Teams & Riders Tadej Pogačar discussion thread

[Lequack]

Tadej Pogacar, Eddy Merckx , Mario Cipollini

 

[Bolder]

Agreed. His legs look unimpressive compared to others. Looking at his legs and face one would think he's an amateur, who still has to lose a couple of kgs.

His upper body can get quite skinny, though. He seems to have an ideal body for cycling, although atypical, in that he has a low overall weight but he carries it down low (better COG?), meaning he can make power but doesn't have a largish upper body to drag around.

Regarding Merckx, yes, he could surpass the Cannibal although I doubt he'll win as many non-TdF grand tours. But really, there's almost no race in which you could say he wouldn't be among the favorites if he targets it. Because the level in cycling overall is much higher now, his current achievements look even more impressive.

 

[Valanga]

His upper body can get quite skinny, though. He seems to have an ideal body for cycling, although atypical, in that he has a low overall weight but he carries it down low (better COG?), meaning he can make power but doesn't have a largish upper body to drag around.

Regarding Merckx, yes, he could surpass the Cannibal although I doubt he'll win as many non-TdF grand tours. But really, there's almost no race in which you could say he wouldn't be among the favorites if he targets it. Because the level in cycling overall is much higher now, his current achievements look even more impressive.

Sure there is. He needs mountains or decent hills to win (or a TdF TT), else he's simply not powerful enough to be a favorite.
In Il Lomardia they averaged around 300 watts or so? Paris Roubaix was more like 350.

 

[Red Rick]

Sure there is. He needs mountains or decent hills to win (or a TdF TT), else he's simply not powerful enough to be a favorite.
In Il Lomardia they averaged around 300 watts or so? Paris Roubaix was more like 350.

It's about W/CdA which be a lot closer. Especially if you compare him to Vermeersch who's built like a tank. And Moscon, who's closer to Pogacar than Colbrelli in weight was well on his way to winning it.

I'm not saying he would be a favorite for Roubaix or have a big chance, but it's for different reasons.

 

[Valanga]

It's about W/CdA which be a lot closer. Especially if you compare him to Vermeersch who's built like a tank. And Moscon, who's closer to Pogacar than Colbrelli in weight was well on his way to winning it.

I'm not saying he would be a favorite for Roubaix or have a big chance, but it's for different reasons.

Sure, but the lower CdA isn't going to compensate everything. I'm not saying there is no way in hell he'll win it, but I would not consider him a favorite at all.

Also fun fact, going by PCS (yeah I know), Moscon is 4 kg heavier than Pogacar, and 4 kg lighter than Colbrelli, so that puts him right in the middle

 

[Krzysztof_O]

It's about W/CdA which be a lot closer. Especially if you compare him to Vermeersch who's built like a tank. And Moscon, who's closer to Pogacar than Colbrelli in weight was well on his way to winning it.

I'm not saying he would be a favorite for Roubaix or have a big chance, but it's for different reasons.

When it comes to the PR cobbles pure power is more important than on flat paved roads. It's because of an additional force one has to overcome on cobbles (and not associated with body shape/size). This force reduce speed and the role of aerodynamic drag even more.

 

[Skijumper Roglic fan]

I think we agree Pogacar would and will be able to win also at least one Giro and one Vuelta. The big question is, what about the Monuments he hasn‘t won yet.

I am sure he could win San Remo, just like Nibali did (San Remo, however, is the easiest to finish and hardest to win, as they say). An attack on Poggio or even Cipressa would be needed, and VDP, WVA and Ala should not have their best of days then. So here, Pogacar needs top spring shape, a good day and luck.

The cobbles remain a questionmark - we just don‘t know how Tadej would handle them. In general, he seems to have very good bike handling skills, and he‘s not too light (not <60/65 kgs).

I think RVV is a race he could win. He should be good on these climbs. Valverde did RVV once, and immediately finished 8th, which is really impressive.

For Roubaix and Tadej, there maybe remain doubts. Normally also here, he should have the engine that‘s needed.

My personal guess is he won‘t do RVV and Roubaix the next years. The Ardennes triple of AGR, FW and LBL looks better suited to him. In Roubaix, especially, danger of injury is always a factor. The Ardennes races with their good roads are safer, to stay healthy before May‘s altitude camp and Dauphine and Tour afterwards.

