New team formations and TDF next year, TTT?

[dblueroom]

What do people think about Contador joining Caisse d'Epargne? How is it going to work out between him and Alejandro Valverde?

Could Alejandro Valverde ever win TDF? maybe the team will lose sometime in TTT? Is TTT going to be around? It's kinda rediculous.

Do all these developments make Team Saxo Bank the driving force at next TDF? The Shack is probably not gonna be the shark in the mountains, and Contador will go "solo" in a sense (with a weaker team compared to Saxo Bank and the eventual Shack)?

What are the expections of Vinokourov and Rasmussen if they're going to be around?

Robert Gesink vs. Jakob Fuglsang, who will do better next year?

 

[Anonymous]

What do people think about Contador joining Caisse d'Epargne? How is it going to work out between him and Alejandro Valverde? Could Alejandro Valverde ever win TDF? maybe the team will lose sometime in TTT? Is TTT going to be around? It's kinda rediculous. Do all these developments make Team Saxo Bank the driving force at next TDF? The Shack is probably not gonna be the shark in the mountains, and Contador will go "solo" in a sense (with a weaker team compared to Saxo Bank and the eventual Shack)? Also what are the expections of Vinokourov and Rasmussen?

Lets hope not regardless of any other considerations.

 

[Hugh Januss]

Lets hope not regardless of any other considerations.

I wish there was a way to leave it in, but so that it didn't either ruin the race or just become a sideshow. It is one of the best events to watch as far as I am concerned. And the range of teams from high precision to high comedy is entertaining as well. Maybe it should be the last day?

 

[scribe]

I wish there was a way to leave it in, but so that it didn't either ruin the race or just become a sideshow. It is one of the best events to watch as far as I am concerned. And the range of teams from high precision to high comedy is entertaining as well. Maybe it should be the last day?

Agreed on all points except for last day.

When a lesser GC rider's team knifes a large chunk out of the favorites, it can make for a much more interesting GC race down the road. Postal and LA have pretty much squashed this possibility most recently. However, it could get interesting in the years ahead.

 

[lagartija]

What do people think about Contador joining Caisse d'Epargne? How is it going to work out between him and Alejandro Valverde?

Could Alejandro Valverde ever win TDF? maybe the team will lose sometime in TTT? Is TTT going to be around? It's kinda rediculous.

Do all these developments make Team Saxo Bank the driving force at next TDF? The Shack is probably not gonna be the shark in the mountains, and Contador will go "solo" in a sense (with a weaker team compared to Saxo Bank and the eventual Shack)?

What are the expections of Vinokourov and Rasmussen if they're going to be around?

Robert Gesink vs. Jakob Fuglsang, who will do better next year?

wow , thats loads of questions
personally i love the TTT , and i think caisse will do just fine they will have plenty of horses , if berto joins it will just add horse power.
i think the strongest teams oddly enough are all american ,
garmin, colombia and yes the shack, i agree the shack may not be the powerhouse they hope to be but i do believe Saxo may be just a half step behind next year.

funny i have never liked Vinokourov , but im actually really curious to see how he fares.

 

[Galic Ho]

wow , thats loads of questions
personally i love the TTT , and i think caisse will do just fine they will have plenty of horses , if berto joins it will just add horse power.
i think the strongest teams oddly enough are all american ,
garmin, colombia and yes the shack, i agree the shack may not be the powerhouse they hope to be but i do believe Saxo may be just a half step behind next year.

The Shack have one rider Lance Armstrong. Its flattering to say they're a strong team but at least give them a chance to prove it before jumping the gun.

If the TTT is in next years race and Contador is on Caisse d'Epargne they will have no trouble. The team is already made up of ex-national time trial champs and were initially the fastest time before Garmin and Astana steamrolled everyone else. L.L Sanchez, Gutierrez, Valverde and Contador. Monster team.

Valverde will never win the TDF, regardless of any journalist anointing him their pick to win (like many did in 08) simply because he has "panache". He always tends to have one bad day in the mountains, generally the first mountain group, subsequently blowing about 3 minutes to the other GC's and then pulling himself together for around 9th or 10th.

Saxo have a lot of riders who are approaching or already vintage, O'Grady, Nikki Sorensen, Arvesen and big Jens. But they'll get another year out of them.

