sungard. They will be the underdogs while the Leopard-trek will be favorites.

 

[on3m@n@rmy]

Classic modern journalism, ladies and gentlemen.

Misleading title to make it "exciting", 100% fluff with 0% substance, not even the slightest effort of trying to back one's facts, and good old simple "making the sh!t up".

Yes. Not too surprising as they are trying to sell a magazine. We can probably make it more interesting here.

I'd have to agree that Saxo's lineup looks stronger and more experienced, with the exception of Leopard's O'Grady. Below are the 2010 UCI points for each member (x=none).

TEAM LEOPARD - TREK (LUX)
71. O'GRADY Stuart AUS - x
72. PEDERSEN Martin DEN - x
73. DENIFL Stefan AUT - x
74. VIGANO Davide ITA - 259
75. KRISTEN MORTENSEN Martin DEN - x
76. CLARKE William AUS - x
77. SILVA PIRES Bruno Manuel POR - x

SAXO BANK SUNGARD (DEN)
141. PORTE Richie AUS - 34
142. HAEDO Juan Jose ARG - 117
143. COOKE Baden AUS - x
144. SORENSEN Nicki DEN - x
145. TANNER David AUS - x
146. HAEDO Sebastian ARG - 154
147. VANDBORG Brian DEN - x

With exception of Stuey (age 37) and Bruno Pires (29) the Leo guys are age 27 or younger with Denifl at 23. But Saxo has a good young Porte (25), Cooke (32), Niki S (35), J Haedo (29), Vanborg (29), S Haedo (27) and Tanner (26). But I don't which team matches up better for the stages in this year's edition.

 

[Eric8-A]

JJ and Seba Haedo

 

[kease7]

When we talk abour rivalry between the two teams as your title is then I would like to hear your opinion in the major debate in the danish medias and among cyclingfans in DK where he majority thinks that Team Leopard-Trek should have been called team Judas.

http://www.sporten.dk/cykling/leopard-trek-er-team-judas =QUOTE]

Personally, I would've of thought that they should've sent a better squad to there 1st UCI event of the year & put on a good show and what with all the fuss, supposed $$$$ and hype about this team its a complete let down... I love the nickname Team Judas... Its Brilliant!!

I for one will be supporting Saxo Bank this year and hope they do well.

 

[Christian]

It highlighted a reply by one of its readers, who said team Leopard-Trek should be called Team Judas.

I don't think you have to choose between Saxo Bank and Leopard. Riis couldn't find a sponsor, and so his riders and staff chose to go elsewhere. Not one rider extended his contract with Riis. It was only when he had the prospects of signing Contador that Saxo Bank was willing to step up, really late in the season.


As for Tour down Under, none of the two will do anything extraordinary. I could imagine seeing some Leopard riders in the breaks, and Haedo will get an honorable 4th place at some stage.

 

[Eric8-A]

I'm sure a 4th place spot would be higher than any of the spots one of the Leopard riders would get

 

[Timmy-loves-Rabo]

and I thought we could avoid this early nonsense at least for a couple months.....
I have to quote here Brian Nygaard when he said during the team presentation that nowadays there is a lot of bvllsh!t in cycling due to the nasty and over speculating journalism & media just filling pages with crap like that & not concentrating in what matters the most: R A C I N G

lets get the rivalry going only on the road while racing-please stop this bvllsh!t

I agree with this.

 

[Ruxen1989]

I don't think you have to choose between Saxo Bank and Leopard. Riis couldn't find a sponsor, and so his riders and staff chose to go elsewhere. Not one rider extended his contract with Riis. It was only when he had the prospects of signing Contador that Saxo Bank was willing to step up, really late in the season.


As for Tour down Under, none of the two will do anything extraordinary. I could imagine seeing some Leopard riders in the breaks, and Haedo will get an honorable 4th place at some stage.

Try and tell that to the danish Riis-fans (or 88% og those who voted in the poll).

Tour down Under: well, I will expect O'Grady to come up with something. And from Saxobank Porte will probably do well or JJ.

 

[Christian]

Try and tell that to the danish Riis-fans (or 88% og those who voted in the poll).

Well I can understand them in a certain way, it is difficult to be objective in this story. But I hope that once one of Leopard's danish riders does well, they will let bygones be bygones. If Fuglsang were in contention for a Tour de Suisse win for example, or a leader at the Vuelta, I don't think they wouldn't support him ... and his team.

