Poll: Cobbles/Strade Bianchi vs. TTT

[Cobblestones]

Which would you rather like to see in a GT?

 

[Climbing]

I dislike all of them inside a GT, but the most acceptable to me it's "strade bianche" (not "bianchi" ).

 

[nvpacchi]

Only if they are the 150k+ TTTs like in the 1978 TDF.

 

[luckyboy]

Only if they are the 150k+ TTTs like in the 1978 TDF.

Is there anywhere to see the results/times for that? Would be interesting to see how big the time gaps were

 

[nvpacchi]

Is there anywhere to see the results/times for that? Would be interesting to see how big the time gaps were

check out tour-giro-vuelta.net. It is the most unbelievable database I have ever come across. Grand tour data for pretty much anything you can think of.

The 153k TTT was in stage 4 of the 1978 edition. Team Raleigh beat C&A by only 7 seconds . Hinault's (overall winner) Team Renault came in 4th around 5:15 down.

Team Jobo finished 10th 24 minutes down.

And to add insult to injury to the weaker teams, the top 5 teams received time bonuses, with the winning team receiving a 2 minute additional bonus.

The TTT didn't really help out Raleigh's leader Paul Wellens, while finishing 6th overall he still finished 14 minutes behind Hinault, even with a 7 minute advantage from the TTT.

Imagine the outcry if this stage happened in today's racing

 

[Mellow Velo]

So far, everyone has voted for SB/cobbles, bar the 3 Armstrong fans.

 

[nvpacchi]

So far, everyone has voted for SB/cobbles, bar the 3 Armstrong fans.

Hey I'm no fanboy, just an advocate for bringing back ridiculous stages that would make current race directors cringe.

 

[luckyboy]

check out tour-giro-vuelta.net. It is the most unbelievable database I have ever come across. Grand tour data for pretty much anything you can think of.

The 153k TTT was in stage 4 of the 1978 edition. Team Raleigh beat C&A by only 7 seconds . Hinault's (overall winner) Team Renault came in 4th around 5:15 down.

Team Jobo finished 10th 24 minutes down.

And to add insult to injury to the weaker teams, the top 5 teams received time bonuses, with the winning team receiving a 2 minute additional bonus.

The TTT didn't really help out Raleigh's leader Paul Wellens, while finishing 6th overall he still finished 14 minutes behind Hinault, even with a 7 minute advantage from the TTT.

Imagine the outcry if this stage happened in today's racing

Thanks That's a good site.

 

[ingsve]

I like both cobbled and gravel roads in GTs but a compromise could perhaps be to have more ardennes type stages in the beginning to still get the excitement in the first few days. Perhaps even more hill top finishes with say a steep 2-3 km climb in the end.

And before anyone mentions the carnage of stage 2, that can be remedied by not using the absolutely narrowest and trickiest road and also it's not common that the road gets soaked with oil...

 

[Escarabajo]

I dislike all of them inside a GT, but the most acceptable to me it's "strade bianche" (not "bianchi" ).

+1.

My thoughts exactly.

 

[Eyeballs Out]

Cobbles for me

TTT is even more dull than a completely flat stage with no wind

Unless ........ it was a TTT over cobbles

 

[Cobblestones]

Cobbles for me

TTT is even more dull than a completely flat stage with no wind

Unless ........ it was a TTT over cobbles

That would be an idea.

 

[Timmy-loves-Rabo]

cobbles/SB -- SB was epic, but the bad weather kinda helped imo.

Personally I'd love to see more of these stages in GTs. Really entertaining stuff.
TTT I don't like very much, but I rather like them as an opening stage rather then the prologue... say 10-15km long. (like the vuelta a couple years back... 2007?)

 

[djconnel]

Strada blanca is fine; cobbles are in a different league, as they're much more random.

There's a long, long history of racing over dirt roads in the grand tours. The cobbles have, however, always been a particularly cruel novelty.

I'd rank them:
1. Strada blanca
2. TTT
3. cobbles

The Sienna stage in the Giro was epic stuff.

Gavia Pass (okay, not a race shot, but I love it anyway):

 

[BeachBum]

I voted for 'both,' but not in the same GT. There's room for gravel, cobbles and TTTs in GTs. All of those stages break up the GC standings and are good for that reason, it shouldn't just be up to the high mountains and individual TTs to decide things.

Having said that, if I were the race director, I'd try to mix it up as much as possible. The Tour has had cobbles twice in the last 7 years-- I wouldn't put them in much more often than that. Somebody else mentioned in another thread that you leave out the 5 star cobble sectors, no need for Arenburg or Carrefour d'Arbe in the Tour. The 7 sectors they had this year were fine.

TTTs, again, no need to have them every year, maybe 2 of every 5 years, in place of a TT. One thing though, I wouldn't make them over 40K, there would be drama, but nobody would lose the Tour over a bad TTT.

One more thing I would do, toss in a couple of finishes on Cat 2 or 3 climbs. 8 or 9 or however many sprint finishes are too many, give the roulleurs and power climbers a (better) chance once in a while.

 

[hfer07]

Cobbles should be mandatory-So those called GT riders will finally be forced to show their a$$es in the Classics and become real riders

 

[la.margna]

what a great idea! TTT or ITT over cobbles!! minimzed crash risk but fun for the fans!

 

[riobonito92]

I voted both - Stage 7 of the Giro was the best day of racing so far this year - but on the condition that the TTT is a short prologue, like in last year's giro. (I think a 2-up 5 km prologue would be awesome and would create all sorts of tactical dilemmas but that ain't never gonna happen).

Let's be honest, the alternative to this year's cobbles stage would have been another flat day with doomed breakaway and bunch sprint.

 

[riobonito92]

How about a relay TTT (one rider at a time) on a 1 km technical circuit, inclulding a stretch of cobbles and a bit of dirt with madison slings for the changeovers?

 

[djconnel]

Well, you need at some point to draw the line between variety and gimmick. It would be novel to have the riders ride over a jump through a flaming hoop over a tank filled with sharks with lasers on their heads, but that's not necessarily the best way to select the "champion".

The issue with cobbles is the risk of getting caught behind crashes makes for an unsafe environment, similar to a dangerous sprint without the 3km rule or, for that matter, the "same time" bunch-finish rule.

It turned out relatively okay. Armstrong lost time with a flat, but since the team suffered three flats on the stage you've got to wonder about their tire and wheel selection. For example, did they use liquid latex in their tubes?

 

[Rocksteady]

I like the TTT. Of Course I like ITTs too. Mostly because my favorite team (Garmin) is usually good at both. Nothing wrong with Cobbs or Gravel, just like the teamwork needed in the TTT.

 

[sagard]

Cobbles should be mandatory-So those called GT riders will finally be forced to show their a$$es in the Classics and become real riders

I agree. Put cobbles in every year. Luck will sort itself out over a riders GT career.

 

[Willy_Voet]

I'd prefer 10 days of cobbles/dirt roads. The predictability of mountain top finishes is getting to me.

 

[Yshore]

I think the Strade stage was better than the cobbles because the risk of injury was smaller, sure the risk of crashing was roughly the same as the cobbles but landing on solid edges of cobbles is much worse than falling onto dirt or mud. I would like to see a stage like that in the transition from the alps to pyrenees so to create a different type of "drama" (if you can call contador riding away from everyone drama) in the final weeks.

 

[auscyclefan94]

LIke starde bianche and cobbles but cobbles could be seen as a bit too descisive.