I doubt Rasmussen and Vinokourov will be welcome back. But if they get rides with Pro Tour teams and if Basso is allowed to race then its only fair they're allowed back as well. They were always entertaining to watch and along with Valverde actually provided much needed spark to some of the less intriguing stages. Let them race I say.

 

[Izoard]

Um, when it comes to GTs, there is no real comparison between Contador and Valverde.

If the Tour keeps the TTT, then they should make it a lot shorter so the time differences are not very large, like 10 km. Also, get rid of the technical craziness, and perhaps make it on standard road bikes (which might even it out a bit more).

 

[horseman]

I think the TTT should stay in the Tour, perhaps we should take away the mountains so that no team or rider gets a big advantage in those stages.

 

[Alpe d'Huez]

The biggest mistake this year had was that the TTT was so long (40km), with so few mountain top finishes, or big mountain stages, or even long ITT's. If they have the TTT next year it either needs to be the prologue (like this year's Giro), and about 10km, or about stage 3 and no more than 20km and technical, or over a short, but steep climb/descent. Plus, race radios neuter so many stages already...

I have a friend who seems to think that Lance is making phone calls and lobbying the ASO race organizers to make certain that next year has a very long TTT, and in 2011 or beyond they can leave it out. I think this is just internet BS, but if it comes true...

But I question Shack's TTT power without Contador. Plus, look at their squad. Lance, Levi, Horner, Azevedo, Rubiera. This isn't 2002 we're talking here. All of these guys are approaching 40 years of age.

 

[Dr. Maserati]

The biggest mistake this year had was that the TTT was so long (40km), with so few mountain top finishes, or big mountain stages, or even long ITT's. If they have the TTT next year it either needs to be the prologue (like this year's Giro), and about 10km, or about stage 3 and no more than 20km and technical, or over a short, but steep climb/descent. Plus, race radios neuter so many stages already...

I have a friend who seems to think that Lance is making phone calls and lobbying the ASO race organizers to make certain that next year has a very long TTT, and in 2011 or beyond they can leave it out. I think this is just internet BS, but if it comes true...

But I question Shack's TTT power without Contador. Plus, look at their squad. Lance, Levi, Horner, Azevedo, Rubiera. This isn't 2002 we're talking here. All of these guys are approaching 40 years of age.

Spot on!

The problem with this year's Tour wasn't the TTT but the fact there was so few mountain top finishes - it encouraged defensive riding once the time gaps were made in the opening week.

I do like the TTT - man & machine going full gas, there is nothing as fabulous as watching a well drilled team go all out.
But the TTT in the Giro is the way to go if you want to include one in a GT - short yet fast - it should be a spectacle yet have little long term effect on the GC.

 

[Mellow Velo]

Why don't the Tour follow the Giro/Vuelta lead and open with a 15-25km TTT, instead of the traditional prologue/short ITT?
In that respect, it's a good curtain raiser.
Of course, with the bones of the following years race already sketched in, almost before the current edition starts, it makes it difficult to recognise errors and rectify them.

Have to agree with Alpe's thoughts on the Shack squad, thus far.
PR spin would call them "experienced". I think the logic LA/JB are applying.
My take is that they are very long in the tooth. Over the hill, in terms of their best form.
Dare I say it, but the are beginning to remind me of Rock Racing 2009.

Hardly the most positive foundation for establishing the long term evolution of US pro cycling.

 

[bianchigirl]

Make it part of a split stage - a shortish road stage am and a short, sharp TTT pm. Road stage counts for individual GC times only, TTT counts for team competition only.

There was no balance in this year's race and the rumblings are that Prudhomme won't make the same mistake again

 

[Zen Master]

If the TTT is in next years race and Contador is on Caisse d'Epargne they will have no trouble. The team is already made up of ex-national time trial champs and were initially the fastest time before Garmin and Astana steamrolled everyone else. L.L Sanchez, Gutierrez, Valverde and Contador. Monster team.

Don't forget veteran but excellent time trialist Marzio Bruseghin, probably Mauricio Soler ( mountain horsepower ) from Barloworld and Kanstantsin Sivtsov from HTC, old Berti's crew Benjamín Noval & Jesus Hernandez, guys from Caisse like José Joaquín Rojas Gil & David Arroyo and at the end DS is Eusebio Unzué

 

[53 x 11]

Don't forget veteran but excellent time trialist Marzio Bruseghin, probably Mauricio Soler ( mountain horsepower ) from Barloworld and Kanstantsin Sivtsov from HTC, old Berti's crew Benjamín Noval & Jesus Hernandez, guys from Caisse like José Joaquín Rojas Gil & David Arroyo and at the end DS is Eusebio Unzué

If this is happening Cassies TTT will be doomed that guy is a disaster in a group.

