Rank these six riders based on overall ability

[Asero831]

All of these six cyclists are accomplished and still a lot of room for more as they are less than 30 yrs old.

Daniel Martin
Rui Costa
Michal Kwiatkowski
Peter Sagan
Greg Van Avermaet
Geraint Thomas

Here's mine:
Rui Costa
Daniel Martin
Michal Kwiatkowski
Peter Sagan
Geraint Thomas
Gerg Van Avermaet

Just based on that, it seems that Sagan is more than twice as much as salary as the other five cyclists.

 

[LaFlorecita]

Purely on ability,
Kwiatkowski
Sagan
Costa
Martin
Thomas
Van Avermaet

 

[Panda Claws]

Costa and Martin are efficient cyclists that managed to get wins partly duo to tactical prowess. When we are talking about raw ability Kwiatkowski and Sagan seem to have a lot more potential.

If we are talking about current ability it is in my opinion very close between most of them, but if we're talking potential then:
Kwiatkowski/Sagan
Martin
Costa
Van Avermaet
Thomas (never really performs imo)

 

[TMP402]

I don't think Thomas is really in the same category as they others. I think he's destined to be a very versatile domestique. Costa and Martin can't do cobbles, and Kwia has only shown potential on them, Sagan and and GVA can't do mountains. Which leaves Thomas, but he just doesn't have the luck of a true winner.

 

[Parrulo]

Imo:
Kwiatkowski
Sagan (with the way things are going sagan could be on his way to become popo 2.0 and dropping on this list but for now i only put kwia ahead)
Costa/Martin (imo they are at a similar level with different strengths and weaknesses
Thomas
Van Avermaet

A more interesting question imo, is how will Martin and Costa (both 28 so just reaching their peak) do on the classics and to lesser degree 1 week races, now that the old guard (valverde, purito, gilbert, Gerrans, Contador) is going away and some new talent is showing up.

 

[Netserk]

Kwiatkowski
Sagan
Martin
Costa
Van Avermaet
Thomas

 

[Asero831]

Thomas performs well in PR

 

[Mr.White]

Kwiatkowski/Sagan
Rui Costa
Martin
Thomas
Van Avermaet

 

[Cance > TheRest]

Peter Sagan
Michal Kwiatkowski




Rui Costa
Daniel Martin
Geraint Thomas
Gerg Van Avermaet

 

[HelloDolly]

Re:

Imo:
Kwiatkowski
Sagan (with the way things are going sagan could be on his way to become popo 2.0 and dropping on this list but for now i only put kwia ahead)
Costa/Martin (imo they are at a similar level with different strengths and weaknesses
Thomas
Van Avermaet

A more interesting question imo, is how will Martin and Costa (both 28 so just reaching their peak) do on the classics and to lesser degree 1 week races, now that the old guard (valverde, purito, gilbert, Gerrans, Contador) is going away and some new talent is showing up.

Emmm Valverde is going to stick around till he is 40 according to Unzue

Back to the riders above ...Firstly ability means different things and at different points in time

In cycling the most important ability is the ability to win (or help someone else in your team win)
Nothing else really matters like how you can go up or down a hill or how many times you can be 4th

So from the list for me at this point in time its

Kwiatkowski
Martin
Thomas
Costa
Sagan
GVA

 

[Netserk]

So you'd rank Greipel higher than Contador?^^

 

[Parrulo]

Re: Re:

Imo:
Kwiatkowski
Sagan (with the way things are going sagan could be on his way to become popo 2.0 and dropping on this list but for now i only put kwia ahead)
Costa/Martin (imo they are at a similar level with different strengths and weaknesses
Thomas
Van Avermaet

A more interesting question imo, is how will Martin and Costa (both 28 so just reaching their peak) do on the classics and to lesser degree 1 week races, now that the old guard (valverde, purito, gilbert, Gerrans, Contador) is going away and some new talent is showing up.

Emmm Valverde is going to stick around till he is 40 according to Unzue

Back to the riders above ...Firstly ability means different things and at different points in time

In cycling the most important ability is the ability to win (or help someone else in your team win)
Nothing else really matters like how you can go up or down a hill or how many times you can be 4th

So from the list for me at this point in time its

Kwiatkowski
Martin
Thomas
Costa
Sagan
GVA

If winning is the only thing that matters, why do you rank Thomas ahead of 2 guys with much more and better wins?

 

[BigMac]

#consistency
#coherency

#fail

 

[BigMac]

Re: Re:

[...]

Back to the riders above ...Firstly ability means different things and at different points in time

In cycling the most important ability is the ability to win (or help someone else in your team win)

[...]

OP clearly stated overall ability. There can't be ambiguity as to what that means.

 

[Asero831]

Overall ability means what you CAN DO and not exactly what you will do or what have you done.. So throw away accomplishments and potential. It is about if you have a schoolyard pick for a cycling season, you will you like to have on your team..

 

[Billie]

Sagan has really become way underrated the last year.

Sagan
Kwiatkowski

Van Avermaet
Thomas

Martin
Costa

Everybody seems to put GVA last, tell me who was else ever top 5'd RVV, Roubaix and the Gold race in consecutive weeks.

 

[Parrulo]

Re:

Sagan has really become way underrated the last year.

