Radioshack-Leopard Trek

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eleven said:
When the merger happens and Bruyneel is in charge, will that indicate to you that Johan is "still relevant in the sport"?
It would suggest that the Schlecks could have just stayed at Saxo, leave for a year of autonomy only to go back to a team boss just as powerful as Riis?
 
Jul 4, 2009
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rickshaw said:
"Is happening... might happen... has happened... will happen..." all your difficulties can be resolved with quantum cycling theory. At the sub atomic level riders can be in TWO places at once, or in fact NO places at once; stupidity and genius must co-exist because time cease to be relative, or exist at all. Teams, riders and sponsors will all pop in an out of existance, seemingly at random... and the act of forumits observing them will influence that which they observe, and uncertsinty will be the only constant.

In stark contrast, threads such as this at the "big picture level", appear to be collapsing on themselves, becoming infinitely dense so that no content is able to escape, and time itself ceases to exist

or that's the way it feels.
...yup...that just about sums it all up...so now that we know the answer to life, the universe and everything why don't we all just quit this forum stuff and get on with life...starting with everyone going down to their favourite watering hole and having a beer or two...its all tranquillo now, the forum is dead, long live the forum!....

Cheers

blutto
 
I saw this coming long time ago when first Trek was announced as a financial backer for the Leopard team, along with the troubles on the Shack camp with the LA issues & the not-renewal of the sponsorship coming up for 2012 onwards -gotta remember who's the owner of RS's licence & influential power on Trek still- and I ain't talking about the Hog.........
always look for the big picture my friends... there is someone out there cashing in behind the curtains....
 
May 14, 2010
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hfer07 said:
I saw this coming long time ago when first Trek was announced as a financial backer for the Leopard team, along with the troubles on the Shack camp with the LA issues & the not-renewal of the sponsorship coming up for 2012 onwards -gotta remember who's the owner of RS's licence & influential power on Trek still- and I ain't talking about the Hog.........
always look for the big picture my friends... there is someone out there cashing in behind the curtains....
Agree with you on all counts, except I'm pretty sure RS has already extended through 2012, haven't they?
 
Mar 8, 2010
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hfer07 said:
I saw this coming long time ago when first Trek was announced as a financial backer for the Leopard team, along with the troubles on the Shack camp with the LA issues & the not-renewal of the sponsorship coming up for 2012 onwards -gotta remember who's the owner of RS's licence & influential power on Trek still- and I ain't talking about the Hog.........
always look for the big picture my friends... there is someone out there cashing in behind the curtains....
Yeah, agree. Godlike performance. :D
 
@ Maxiton-yes -but what we have here is a "Merger" between the two teams-which means RS can easily either become a small sponsor or pull out at all- and since we know how Pat & UCI bend over to what LA says-it won't be an issue at all -sadly
 
May 14, 2010
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Ferminal said:
It would suggest that the Schlecks could have just stayed at Saxo, leave for a year of autonomy only to go back to a team boss just as powerful as Riis?
Yep. Also true. But with Armstrong/Bruyneel, Pat/UCI, ASO, and even Merckx now behind them, you could argue that they're only just now finding out about power (despite RR's claims of irrelevancy for Bruyneel). If, that is, any of this is even real (see signature).
 
Apr 20, 2009
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Ferminal said:
It would suggest that the Schlecks could have just stayed at Saxo, leave for a year of autonomy only to go back to a team boss just as powerful as Riis?
That's a very interesting observation. Was there any indication the relationship with Riis had soured? Or perhaps they found it much more difficult to lineup the tens of millions in sponsors required for a modern protour team? Perhaps they thought they could make more money by "skipping the middle man" as it were?
 
Aug 13, 2009
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Becca did not say much when the team was getting started but he did indicate that he saw this as an investment. He was not just a fan who had $20 million to toss at the sport. He figured that he would give the team some start up cash, sign top riders, and make his money back when they find a big sponsor.....but that sponsor never came.

Belgacom did what they always did, pretend they were going to do a deal and back out at the last minute. Trek found out they would be in the title less then a week before the launch. I doubt part of Becca's plan was to float the team for this long without a sponsor.

