Removing dropout lawyer tabs?

[laziali]

Any advice on how to get rid of those damn lawyer tabs on the front dropouts without destroying the forks? You know, those stupid alloy tabs at the end of carbon forks that mean you have to open AND unscrew your front QR lever to remove the wheel. Certainly didn't used to be on bikes when I was racing eons ago.

I am thinking of delicate work with a mini hacksaw and a file, but has anyone done this before - race-team mechanic or just frustrated cyclist like me?

Thanks in advance

 

[Paul64]

I just filed them off on my Alpha Q. No problem, not sure how it effects warrenty. Since True Temper/Alpha Q is no more I don't have to worry about it.

 

[Bustedknuckle]

Any advice on how to get rid of those damn lawyer tabs on the front dropouts without destroying the forks? You know, those stupid alloy tabs at the end of carbon forks that mean you have to open AND unscrew your front QR lever to remove the wheel. Certainly didn't used to be on bikes when I was racing eons ago.

I am thinking of delicate work with a mini hacksaw and a file, but has anyone done this before - race-team mechanic or just frustrated cyclist like me?

Thanks in advance

Flat file...BUT your warranty is adios if you do remove them.

 

[ElChingon]

Dremel, faster than a file. Then you can even polish it or rough it up, depending if you desire some grip. Unless you go pointing it out that you did it no one but you will know, warranty...

 

[Master50]

I keep hearing warrantee will end but do you really think a steer tube issue would be denied because the ll were filed off? Sure I could see a drop out failure warrantee claim. Next thing people will claim no warrantee if you mount fenders with a clamp.
My Colnago did not have any and my wife's Lomond was replaced with a Trek 120 on warrantee LL were filed off that bike too.
We don't race anymore so I probably could have left them on the Trek but I hate them on principle.
Of course after reading a Tri thread on Quick releases being open on rides maybe I am too quick to judge the need of some to have the extra security?
I used a Dremel and finished with a file. I would recommend extreme caution if you have carbon drop outs which often have a metal face. The metal is pretty thin and maybe the tabs add structure to those?

 

[richwagmn]

I keep hearing warrantee will end but do you really think a steer tube issue would be denied because the ll were filed off?

Sure, if it means not having to provide a new frame. From Trek's website:

"This warranty is void in its entirety by any modification of the frame, fork, or components."

http://www.trekbikes.com/au/en/support/warranty

 

[MR_Sarcastic]

A flat file works well on Aluminum tabs.

I never filed off the tabs on my TT bike, because the fork tabs are carbon. Since it's a TT bike, I see no need to file them.

 

[fatsprintking]

A flat file works well on Aluminum tabs.

I never filed off the tabs on my TT bike, because the fork tabs are carbon. Since it's a TT bike, I see no need to file them.

I dont file them because it will be quicker in road races, I file em cause I get the s--ts up stuffing around everytime I want to put the bike on the roof of the car when they are on. It usually breaks down that its raining, I have a gearbag full of junk and I have gloves on and I have to stuff around undoing the skewer four turns to be able to get the wheel out. Then I need to try and balance the bike with one hand on the roof while the other hand tries in vain to tighten the skewer nut (which is really a two handed job), before repeating the whole sorry process to get the thing off the roof again.

With the tabs off the process is no stress. Tabs on its a PITA.

 

[El Oso]

Q.Nick,
I think everyone is in agreement that lawyer tabs on forks are a nuisance. In the past I have filed off the tabs but I’m hesitant to do this with my new Enve carbon fork. I’m not sure if removing the tab will affect the integrity of the fork. I can’t imagine professional teams putting up with these tabs. They make wheel changes much slower. Are they able to get forks without tabs or do they remove them?
— Mark

A.Mark,
Pro teams file them off. I filed them off of my own personal Enve fork. But strictly speaking, you’re going to void your warranty if you damage the dropouts in taking off the tabs.

Jake Pantone at Enve had this to say, “The lawyer tabs on our forks are not structurally integrated to the fork legs, crown, etc. But you could damage fibers in the dropout if you aren’t careful. Enve does not condone you filing them off.”

So, tread cautiously. Take off as little material as possible with a hand file. Do NOT use a Dremel tool or other power tool. You could quickly destroy a fork with those.

http://velonews.competitor.com/2012/02/bikes-and-tech/ask-nick/ask-nick-stretching-tubulars-lawyer-tabs_206028

 

[Master50]

Sure, if it means not having to provide a new frame. From Trek's website:

"This warranty is void in its entirety by any modification of the frame, fork, or components."

http://www.trekbikes.com/au/en/support/warranty

Boy I hate them even more. The Lemond was replaced under warrantee and I had filed the lips off. Trek was the replacement for the Lemond. Great modify your bottle cage and the frame loses it warrantee? Trek is my hero NOT.

