Official Lance Armstrong thread

[Azdak6]

Maybe, maybe not. Both Alberto and Lance had bottles. But we don't know if they had any water. If they did, why would Lance need to drink from an opponent's?

As the article said, the image is misleading because it was lacking context. By the time they show the riders, Lance is already all the way up to Ivan, but you can see Alberto moving to his right as if Lance had gotten in his way.

The Lance taking a sip and passing it to Alberto doesn't contradict the article, neither does the fact that Lance makes a gesture to keep the bottle (they have two cages in the bike). You cannot see Ivan at that point, but he could have been telling Armstrong "get me that bottle back". So the video seems inconclusive to me. I'd rather see the 5 seconds preceding that moment.

PD: in fact, if you look at the image, you can kind of see the latter part of a Lance launch for the bottle at around 3:59.

That fan with the green shirt is as bad as the sign blocking crucial frames of the Zapruder film.

HOW WILL WE EVER KNOW THE TRUTH!

You have to be careful about perspective in a 2D picture, but it sure looks as though Ivan and Armstrong are level and Contador is in between, but well behind. You are pushing up a 10% grade, watching the crazy guy running in front, trying to watch out for another attack....seems pretty easy to think that a guy next to you handing out a water bottle was giving it to you. There is nothing to indicate Armstrong even knew Contador was there.

 

[Azdak6]

Here is what we learned today about Contador's leadership skills and what he expects out of his team when he is the king of his next team....because if you don't, regardless if he wins the race, he will rat out his teammates in the press after the race.

#1 Stay out of my seat
#2 I run on my own time, so I expect the team to wait for me.
#3 All gestures from other riders during a ******* mountain stage are meant for me, King Contador.

OK, I admit--#1 made me laugh. Especially imagining him saying it in Spanish.

 

[Anonymous]

Here is what we learned today about Contador's leadership skills and what he expects out of his team when he is the king of his next team....because if you don't, regardless if he wins the race, he will rat out his teammates in the press after the race.

#1 Stay out of my seat
#2 I run on my own time, so I expect the team to wait for me.
#3 All gestures from other riders during a ******* mountain stage are meant for me, King Contador.

Here is what we have learned about Lance Armstrong's ability to actually be a teammate:
1. He is incapable of doing it.
2. It requires 1 cc of humility, and Lance doesn't have it.
3. If he cannot be "leader" (though ACTUAL leadership requires skills he doesn't have), he cannot do anything but snipe at the person who is, and then twit his wittle fwingers owff with even more sour grapes.

 

[Hugh Januss]

Here is what we have learned about Lance Armstrong's ability to actually be a teammate:
1. He is incapable of doing it.
2. It requires 1 cc of humility, and Lance doesn't have it.
3. If he cannot be "leader" (though ACTUAL leadership requires skills he doesn't have), he cannot do anything but snipe at the person who is, and then twit his wittle fwingers owff with even more sour grapes.

Here is what we learned today about Contador's leadership skills and what he expects out of his team when he is the king of his next team....because if you don't, regardless if he wins the race, he will rat out his teammates in the press after the race.

#1 Stay out of my seat
#2 I run on my own time, so I expect the team to wait for me.
#3 All gestures from other riders during a ******* mountain stage are meant for me, King Contador.

I got nothing I can add to that you guys got it nailed. Hard to believe these 2 dills are on the #1 ranked UCI team

 

[Anonymous]

I got nothing I can add to that you guys got it nailed. Hard to believe these 2 dills are on the #1 ranked UCI team

Yea, the reality is that I don't like either one. I do hope someone in the next year gets strong enough to leave them both behind. Its just that the pretenders for that throne are little better than either of them.

 

[ggusta]

Yea, the reality is that I don't like either one. I do hope someone in the next year gets strong enough to leave them both behind. Its just that the pretenders for that throne are little better than either of them.

Well folks, it looks like we have a winner. If Lance couldn't win the tdf, the least he could do was destroy AC's character amongst he 'aww shucks, wittle wance does so much for chawity' crowd. And he has done it!

He has done a great job of turning many fans with no opinion against Contador, and the fans who aren't sycophants who don't nod their zombielike heads to Lance's every pronouncement he did not need anyways. So where is his downside?

Congrats champ. I mean chump. Of course it would have been sweeter had he won the tdf AND destroyed him, but that is obviously beyond his physical capacity. But he still rules the feces coated roost of character assassination. Next stop, US Senate!

 

[Amsterhammer]

Yea, the reality is that I don't like either one. I do hope someone in the next year gets strong enough to leave them both behind. Its just that the pretenders for that throne are little better than either of them.