He will be a protected rider in the Tour de France and they are looking to place him in the Top-10:

http://www.velonation.com/News/ID/7021/Fuglsang-hoping-for-top-ten-finish-in-Tour-de-France.aspx

 

[Ruxen1989]

Well I can understand them in a certain way, it is difficult to be objective in this story. But I hope that once one of Leopard's danish riders does well, they will let bygones be bygones. If Fuglsang were in contention for a Tour de Suisse win for example, or a leader at the Vuelta, I don't think they wouldn't support him ... and his team.

He will be a protected rider in the Tour de France and they are looking to place him in the Top-10:

http://www.velonation.com/News/ID/7021/Fuglsang-hoping-for-top-ten-finish-in-Tour-de-France.aspx

I hope you're right.

 

[The Hitch]

The One Jose did TDu last year and, well he might as well have not. Didnt do a thing. I hope this will be a better season for him though.

 

[LarsAU]

Danes are just as nationalistic as everyone else. We'll continue to support Danish riders as well as Danish teams.

The reason there is so much antagonism towards Team Leopard-Trek is because we feel betrayed. Team Saxobank was "our" team and they ruined it. Andersen and Nygaard are seen as selfish ingrates.

Personally I hope the new Saxobank-Sungard squad will step up and deliver results so everyone can feel good again and we can put all the negativity behind us.

 

[Kazistuta]

But the more "hardcore" Danish cycling fans would have been easily appeased if Riis and Saxo Bank had just decided to sign some interesting new names to their 2011 roster. But they opted for the "safe" decision in AC and some boring new-signings. Saxo Bank anno 2011 is just not exciting enough to let us forget the riders etc. who left.

I for one won't support any of those teams (Saxo has a sub-par team now and don't particularly like the signing of Contador - and Leo's overtaking of Saxobanks old structure seems a bit too much) in particular this season, but obviously will follow the riders with same interest as always. "My" team this year will be Liquigas (Nibali, Sagan, Oss, Basso and Cimolai -some of my favorite riders), and it might have been BMC with Roe, Ballan, Eijssen and Phinney, but I can't because of ACF

 

[Christian]

Team Saxobank was "our" team and they ruined it. Andersen and Nygaard are seen as selfish ingrates.

That's one way of looking at things, and can understand that some people do. On the other hand I think one can also understand the reasoning of all those who switched:

Everyone knew the Schlecks wanted to leave (which was their good right, since they were at the end of their contract), and that Riis wasn't able to find a sponsor without them. For the longest time it looked like Riis would not be able to ensure the continuation of his team. Fränk Schleck said that at the Tour de Suisse, Riis could not yet make them a concrete offer. Leopard-Trek however could, so many riders and staff opted to go the safe way and take it. Plus I can imagine they probably make more money now.

I think it is important to remember that no rider extended his contract with Riis in 2010. Breschel went to Rabobank, Rasmussen to HTC and Hoj didn't feel like searching a new team again so he retired. I think even if Leopard-Trek hadn't been created many of the riders that went there would have left Saxo Bank.

It was only when he pulled off the Contador stunt that Saxo Bank decided in extremis to go on one more year. In this regard Leopard-Trek is still the better option, since it's guaranteed to go on at least for 4 years. And then the Clentador/Cancellara debaccle is not Leopard's fault either of course. Riis had to signe Contador in order to save his team, but therefore lost Cancellara, who left on his own account.

 

[hfer07]

Danes are just as nationalistic as everyone else. We'll continue to support Danish riders as well as Danish teams.

The reason there is so much antagonism towards Team Leopard-Trek is because we feel betrayed. Team Saxobank was "our" team and they ruined it. Andersen and Nygaard are seen as selfish ingrates.

Personally I hope the new Saxobank-Sungard squad will step up and deliver results so everyone can feel good again and we can put all the negativity behind us.

mark my words: those feelings are going to go away when Contador gets to ride again and destroys the Schleck bros in the Tour.

 

[Angliru]

That's one way of looking at things, and can understand that some people do. On the other hand I think one can also understand the reasoning of all those who switched:

Everyone knew the Schlecks wanted to leave (which was their good right, since they were at the end of their contract), and that Riis wasn't able to find a sponsor without them. For the longest time it looked like Riis would not be able to ensure the continuation of his team. Fränk Schleck said that at the Tour de Suisse, Riis could not yet make them a concrete offer. Leopard-Trek however could, so many riders and staff opted to go the safe way and take it. Plus I can imagine they probably make more money now.

I think it is important to remember that no rider extended his contract with Riis in 2010. Breschel went to Rabobank, Rasmussen to HTC and Hoj didn't feel like searching a new team again so he retired. I think even if Leopard-Trek hadn't been created many of the riders that went there would have left Saxo Bank.