There have been rumors of a merger for a long time. Since prior to the Tour. The challenges against one seem overwhelming. Given the initial push came from Trek it is not a stretch to think this is just more posturing by Johan. Not much different from the new cycling league he was supposed to set up.
 
May 14, 2010
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Race Radio said:
Becca did not say much when the team was getting started but he did indicate that he saw this as an investment. He was not just a fan who had $20 million to toss at the sport. He figured that he would give the team some start up cash, sign top riders, and make his money back when they find a big sponsor.....but that sponsor never came.

Belgacom did what they always did, pretend they were going to do a deal and back out at the last minute. Trek found out they would be in the title less then a week before the launch. I doubt part of Becca's plan was to float the team for this long without a sponsor.

There have been rumors of a merger for a long time. Since prior to the Tour. The challenges against one seem overwhelming. Given the initial push came from Trek it is not a stretch to think this is just more posturing by Johan. Not much different from the new cycling league he was supposed to set up.
What exactly are the challenges against some sort of merger?

Vis a vis Trek and Johan, I'm not following. If Trek wants this to be successful, doesn't it make sense they'd want to bring in the DS with whom they've had the most success? Especially if that's what Armstrong wants them to do? (As an aside, is Armstrong an investor in Trek?)
 
Aug 13, 2009
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Maxiton said:
What exactly are the challenges against some sort of merger?

Vis a vis Trek and Johan, I'm not following. If Trek wants this to be successful, doesn't it make sense they'd want to bring in the DS with whom they've had the most success? Especially if that's what Armstrong wants them to do? (As an aside, is Armstrong an investor in Trek?)
The key challenge is the number of riders under contract. You can only have 30, the combined teams have far more.

Certainly Johan has had success in the past but these days he comes with a huge amount of baggage. Multiple investigation in multiple countries. He does not attend races in the US, runs whens the cops show up at the hotel in Italy. Hard to ignore the possibility that he is more of a liability then an asset
 
Jul 28, 2010
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Angliru said:
...and Kim Andersson is any better????
I just don't want the Schlecks flying the Armstrong flag. Having Johan in charge would be flying it at full mast.

Stay away for your own good!!!!
 
May 14, 2010
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Race Radio said:
The key challenge is the number of riders under contract. You can only have 30, the combined teams have far more.

Certainly Johan has had success in the past but these days he comes with a huge amount of baggage. Multiple investigation in multiple countries. He does not attend races in the US, runs whens the cops show up at the hotel in Italy. Hard to ignore the possibility that he is more of a liability then an asset
How was that issue handled with the Garmin-Cervelo merger? Can they say "new entity, previous contracts void"?

I heard there is a pot of gold waiting for him in LA, if only he'll fly over for it. :D I see what you're saying, though. Hadn't thought about that. But maybe Trek has some reason to think nothing will come of it, or just doesn't care that much.
 
Jul 28, 2010
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Angliru said:
"Awesome" is definitely not the word that I would use to describe that prospect. Nauseating and unfortunate would be more of how I'd describe it if it involves AS.
How could you not LOVE the idea of seeing these guys all over the US?? :p



For me at least, I'll still root for them if this merger happens, but I'd much prefer for it not to.

I also don't see how it would even be possible with all the contracted riders.
 
Aug 13, 2009
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Maxiton said:
How was that issue handled with the Garmin-Cervelo merger? Can they say "new entity, previous contracts void"?

I heard there is a pot of gold waiting for him in LA, if only he'll fly over for it. :D I see what you're saying, though. Hadn't thought about that. But maybe Trek has some reason to think nothing will come of it, or just doesn't care that much.
Both let go of a lot of riders not under contract and shifted some riders to their U23 team
 
Angliru said:
"Awesome" is definitely not the word that I would use to describe that prospect. Nauseating and unfortunate would be more of how I'd describe it if it involves AS.
whoa, whoa, whoa. I was speaking in general when I said it "would be awesome if some foreigner got to that point in the US" (as a recognized athlete of the year). I did not mean it would be awesome if AS got recognized as such. You are ABSOLUTELY right that for AS to be recognized as such in the US would be all of what you said, plus there would have to be no athletes left in the US to be considered. For a non-US cyclist to be honored like that it would have to be someone on the caliber of Merckx, Indurain, or maybe even AC.
 