 

[Krzysztof_O]

As for other monuments Pog can win I agree with @Skijumper Roglic fan. Milan-San Remo is doable (but not easy), Tour of Flandres is more difficult but not impossible (climbing cobbled sections should be better for him that flat cobbled sectors) and Roubaix is most difficult by far. Then again, Pog said he wanted to try to ride and win every race. Cobbled monuments are unlikely in next few years (GTs + hilly classics are obvious goals) but in the second half of his career he may try his luck there.

 

[BlueRoads]

As for other monuments Pog can win I agree with @Skijumper Roglic fan. Milan-San Remo is doable (but not easy), Tour of Flandres is more difficult but not impossible (climbing cobbled sections should be better for him that flat cobbled sectors) and Roubaix is most difficult by far. Then again, Pog said he wanted to try to ride and win every race. Cobbled monuments are unlikely in next few years (GTs + hilly classics are obvious goals) but in the second half of his career he may try his luck there.

If he has two more seasons like this he will probably get bored and try P-R, I think. Agree it should be by far the hardest for him, but then I wouldn't put it completely past him to win it.

 

[Oldermanish]

His legs are really weird, yes. Most other cylists have “extreme looking” legs - very muscular, lean and defined. His legs look like those of someone who just started cycling and aren’t fully developed yet. The big question is - what happens when Tadej gets proper cycling legs?

He'll probably get definition in hid late 20's, if at all. I coached several monstrously strong women that never had super defined legs and they were in their 30's and had run previous to cycling. Weirdly strong but totally natural.

 

[Krzysztof_O]

His upper body can get quite skinny, though. He seems to have an ideal body for cycling, although atypical, in that he has a low overall weight but he carries it down low (better COG?), meaning he can make power but doesn't have a largish upper body to drag around.

He still has baby fat here and there, which partially explains his looks. His upper body is thin but he doesn't give you the impression of a very skinny cyclist in his peak form (like Froome, Contador or Roglic), mainly due to some fat on his face, legs and arms. IMO he still has the potential to drop 1-2 kilos without losing power.

 

[Blanco]

Regarding Merckx, yes, he could surpass the Cannibal although I doubt he'll win as many non-TdF grand tours. But really, there's almost no race in which you could say he wouldn't be among the favorites if he targets it. Because the level in cycling overall is much higher now, his current achievements look even more impressive.

He could surpass the Cannibal only in TDF wins, maybe in Vuelta too. But Giro, Monuments, WC and number of wins in total, I doubt he'll come even close.

 

[Bolder]

Sure there is. He needs mountains or decent hills to win (or a TdF TT), else he's simply not powerful enough to be a favorite.
In Il Lomardia they averaged around 300 watts or so? Paris Roubaix was more like 350.

Ideally, yes, but I think he has good enough team and tactics to make a final selection in even PR. My caveat is that he would need to target it, meaning he might need a different training regimen in the lead up. Of course Roubaix is about power but you equally need to be in the right place at the right time, and Pogacar is very good at that...

 

[Krzysztof_O]

He could surpass the Cannibal only in TDF wins, maybe in Vuelta too. But Giro, Monuments, WC and number of wins in total, I doubt he'll come even close.

I actually think Pogacar has a shot a winning 10 GTs joining Merckx and Hinault in this super-exclusive double-digit club. It's still very early and many strong rivals will appear but if he keeps his motivation and form for long enough time then who knows.

 

[Polarbear64]

Agreed. His legs look unimpressive compared to others. Looking at his legs and face one would think he's an amateur, who still has to lose a couple of kgs.

He's said that one of the biggest factors in his racing was being slower to develop than the other guys when puberty hit. He was late to the game which made him also have to try harder to beat them when they were physically more capable. He definitely still has the body of an amatuer, which may work to his advantage, or maybe he is still slow (at a fresh 23), and there is more to come with maturity.

 

[Polarbear64]

The cobbles remain a questionmark - we just don‘t know how Tadej would handle them. In general, he seems to have very good bike handling skills, and he‘s not too light (not <60/65 kgs).