It was only when he pulled off the Contador stunt that Saxo Bank decided in extremis to go on one more year. In this regard Leopard-Trek is still the better option, since it's guaranteed to go on at least for 4 years. And then the Clentador/Cancellara debaccle is not Leopard's fault either of course. Riis had to signe Contador in order to save his team, but therefore lost Cancellara, who left on his own account.

I find it difficult to believe when Cancellara says that part of the reason he left was because of the Contador signing. This implies that he was fearful of it becoming a team focused on Contador alone which would've been absurd if you take into consideration Cancellara's achievements and his history with Riis. Cancellara left because almost all of his Saxo buddies had departed and he was left with a much, much weaker team than he's had in the past. So contract be damned, he was going to get the hell out of dodge. He stayed as long as he did because he was still under contract but it seemed a forgone conclusion that he was going to Team Schleck. This also only fortifies how laughable contracts are in cycling. If someone wants out they generally get out. Some riders have a bit of integrity, Hushovd is one, but for the most part the teams don't respect the fact that a chosen rider is under contract,
and they only complain when someone pilfers one of their own.

My primary problem with some of this ordeal centers on Andy Schleck's performance, or lack of, at the Vuelta where he was supposed to be supporting his brother's quest for the overall. Unless my memory escapes me, Andy was showing minimal effort in aiding his brother and his night on the town with O'Grady only brought to light the lack of professionalism and selfishness that he is capable of. I think Frank is too nice a guy to really publicly show his displeasure with Andy's attitude and considering how close they are we likely won't ever find out exactly how he felt about Andy's dismal Vuelta performance and his less than dedicated attitude. Of course this attitude is directly attributed to his knowing that he was going to be leaving the iron command of Riis. Apparently Andy had already shut it down for the season when the Vuelta started. He just neglected to let Riis know.

Andy's seemed to have charmed the majority of the cycling media but I personally just can't root for this character. Yes he is immensely talented and will likely win the Tour at least once before his career is over but something about this kid just rubs me the wrong way. Each year that passes I find more and more reasons to root against him.

 

[uphillstruggle]

He will be a protected rider in the Tour de France and they are looking to place him in the Top-10:

http://www.velonation.com/News/ID/7021/Fuglsang-hoping-for-top-ten-finish-in-Tour-de-France.aspx

I find this very hard to believe to be honest. Why would a team protect a rider for a shot at a top 10 when AS actually has a shot at winning. A guy like Vino who has sway over the team he rides for and frankly has always done what every he likes (and god love him for it) can get away with it but I don't see them having two protected riders in a team with a bona fide contender.

 

[unsheath]

I find it difficult to believe when Cancellara says that part of the reason he left was because of the Contador signing. This implies that he was fearful of it becoming a team focused on Contador alone which would've been absurd if you take into consideration Cancellara's achievements and his history with Riis. Cancellara left because almost all of his Saxo buddies had departed and he was left with a much, much weaker team than he's had in the past. So contract be damned, he was going to get the hell out of dodge. He stayed as long as he did because he was still under contract but it seemed a forgone conclusion that he was going to Team Schleck. This also only fortifies how laughable contracts are in cycling. If someone wants out they generally get out. Some riders have a bit of integrity, Hushovd is one, but for the most part the teams don't respect the fact that a chosen rider is under contract,
and they only complain when someone pilfers one of their own.

My primary problem with some of this ordeal centers on Andy Schleck's performance, or lack of, at the Vuelta where he was supposed to be supporting his brother's quest for the overall. Unless my memory escapes me, Andy was showing minimal effort in aiding his brother and his night on the town with O'Grady only brought to light the lack of professionalism and selfishness that he is capable of. I think Frank is too nice a guy to really publicly show his displeasure with Andy's attitude and considering how close they are we likely won't ever find out exactly how he felt about Andy's dismal Vuelta performance and his less than dedicated attitude. Of course this attitude is directly attributed to his knowing that he was going to be leaving the iron command of Riis. Apparently Andy had already shut it down for the season when the Vuelta started. He just neglected to let Riis know.

Andy's seemed to have charmed the majority of the cycling media but I personally just can't root for this character. Yes he is immensely talented and will likely win the Tour at least once before his career is over but something about this kid just rubs me the wrong way. Each year that passes I find more and more reasons to root against him.

Good summation ol boy. I feel the same way. He's the new clean cut golden boy but there's something about him that im deeply suspicious of. Maybe that he's got a sister for a brother for one...