Aw come on, Schleklet is cute and humble, what more can you ask?

 

[ggusta]

totally off topic

Aw come on, Schleklet is cute and humble, what more can you ask?

This is way off topic, and a 'typical American' thing to pick on, but the 3 of them could all use a good orthodontist. Is this some sort of indicator of cycling potential.

'Congratulations Mrs Schleck, it's a 3.4kg climber....'

Is it a shortage of orthodonists, or no one perceives any value, or it costs too much, I think AC's are probably close to OK, but Lance and Andy.....

Are there guys in the back of the peoloton who are doubting their potential because their teeth are too straight? Do nice teeth inhibit oxygen flow?

 

[Anonymous]

Aw come on, Schleklet is cute and humble, what more can you ask?

....no connection to OP...I really do want to believe in someone in cycling again, but I honestly cannot say that I do. I cannot overlook my suspicions now, but I am sticking in and trying to see bright sides where they exist. I know this is the wrong thread, but I was really disheartened to see AC barely breathing hard at the top of the climb in the ITT. It was a little hard to take if I am being honest.

 

[Hugh Januss]

Yea, the reality is that I don't like either one. I do hope someone in the next year gets strong enough to leave them both behind. Its just that the pretenders for that throne are little better than either of them.

Thats kind of sad, how do you remain a fan if you don't like any of the competitors. I sorta like them all in their tragic hero imperfect little ways. And next years tour when there are some more evenly matched teams at the top will be cool. I think LA will come back in better condition even though he will be older, because he won't be rusty to begin the season and won't break his collarbone again. Do I think it will be enough to win? No but it will be more fun to watch than this year.

 

[Anonymous]

Thats kind of sad, how do you remain a fan if you don't like any of the competitors. I sorta like them all in their tragic hero imperfect little ways. And next years tour when there are some more evenly matched teams at the top will be cool. I think LA will come back in better condition even though he will be older, because he won't be rusty to begin the season and won't break his collarbone again. Do I think it will be enough to win? No but it will be more fun to watch than this year.

Its not easy, that I can tell you. However, I love the sport on a personal level and as a sport. Quite honestly, I am not far off of dropping any interest in cycling other than riding myself. It won't take much more, and unfortunately, I fear that the moment is not far off.

Edit: It isn't about "like," it is about my desire to watch a clean sport. I know, call me foolish...

 

[ggusta]

Its not easy, that I can tell you. However, I love the sport on a personal level and as a sport. Quite honestly, I am not far off of dropping any interest in cycling other than riding myself. It won't take much more, and unfortunately, I fear that the moment is not far off.

Edit: It isn't about "like," it is about my desire to watch a clean sport. I know, call me foolish...

There are no clean sports here on Earth, hope you are not too eager to watch sports in the hereafter!

I think your inclination is correct in your case: Love cycling for yourself. Forget about sports.

 

[Anonymous]

There are no clean sports here on Earth, hope you are not too eager to watch sports in the hereafter!

I think your inclination is correct in your case: Love cycling for yourself. Forget about sports.

I am neither naive nor stupid about any sport. My favorite sport on the planet is College Basketball. (I am from NC) I think the reason is that it is the closest to pure sport of any on the planet.(played at a elite level) Yes, I am sure there is doping. I know there are things about it that I do not like. I also know that for the most part, they are in it for the glory of playing the game. Some are just there to improve their chances of making more money later, but there is still some pureness.

Interestingly too (and I have no explanation other than I just accept my hypocrisy on the issue because we are ALL hypocritical in some ways), I love NFL Football. LOVE it. That is quite possibly the most drugged up sport on the planet. I don't know?

 

[ggusta]

I am neither naive nor stupid about any sport. My favorite sport on the planet is College Basketball. (I am from NC) I think the reason is that it is the closest to pure sport of any on the planet.(played at a elite level) Yes, I am sure there is doping. I know there are things about it that I do not like. I also know that for the most part, they are in it for the glory of playing the game. Some are just there to improve their chances of making more money later, but there is still some pureness.

Interestingly too (and I have no explanation other than I just accept my hypocrisy on the issue because we are ALL hypocritical in some ways), I love NFL Football. LOVE it. That is quite possibly the most drugged up sport on the planet. I don't know?

The NFL is the best sport to watch. Period. And yes there is a lot of dope, especially among linemen. The dope is not ok, but my viewership says it is ok. I don't have all the answers to explain such hypocrisy, but it's just the way it is. On one level the dope revolts me, but on a visceral level the game is awesome. I would dearly hate it if the people I like were caught. It doesn't mean I doubt they are doing it though.