His bike handling skills were really impressive in il Lombardia, like when could have wiped out a few times descending.... I definitely let out a gasp and have a Remco flashback.
The main thing to me is that he DID do cyclocross, and he WAS the national champion in it for the one year before he signed with UAE, and never did it again.
One reason I love watching WVA is because of his grit and his cyclocross background. I totally think Pogi would be on par if he actually did more of it. Something tells me UAE doesn't want to risk any injury with him, but I would still love to see him go for it and use a lot more of skills beyond just road... I am certain he would be into it. Its also the same reason I don't see him doing Paris-Roubaix. I think he'd definitely be capable of that kind of race, but don't see UAE signing him up for it given the risk of injury. Here's hoping to see it one day.

cyclocross pogi

 

[Oldermanish]

When it comes to the PR cobbles pure power is more important than on flat paved roads. It's because of an additional force one has to overcome on cobbles (and not associated with body shape/size). This force reduce speed and the role of aerodynamic drag even more.

And the ability for that power to be applied at 70 rpm...not something most GT riders would/should train for as a regime, particularly in the early season.

 

[Oldermanish]

His bike handling skills were really impressive in il Lombardia, like when could have wiped out a few times descending.... I definitely let out a gasp and have a Remco flashback.
The main thing to me is that he DID do cyclocross, and he WAS the national champion in it for the one year before he signed with UAE, and never did it again.
One reason I love watching WVA is because of his grit and his cyclocross background. I totally think Pogi would be on par if he actually did more of it. Something tells me UAE doesn't want to risk any injury with him, but I would still love to see him go for it and use a lot more of skills beyond just road... I am certain he would be into it. Its also the same reason I don't see him doing Paris-Roubaix. I think he'd definitely be capable of that kind of race, but don't see UAE signing him up for it given the risk of injury. Here's hoping to see it one day.

cyclocross pogi

Another reason to like his skills. One more attribute and reason to Love Pogi: he not only didn't appear to take risks on the sketchy Lombardia descents; he didn't lose any time to the who's who of descenders chasing him. He did this on Rim Brakes.

 

[Blanco]

Another reason to like his skills. One more attribute and reason to Love Pogi: he not only didn't appear to take risks on the sketchy Lombardia descents; he didn't lose any time to the who's who of descenders chasing him. He did this on Rim Brakes.

He didn't lose time to Vingegaard to be honest, but he did lose to Masnada, and he was losing a bit when Alaphilippe was forcing at the start of the descent.

 

[Jumbo Visma Fan :)]

His bike handling skills were really impressive in il Lombardia, like when could have wiped out a few times descending.... I definitely let out a gasp and have a Remco flashback.
The main thing to me is that he DID do cyclocross, and he WAS the national champion in it for the one year before he signed with UAE, and never did it again.
One reason I love watching WVA is because of his grit and his cyclocross background. I totally think Pogi would be on par if he actually did more of it. Something tells me UAE doesn't want to risk any injury with him, but I would still love to see him go for it and use a lot more of skills beyond just road... I am certain he would be into it. Its also the same reason I don't see him doing Paris-Roubaix. I think he'd definitely be capable of that kind of race, but don't see UAE signing him up for it given the risk of injury. Here's hoping to see it one day.

cyclocross pogi

Paris Roubaix is too injury-risky for UAE and I think another big X for not letting Pogacar go is the hilly classics at the time.Also if he get seriously injured he might not be back until La Vuelta or later

 

[Krzysztof_O]

Paris Roubaix is too injury-risky for UAE and I think another big X for not letting Pogacar go is the hilly classics at the time.Also if he get seriously injured he might not be back until La Vuelta or later

PR and Flandres are out of question in the coming years (he will obviously maximize his chances at GTs and hilly classics) but I see him trying cobbles a couple of times at a later stage of his career (once he's won zillion races, has less pressure to win GTs, and wants to try something new).

 

[Krzysztof_O]

Pogacar hails "a complete course" officially confirming an attempt on three-peat:

Tadej Pogacar: The 2022 Tour de France route has everything

'It's a complete course' says Slovenian as he eyes third straight title

www.cyclingnews.com

 

[cellardoor]

Is it conceivable that he rides Paris-Roubaix to get experience of the cobbles in a similar way to Bernal riding Strade Binache prior to the Giro this year?

 

[tobydawq]

He could surpass the Cannibal only in TDF wins, maybe in Vuelta too. But Giro, Monuments, WC and number of wins in total, I doubt he'll come even close.

I don't. He won't.

 

[Krzysztof_O]

Is it conceivable that he rides Paris-Roubaix to get experience of the cobbles in a similar way to Bernal riding Strade Binache prior to the Giro this year?

Ha, imagine Pogi riding Roubaix just for "Tour preparation" and trolling everybody big time by winning the trophy.