Sagan
Kwiatkowski

Van Avermaet
Thomas

Martin
Costa

Everybody seems to put GVA last, tell me who was else ever top 5'd RVV, Roubaix and the Gold race in consecutive weeks.

I don't know, because that's a completely irrelevant statistic considering he didn't win any.

 

[DBotero]

Kwiatkowski
GVA
Sagan
G.
Costa
Martin

Sagan seems to go downhill these days,but there is still time to rise back to glory.

 

[Velolover2]

Kwaitkowski
Sagan
GVA
Martin
Costa
Thomas

 

[HelloDolly]

Re:

#consistency
#coherency

#fail

Is that directed at me ???

Firstly there is clearly no definition of ability in OP so I stated my definition because I am not sure what is meant
As for you #consitency #coherency - for the benefit of both it might be better if you took the time and bother to write full sentences (this in not twitter) because you are certainly not adding to either

As for Greipel having more ability than Contador ...I said winning, the quality of the wins is a given...Winning the Tour de France puts you in a different category than several stages of Tour of Turkey (or such similar race) and therefore not equitable..so if you are going to be pedantic - the quality of the win is paramount

I also said my choice are based on riders 'ability' (wins and quality of win) at the moment ie in last year /18 months...which is how most riders are judged not just be fans but also when seeking a contract
Kwait is first & Dan Martin is 2nd IMO

 

[HelloDolly]

Re:

Overall ability means what you CAN DO and not exactly what you will do or what have you done.. So throw away accomplishments and potential. It is about if you have a schoolyard pick for a cycling season, you will you like to have on your team..

You can only judge what someone can do based on what they have done ..what other method is there ??

We do not know the physiology of these riders nor how they will react in different situations based on psychological tests ..we just know what they have done so far

 

[BigMac]

Re: Re:

Overall ability means what you CAN DO and not exactly what you will do or what have you done.. So throw away accomplishments and potential. It is about if you have a schoolyard pick for a cycling season, you will you like to have on your team..

You can only judge what someone can do based on what they have done ..what other method is there ??

We do not know the physiology of these riders nor how they will react in different situations based on psychological tests ..we just know what they have done so far

A second, a third or a fourth can be as telling as win.

 

[BigMac]

Re: Re:

#consistency
#coherency

#fail

Is that directed at me ???

Firstly there is clearly no definition of ability in OP so I stated my definition because I am not sure what is meant
As for you #consitency #coherency - for the benefit of both it might be better if you took the time and bother to write full sentences (this in not twitter) because you are certainly not adding to either

As for Greipel having more ability than Contador ...I said winning, the quality of the wins is a given...Winning the Tour de France puts you in a different category than several stages of Tour of Turkey (or such similar race) and therefore not equitable..so if you are going to be pedantic - the quality of the win is paramount

I also said my choice are based on riders 'ability' (wins and quality of win) at the moment ie in last year /18 months...which is how most riders are judged not just be fans but also when seeking a contract
Kwait is first & Dan Martin is 2nd IMO

If winning is the only thing that matters, why do you rank Thomas ahead of 2 guys with much more and better wins?

Yes.

 

[Mr.White]

Re: Re:

#consistency
#coherency

#fail

Is that directed at me ???

Firstly there is clearly no definition of ability in OP so I stated my definition because I am not sure what is meant
As for you #consitency #coherency - for the benefit of both it might be better if you took the time and bother to write full sentences (this in not twitter) because you are certainly not adding to either

As for Greipel having more ability than Contador ...I said winning, the quality of the wins is a given...Winning the Tour de France puts you in a different category than several stages of Tour of Turkey (or such similar race) and therefore not equitable..so if you are going to be pedantic - the quality of the win is paramount

I also said my choice are based on riders 'ability' (wins and quality of win) at the moment ie in last year /18 months...which is how most riders are judged not just be fans but also when seeking a contract
Kwait is first & Dan Martin is 2nd IMO

Sagan have 3-4 times bigger contract than Dan Martin, how is he second then?

 

[HelloDolly]

Re: Re:

#consistency
#coherency

#fail

Is that directed at me ???

Firstly there is clearly no definition of ability in OP so I stated my definition because I am not sure what is meant
As for you #consitency #coherency - for the benefit of both it might be better if you took the time and bother to write full sentences (this in not twitter) because you are certainly not adding to either

As for Greipel having more ability than Contador ...I said winning, the quality of the wins is a given...Winning the Tour de France puts you in a different category than several stages of Tour of Turkey (or such similar race) and therefore not equitable..so if you are going to be pedantic - the quality of the win is paramount

I also said my choice are based on riders 'ability' (wins and quality of win) at the moment ie in last year /18 months...which is how most riders are judged not just be fans but also when seeking a contract
Kwait is first & Dan Martin is 2nd IMO

Sagan have 3-4 times bigger contract than Dan Martin, how is he second then?

Sagan's place is based on his wins in the last year as previously stated ...my comment is on what usually happens when judging a rider but in this case things are skewed because Tinkov started a stupid (though not for Sagan) and erroneous bidding war

But on the whole a team will buy a rider based on results esp in big races ( and that includes helping someone to win like Luca Paolini

As in all competitive sport winning is the greatest currency