State of the peloton 2022

[fmk_RoI]

Still, looking at the data it seems to me that it happens way more often to riders on non-MPCC teams, so potential stimulant abuse and it's long term effects on the heart could play a role.

You're seeing what you want to see.

 

[Mayomaniac]

You're seeing what you want to see.

Both stimulants and opioids such as (the now banned) tramadol have been shown to increase the risk of arrhythmia.

Add the fact that with a low impact endurace sport like cycling your cardiovascular systems is more likely to be your limiting factor/getting pushed to its limits and I don't think that the theory that they might add to the number of heart related problems and the fact that they seem to happen more often to cyclists who are riding for non-MPCC teams/just rode for non-MPCC teams for multiple years just before it happened sounds that absurd...

 

[fmk_RoI]

Both stimulants and opioids such as (the now banned) tramadol have been shown to increase the risk of arrhythmia.

Ok, riddle me this, Dr Heart Expert: given the sport's century+ history of stimulants abuse, why are the number of known cardiac cases so low? I mean, we're not even into population averages as far as I can see and yet you're sure that stimulant abuse is contributing to an invisible increase in the number of cases reported. Explain, please, cause I'm not seeing what you're seeing.

 

[Mayomaniac]

Ok, riddle me this, Dr Heart Expert: given the sport's century+ history of stimulants abuse, why are the number of known cardiac cases so low? I mean, we're not even into population averages as far as I can see and yet you're sure that stimulant abuse is contributing to an invisible increase in the number of cases reported. Explain, please, cause I'm not seeing what you're seeing.

No need to be a condescending ***...

 

[fmk_RoI]

If you don't want to explain your well thought through theory you don't have too, I guess. But tell me: was the answer going to be super responders? Or some magic new stimulant no one else knows about?

 

[Ilmaestro99]

Ok, riddle me this, Dr Heart Expert: given the sport's century+ history of stimulants abuse, why are the number of known cardiac cases so low? I mean, we're not even into population averages as far as I can see and yet you're sure that stimulant abuse is contributing to an invisible increase in the number of cases reported. Explain, please, cause I'm not seeing what you're seeing.

Why do you talk like an edgy 15 year old

 

[fmk_RoI]

Why do you talk like an edgy 15 year old

If that's 'edgy' in your world you really need to get out more. And maybe try contributing to the actual discussion instead of whatever it is you think you're actually doing.

 

[Ripper]

Ok, riddle me this, Dr Heart Expert: given the sport's century+ history of stimulants abuse, why are the number of known cardiac cases so low? I mean, we're not even into population averages as far as I can see and yet you're sure that stimulant abuse is contributing to an invisible increase in the number of cases reported. Explain, please, cause I'm not seeing what you're seeing.

Oh don't be such a db with your responses. It's really unnecessary.

I think the poster explained their assumptions well. Having said this, I think much of what we are seeing with respect to cardiac arrhythmias and other cardiac issues being reported so clearly can be put down to - more accurate, timely, and detailed physiological reporting than decades ago; improvements in health and medical care that elucidate what might be going on. So, I can appreciate how it might appear that there has been an increase.

My memory is a bit rusty on this, and I'm not going to do the research for this posting, but I'm pretty sure the evidence so far does not show an increased rate when comparing like for like populations.

 

[fmk_RoI]

I think the poster explained their assumptions well.

The assumption being that there has been an increase in cardiac cases in recent years. An assumption that based on what the poster can remember. Or confirmation bias as it's more properly known.

The assumption also ignores Covid.

 

[roundabout]

would a different endurance sport (XC-skiing or something similar) be a better point of comparison than the general population?

i mean there is likely some kind of selection bias in place when comparing top-level athletes with the general population as those with heart issue discovered or otherwise are less likely to make to the top level in the first place

 

[Mayomaniac]

So Geschke is now a top climber, at the age of 36? Seems legit...
Looks like Damiani is working his magic at Cofidis.

 

[Nick2413]

So Geschke is now a top climber, at the age of 36? Seems legit...
Looks like Damiani is working his magic at Cofidis.

When these things happen it makes me also question wouldn’t this mean nobody else in that race is taking anything significant?