May 14, 2010
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on3m@n@rmy said:
whoa, whoa, whoa. I was speaking in general when I said it "would be awesome if some foreigner got to that point in the US" (as a recognized athlete of the year). I did not mean it would be awesome if AS got recognized as such. You are ABSOLUTELY right that for AS to be recognized as such in the US would be all of what you said, plus there would have to be no athletes left in the US to be considered. For a non-US cyclist to be honored like that it would have to be someone on the caliber of Merckx, Indurain, or maybe even AC.
I think UCI, Trek, et al. are convinced they can transform these guys into sports heros in the US - as opposed to Contador or whoever. It's an absurd and extremely small-minded idea. Sad to think Merckx goes along with it.
 
May 23, 2011
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Maxiton said:
I think UCI, Trek, et al. are convinced they can transform these guys into sports heros in the US - as opposed to Contador or whoever. It's an absurd and extremely small-minded idea. Sad to think Merckx goes along with it.
It might help if one of them could win something that americans have heard of. A string of second places are not going to cut it.
 
May 14, 2010
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But of course Merckx is pals with Armstrong, and we all know Contador's career of GT domination was coming along unhindered (leaving aside a certain, minor distraction) until he refused to roll over for Armstrong's comeback. Had Contador agreed to give up a couple of consecutive Tours de France, maybe he'd be the new designated patron - or maybe he'd still have been screwed (see Basso).
 
May 14, 2010
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Damiano Machiavelli said:
It might help if one of them could win something that americans have heard of. A string of second places are not going to cut it.
Yeah, that would be nice.
 
Jul 30, 2009
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rickshaw said:
"Is happening... might happen... has happened... will happen..." all your difficulties can be resolved with quantum cycling theory. At the sub atomic level riders can be in TWO places at once, or in fact NO places at once; stupidity and genius must co-exist because time cease to be relative, or exist at all. Teams, riders and sponsors will all pop in an out of existance, seemingly at random... and the act of forumits observing them will influence that which they observe, and uncertsinty will be the only constant.

In stark contrast, threads such as this at the "big picture level", appear to be collapsing on themselves, becoming infinitely dense so that no content is able to escape, and time itself ceases to exist

or that's the way it feels.
Now that's funny :)
 
jobiwan said:
I just don't want the Schlecks flying the Armstrong flag. Having Johan in charge would be flying it at full mast.

Stay away for your own good!!!!
Not to go very critical-but is this move happens-which appears it will -It only demonstrates the Schleck Bros lack of self character to guide their own careers-because they thought they had escaped from a tough DS like Riis, just to end up worse than ever, by being the puppets of LA & The Hog-they might get them to win the Tour, but they're becoming their slaves, not only sporting wise but life-style wise, so they can be squeezed to the last drop of their fame to convert it into money here in the US-and when is done & they revel & decide to go elsewhere- they'll be thrown out like the others have-with a positive or empty handed without a team.....

One thing for sure Is that Cancellara won't be around to be part of it, since he well knows that LA & Bruyneel don't give a fvck about the classics & they only send a team to "comply" with the Pro-Tour calender.....
 
May 14, 2010
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hfer07 said:
Not to go very critical-but is this move happens-which appears it will -It only demonstrates the Schleck Bros lack of self character to guide their own careers-because they thought they had escaped from a tough DS like Riis, just to end up worse than ever, by being the puppets of LA & The Hog-they might get them to win the Tour, but they're becoming their slaves, not only sporting wise but life-style wise, so they can be squeezed to the last drop of their fame to convert it into money here in the US-and when is done & they revel & decide to go elsewhere- they'll be thrown out like they other have-with a positive or empty handed without a team.....

One thing for sure Is that Cancellara won't be around to be part of it, since he well knows that LA & Bruyneel don't give a fvck about the classics & they only send a team to "comply" with the Pro-Tour calender.....
Agreed. Definitely.
 

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