 

[Zen Master]

If this is happening Cassies TTT will be doomed that guy is a disaster in a group.

I was talking more about possible TdF 2010 squad ( for example ) and they obviously have more than enough TTT horsepower ( with or without Soler )

 

[podiumgirl]

Don't forget C Moreau who, although five months Lance's senior, put more than 40 seconds into him @ Annecy. The TTT is a show but I think it distracts from the sporting nature of a stage race. I would be happy and not suprised if it were not included in next years TdF...

 

[Timmy-loves-Rabo]

Robert Gesink vs. Jakob Fuglsang, who will do better next year?

:S are you kiddin me? gesink is a much more proven rider then fuglsang. fugslang (who is a year older then gesink) comes 6th at the dauphne and suddenly people are comparing him to a rider like gesink who has many big results on his cv. (including coming 4th at this years Dauphiné Libéré... almost like 2 mins back) different league these two. (until jacob proves himself a bit more anyway)

 

[lagartija]

The biggest mistake this year had was that the TTT was so long (40km), with so few mountain top finishes, or big mountain stages, or even long ITT's. If they have the TTT next year it either needs to be the prologue (like this year's Giro), and about 10km, or about stage 3 and no more than 20km and technical, or over a short, but steep climb/descent. Plus, race radios neuter so many stages already...

i agree the tour overall misssed on not having mountain top finishes ,
but i like the longer TTT , although i would say that it might be more fun,
spectator friendly if it were more a technical course, a bit more of a rollercoaster..

 

[dblueroom]

:S are you kiddin me? gesink is a much more proven rider then fuglsang. fugslang (who is a year older then gesink) comes 6th at the dauphne and suddenly people are comparing him to a rider like gesink who has many big results on his cv. (including coming 4th at this years Dauphiné Libéré... almost like 2 mins back) different league these two. (until jacob proves himself a bit more anyway)

Fuglsang only turned pro road racer in 2008, who previously was a mountain biker. He rode in 09 Daulphine and was able to hang in there in the mountain stages. Unlike Fuglsang, Gesink i know raced Daulphine as early as 08, so he had more experience than Fuglsang. Vuelta would be the first grand tour appearance for Fuglsang. Fuglsang now is like Andy Schleck riding Giro in 07, should put on a good show.

 

[SergeDeM]

I like the TTT but I wouldn't like to see it as the initial stage of a GC. I think it should be part of the first week and it should be no longer than 25km. That would keep it relevant but not definitive.

 

[David Suro]

The TTT in the last Tour of Georgia was a great event. It was held on an auto road racing curcuit with plenty of room for spectators, wide open course devoid of tight turns for crashes, and it was short enough to not have a tremendous outcome on the overall GC. The TTT is a beautiful event that is enjoyed by the crowds, and especially by the sponsors.

All of the meddling about the Tour has done regarding time-loss limits and overly technical courses has proven to make an exciting stage into a source of unneeded political drama and unnecessary risk for the racers.

There are plenty of auto road race curcuits in France. Maybe one of them should be given the chance to host a stage.

 

[riobonito92]

TTT Prologue - Find a large track, say 500M and run a 9 man 10000M team pursuit but giving each individual their actual time. More interesting than an individual TT that takes all day, the teams could parade their new gear, bragging rights would still be at stake, and the tactics could get very interesting.

 

[Cerberus]

Fuglsang only turned pro road racer in 2008, who previously was a mountain biker. He rode in 09 Daulphine and was able to hang in there in the mountain stages. Unlike Fuglsang, Gesink i know raced Daulphine as early as 08, so he had more experience than Fuglsang. Vuelta would be the first grand tour appearance for Fuglsang. Fuglsang now is like Andy Schleck riding Giro in 07, should put on a good show.

Actually he's only been a pro since 2009. He's been road racing since 2006 at least on Team Designa Køkken, but only as an amateur and with some kind of split focus between road and MTB.