I live in NC and as a longtime transplant, the acc drives me nuts simply because it takes on religious proportions. Anyhow, Duke appears on the way down to a less dominant level, State ...poor state.... so that leaves UNC. Go UConn !!

 

[Anonymous]

The NFL is the best sport to watch. Period. And yes there is a lot of dope, especially among linemen. The dope is not ok, but my viewership says it is ok. I don't have all the answers to explain such hypocrisy, but it's just the way it is. On one level the dope revolts me, but on a visceral level the game is awesome. I would dearly hate it if the people I like were caught. It doesn't mean I doubt they are doing it though.

I live in NC and as a longtime transplant, the acc drives me nuts simply because it takes on religious proportions. Anyhow, Duke appears on the way down to a less dominant level, State ...poor state.... so that leaves UNC. Go UConn !!

I am exactly the same way about the NFL. On a sick level, I am both disgusted by the doping and love it because of the violence it makes possible. Sick sick sick.

As for NC, when I was a kid, we watched the ACC tournament in class. Basketball WAS a religion here, but in many ways that has changed. I grew up in a rural county with 6 different high schools (4 of thhose county schools merged right before I entered HS). Each school was MAYBE 300 total students, but the basketball was amazing and intense. Actually, the first year of the combined school, we went to the state finals and our team played Washington HS whose center was none other than Dominique Wilkins. I saw him play his last HS game...they won. That intensity in rural HS basketball only fueled the college game even more. Religion is the appropriate word. I go to games from time to time now and the intensity is not the same.

Now, a couple of points:
1. Duke is not a NC school. It is the University of NJ South Campus. I cannot even describe the hatred I have of that team. (sporting hatred that is, not the real kind, though some days you would be hard pressed to tell the difference.) For instance, my son refers to Mike Krzyklopholis (or however you spell his name) as "rat face."

2. The Big East SUCKS! (we were so close to being friends...)

 

[fulcrum]

....no connection to OP...I really do want to believe in someone in cycling again, but I honestly cannot say that I do. I cannot overlook my suspicions now, but I am sticking in and trying to see bright sides where they exist. I know this is the wrong thread, but I was really disheartened to see AC barely breathing hard at the top of the climb in the ITT. It was a little hard to take if I am being honest.

I have no problem with that. I realized the entire professional peloton was doping pretty much by 1986 (I know, I was young and innocent back then). I've had plenty of time to get used to that idea.

From that point on, I had no expectation of anybody clean coming up to beat these guys. I just follow the Olympic spirit: physical achievement at all cost, like the original athletes used to do in classic Greece. They had no concept of a clean sport, everybody would take something, herbs, goat testicles, whatever they thought would help. Citius, altius, fortius.

Until society in general gets on that page, professional cyclists will lie though their teeth to the media and will be forced to face the choice between telling the truth and being a professional rider.

Yes this is what I'm saying: Lance is a dopper (Lemond, you too), Contador is a dopper, Andy and Frank are both doppers, so is Wiggo, and Nibali, Kloden is a dopper and we can continue down that list with 100% certainty until we find the first guy that ended the GC more than 3 hours behind. From that point on, the certainty drops to 99%.

I don't have a problem with any of it. In fact, I'm hoping that humanity might benefit from some of the things doctors and athletes in general learn from this situation. Hormone therapies, more active people with better endurance, having 40 year old guys feel young again etc etc.

 

[ggusta]

I am exactly the same way about the NFL. On a sick level, I am both disgusted by the doping and love it because of the violence it makes possible. Sick sick sick.

As for NC, when I was a kid, we watched the ACC tournament in class. Basketball WAS a religion here, but in many ways that has changed. I grew up in a rural county with 6 different high schools (4 of thhose county schools merged right before I entered HS). Each school was MAYBE 300 total students, but the basketball was amazing and intense. Actually, the first year of the combined school, we went to the state finals and our team played Washington HS whose center was none other than Dominique Wilkins. I saw him play his last HS game...they won. That intensity in rural HS basketball only fueled the college game even more. Religion is the appropriate word. I go to games from time to time now and the intensity is not the same.

Now, a couple of points:
1. Duke is not a NC school. It is the University of NJ South Campus. I cannot even describe the hatred I have of that team. (sporting hatred that is, not the real kind, though some days you would be hard pressed to tell the difference.) For instance, my son refers to Mike Krzyklopholis (or however you spell his name) as "rat face."

HE IS a Rat Face. Go to google images. When he is mad he is a rat face. We have a pet hamster and she is like a pretty krziewsxcdsfky. One thing, no self respecting UConn fan would EVER like Duke. 1999 was the sweetest sporting revenge I have ever felt. Like a knife was taken out of my back. I like to tease their fans, most of whom i they set foot on campus after dark would be rousted within minutes.