 

[Master50]

I dont file them because it will be quicker in road races, I file em cause I get the s--ts up stuffing around everytime I want to put the bike on the roof of the car when they are on. It usually breaks down that its raining, I have a gearbag full of junk and I have gloves on and I have to stuff around undoing the skewer four turns to be able to get the wheel out. Then I need to try and balance the bike with one hand on the roof while the other hand tries in vain to tighten the skewer nut (which is really a two handed job), before repeating the whole sorry process to get the thing off the roof again.

With the tabs off the process is no stress. Tabs on its a PITA.

I believe a friend had quick releases on the rack that opened far enough for the tabs. Might have been a Tule rack but the QR definitely opened much wider than the one on his wheels

 

[fatsprintking]

I believe a friend had quick releases on the rack that opened far enough for the tabs. Might have been a Tule rack but the QR definitely opened much wider than the one on his wheels

Yeah but I refuse to pay for something that I can make in the shed for about 10 bucks using one of the 50 old skewers that I have lying around. Much happier to spend 30 seconds with the dremel. I am not too worried about voiding anything on my caad4 dale

 

[Martin318is]

I just rejoice that I was lucky enough that my bike came to me earlier than expected because it was accidentally made for a pro-rider that had already just received his bike. As such, I have a nice flat set of dropouts with no modifications required!

3 years and I am still not dead.

 

[Notso Swift]

The tabs are not a legal requirement in Australia but under UCI Rules it is illegal to modify the the frame (inc fork) in any way...

So leave them on and next time you get beaten at the local crit protest the guy who gave you the whip ar$e the commissar can't do anything else but exclude them! just make sure you own rig is over 6.8kg

 

[ElChingon]

For those using a dremel just don't set it to mach 1, the slow speeds take care of it pretty quickly, even the carbon ones. I'm sure a guy from that other thread might use a grinder or hack saw which is the wrong tool for this job.

For those wanting to be within the legal realm just round them down to a small bump. When the time comes, hey I removed my wheel so many times it wore down, you'll be all within the legal warranty realm . With a little creativity you can come up with an angle to justify why they are not there anymore.

 

[simo1733]

If you file off carbon tabs, you will most likely expose some threads which could lead to the ingress of moisture and eventual delamination of the fork.
Better to seal the area with clear coat or as an alternative clear nail varnish.

 

[avanti]

The tabs are not a legal requirement in Australia but under UCI Rules it is illegal to modify the the frame (inc fork) in any way...

So leave them on and next time you get beaten at the local crit protest the guy who gave you the whip ar$e the commissar can't do anything else but exclude them! just make sure you own rig is over 6.8kg

The EU is now mandating lawyer tabs on all new bikes used on public roads. The UCI is also enforcing this rule (and your countries cycling body or legislature) could also add this rule. http://www.cyclingsa.com/App_Resources/Uploads/FILE00000956.pdf

Note also the 89 mm requirement for pedal/tire clearance - my bike just meets this requirement but I hear that some don't..

I read somewhere that manufacturers are designing QR skewers with longer throw to clear the lawyer tabs.

 

[Notso Swift]

Yes that is he document that is in the hands of our local commissars as well, hence my comments

 

[Master50]

Being involved with the development of product standards I am wondering what the lawyer lip spec is? Some one posted a relevant point sorry I can't properly credit you but the suggestion was that fork tabs are likely developed with the quick release parameters defined to operate a certain throw distance. Maybe QR have a product standard too. The point is it might also be illegal to change the QR to a type with a greater cam range that might open wider than the fork tabs. Front wheel changes are going to change if fork tabs are legally required.
I just confirmed the newest bike in our garage was made in 2006 for the 2007 racing season it did not have tabs. All the other road bikes are older and only the Trek has tabs. I don't think they are legally required but might exist in the Product standard for the US? I think most are there for liability reasons. I have a caveat however. Only road bikes and maybe only racing road bikes should be free of these. I hate nanny regulations but as a safety feature for a mtb or cx bike I am on board for keeping them. My observations of the mechanical skills of a lot of people suggests that QR are actually difficult for some to understand but then again they are not safe with any tools or sharp objects

 

[laziali]

Thanks for the advice guys. I ended up using a flat file as suggested on the alu tabs and it worked a treat. No more LTs. Happy cyclist

 

[avanti]

............... My observations of the mechanical skills of a lot of people suggests that QR are actually difficult for some to understand but then again they are not safe with any tools or sharp objects

True; I've seen people with expensive bikes use the QR lever like a wing-nut to tighten the hub in the frame.

 

[Hawkwood]

I have to confess that I have cycled with the front quick release not done up. It was at the age of 15 some decades ago. I'd done some work on my bike and then decided to cycle to the local town, about 2 miles away. The route took me up over a small hill and down a fairly fast, twisty descent. On the descent I noticed the steering was wrong, I applied the brakes and came to a halt at which point I realised the quick release was not done up. Lawyer tabs would not have prevented the steering issues I had.

I file the tabs off all of my forks. I find it unbelievable that the UCI is making them mandatory even for the pros, especially as the chances of a team mechanic not tightening up a QR is nil.