 

[F_Cance]

Wanty is overperforming like crazy

 

[Netserk]

Wanty is overperforming like crazy

How much better do you think Hirt was today compared to the last Mortirolo stage?

 

[topcat]

How much better do you think Hirt was today compared to the last Mortirolo stage?

Hindley was better than Pantani today. 2020 says hello.

 

[Unterlenkerfahrend]

Hindley was better than Pantani today. 2020 says hello.

Pantani had a tough stage the day before (which he won), had a heavier bike, the stage back then had Stelvio before Mortirolo, Pantani attacked on Mortirolo solo, did 6.30 w/kg for 42:40 on Mortirolo and then did Cristina solo again just 7s slower than Hindley and Co. who were sheltered for the whole stage and shared work at the end.
The fact that the difference is just 7 seconds shows how crazy the 90s were.

 

[CannondaleCoaster]

Wanty is overperforming like crazy

It's ridiculous:

• Paris Roubaix: 6 of their 7 riders finished in top 23 (including riders such as Devriendt, Petit, Planckaert and Pasqualon)
• Kristoff and Pozzovivo being revived to their best level out of nowhere
• Quinten Hermans getting second at LBL (!!) and doing really well at Romandie

Together with Arkea they're the most suspicious teams of the season so far. Really wierd how they can raise their level to such an extent just when they needed it for the points.

 

[Fergoose]

I'm going purely off this Giro and I'm not too concerned by Wanty yet. Pozzovivo is doing a performance in line with his usual efforts (albeit at a stupid age) and the field behind him from 7th to 15th is very underwhelming. He'll likely finish around 8mins behind a Hindlay, Landa or Almeida - it's not earth shattering.

In terms of Hirt today (who I know nothing of) I think it was notable he let two riders go off ahead first on the final climb, then overhauled them. His pace was such that if either of those two riders had put in a top performance Hirt probably wouldn't have caught them. If you are doping and feeling wonderful it is an unnecessary risk to let two riders (who may also be doping) go off ahead of you like that.

 

[F_Cance]

It's really not about Hirt for me, but more about Wantys season in general. Every one of their riders showed something good here or there, but now it's all of them doing it at the same time.
Arkea and Wanty are the teams with the 5th and 6th most UCI points this season, to put this into perspective.

 

[Mayomaniac]

How much better do you think Hirt was today compared to the last Mortirolo stage?

Hirt and Ciccone were in the breakaway all day long on that day, sprinting for KoM points on every climb, and still climbed the Mortirolo as fast as the Mollema-Roglic group from the gc group.
Probably the most impressive performance by both of those guys.

 

[BR2]

The-longest-team-name-in-history is ridiculous this year, no question. They are winning and impressing on all fronts and while their shopping was good, that alone can't make such a change. But I feel most people, including me, have a soft spot for them and like many of the riders, so there is not that much outrage... but I have to say, it's starting to change for me... at one point it's too much.

All in all, it's like a lot of teams this year have stepped up, especially ones in need of points...

 

[CannondaleCoaster]

I mean, Hirt was up there again today for quite a long time after yesterdays victory from the break.

 

[Netserk]

I mean, Hirt was up there again today for quite a long time after yesterdays victory from the break.

On par with Carthy whom he clearly beat yesterday. And I think both of them lost time to Leemreize on the final climb, not to mention how they were blasted by Buitrago.

 

[Fergoose]

Yeah, Hirt clearly didnt have the energy to pull it off n back to back stages. This is a good thing. Again, we see riders making an attack, misjudging their effort and being overhauled before the finish by a rider who has probably given up hope of winning the stage. This is a also a good thing.

The GC repetitiveness is also a good thing. The top four on GC have come out of the rest day arguably with th exact same comparable form as they had going into it.

 

[Mayomaniac]

Buitrago climbing both the final and the penultimate climb only 25sec slower than the top gc guys (yes, he was only 25sec slower on the first climb and again on the 2nd) while being in the breakaway all day and crashing is a bit wild, I hav to say that.
I'll also never get used to the fact that since 2020 Domen freaking Novak is suddenly a top cllmbing domestique.

Looking at the watts on Strava some people collapsed on the final climb. Buchmann did a lower average wattage on the shorter final climb compared to the penultimate. That said, overall the numbers do look more reasonable than those we had at the last Giro, let alone the 2020 one.