2. The Big East SUCKS! (we were so close to being friends...)

Did I SAY I was a big yeast fan? I said I was a Uconn fan.

 

[ggusta]

I have no problem with that. I realized the entire professional peloton was doping pretty much by 1986 (I know, I was young and innocent back then). I've had plenty of time to get used to that idea.

Until society in general gets on that page, professional cyclists will lie though their teeth to the media and will be forced to face the choice between telling the truth and being a professional rider.

Yes this is what I'm saying: Lance is a doper (Lemond, you too), Contador is a doper, Andy and Frank are both dopers, so is Wiggo, and Nibali, Kloden is a doper and we can continue down that list with 100% certainty until we find the first guy that ended the GC more than 3 hours behind. From that point on, the certainty drops to 99%.

+1

Edited quote to save space

 

[shankapot0mus]

,,,Sad what AC just said in the press,,,

Lance Armstrong and Johan Bruyneel,,,will run this kid into the ground next year, just to prove a point...and im happy about it!!! AC did not listen to
Johan Bruyneel's orders in the tour...So he will pay the piper next year!!!

 

[Anonymous]

Did I SAY I was a big yeast fan? I said I was a Uconn fan.

Fair point. Sorry about taking your title this year...OK, I'm not sorry.

 

[ggusta]

Here is what we learned today about Contador's leadership skills and what he expects out of his team when he is the king of his next team....because if you don't, regardless if he wins the race, he will rat out his teammates in the press after the race.

#1 Stay out of my seat
#2 I run on my own time, so I expect the team to wait for me.
#3 All gestures from other riders during a ******* mountain stage are meant for me, King Contador.

Where'd all the lance robots go ? It's been a few hours. Do they have to return to base to get the latest secret tweets?

Spinmeister to zombies, come in zombies, come in....Loooook into my oakleys....

 

[Anonymous]

,,,Sad what AC just said in the press,,,

Lance Armstrong and Johan Bruyneel,,,will run this kid into the ground next year, just to prove a point...and im happy about it!!! AC did not listen to
Johan Bruyneel's orders in the tour...So he will pay the piper next year!!!

Did anyone else hear that fart?

 

[Flatlander]

True Colors

Contador is emerging as a classless champion...what a shame. The way he rode the race showed he was clearly the best rider, but his insecurities regarding LA were evident with how he attacked. I'm sure the RadioShack Team will be built with bumping Contador off the Tour's top spot as its main objective.

 

[Anonymous]

I have no problem with that. I realized the entire professional peloton was doping pretty much by 1986 (I know, I was young and innocent back then). I've had plenty of time to get used to that idea.

From that point on, I had no expectation of anybody clean coming up to beat these guys. I just follow the Olympic spirit: physical achievement at all cost, like the original athletes used to do in classic Greece. They had no concept of a clean sport, everybody would take something, herbs, goat testicles, whatever they thought would help. Citius, altius, fortius.

Until society in general gets on that page, professional cyclists will lie though their teeth to the media and will be forced to face the choice between telling the truth and being a professional rider.

Yes this is what I'm saying: Lance is a doper (Lemond, you too), Contador is a doper, Andy and Frank are both dopers, so is Wiggo, and Nibali, Kloden is a doper and we can continue down that list with 100% certainty until we find the first guy that ended the GC more than 3 hours behind. From that point on, the certainty drops to 99%.

I don't have a problem with any of it. In fact, I'm hoping that humanity might benefit from some of the things doctors and athletes in general learn from this situation. Hormone therapies, more active people with better endurance, having 40 year old guys feel young again etc etc.

Good post. I wish I knew why I feel differently about it? I think maybe it has to do with the fact that I participate in the sport on a personal level. Same with running. I wasn't a football player or basketball or any other team sport. I ran from middle school on, and then when my knees started to go south a bit, I got on a bike. I guess that is the difference for me. There is a personal link with the sport that isn't part of other sports I watch.

Either way, I guess I have some acceptance of the doping because I still watch. Heck, I still hope every spring that this will be Hincapie's year in P-R...

I have always said too that my disdain for Mr Armstrong has everything to do with his actions towards others, and almost nothing to do with my belief that he doped. He really was only doing what others around him were doing.

 

[Hugh Januss]

Meanwhile the rest of society takes drugs to help them go to sleep, to help them stay awake, to make their "Pound" hard , if their knee hurts, to help them loose weight, so they can look younger, or just for fun.