Team Astana

[markene2]

2023 Astana is just sad, Velasco and Tejada are the only somewhat decent riders besides their token sprinter, how the mighty have fallen...

It takes time to recover from the attempted takover by premier tech, yana seel and bruyneel.
The team was decimated, give it one more season and we will be back again.

 

[Mayomaniac]

It takes time to recover from the attempted takover by premier tech, yana seel and bruyneel.
The team was decimated, give it one more season and we will be back again.

Fingers crossed, the whole MAL situation didnt help either.
At this point they should just sign Nairo for Giro-Vuelta for the next season.

 

[Skijumper Roglic fan]

For years I was a bit worried for Max Kanter, and actually feared he would have to leave the WT at some point, because he rather had some trouble, results-wise.

But he has improved a lot recently, and was great at the Tour Down Under. Finished GC not even three minutes down on the winner! He took these two mountain stages seriously, and climbed with very good climbers. Plus in the sprints, he was Top-10 several times.

Very impressive development…

 

[pastronef]

ASTANA bought by a new Chinese owner? that's what l'Equipe writes https://www.lequipe.fr/Cyclisme-sur...qstan-rachetee-par-un-sponsor-chinois/1472566

 

[Slavique Nuke]

ASTANA bought by a new Chinese owner? that's what l'Equipe writes https://www.lequipe.fr/Cyclisme-sur...qstan-rachetee-par-un-sponsor-chinois/1472566

The article sounds like speculation or Vino's pipe dream. But I doubt it is true, the Chinese government strictly limits the buying and financing of foreign sports teams for the Chinese rich.

 

[Tim Cahill]

Can't wait to see what Luts and the rest of the lads can do on some of that good Chinese Swimmer sh*t!!!

 

[yaco]

You have to cross the I's and dot the T's when dealing with Chinese business. I remember around 2018 when Jayco thought they reached a deal with a billionaire Hong Kong business person which fell through at the last minute.

 

[Izzyeviel]

The article sounds like speculation or Vino's pipe dream. But I doubt it is true, the Chinese government strictly limits the buying and financing of foreign sports teams for the Chinese rich.

A mere drop in the ocean compared to what they've spent on teams in other sports. Anyway, great news for elderly cyclists if true.

 

[Bolder]

I wondered if the Chinese would try to follow the oil states’ lead and sportswash by buying a WT license. I wonder what the title sponsor would be. Surely not Kazakhstan.

 

[Rob5091]

Astana seem to be the cheapest option for a buy out. It looks though they'll be out of the WT after next year unless something very dramatic happens.
If I was that Chinese businessman, I'd take over Dstny's joint sponsorship at Lotto as they seem deemed for WT status.

 

[Slavique Nuke]

A mere drop in the ocean compared to what they've spent on teams in other sports. Anyway, great news for elderly cyclists if true.

Which top sports teams are owned by rich Chinese? Until very recently, Inter Milan was owned by Steven Zhang, which he lost because the Chinese government 'prevented' him from repaying the loan to Oaktree. The Chinese government doesn't like it when individuals take their money out of the country, especially when it comes to reckless big spending like in sports. So they'll find a way to stop the rich Chinese from doing it.

The same is true for English teams that have had Chinese owners recently Aston Villa, WBA, Reading.. and many examples

Wolverhampton are still owned by the Chinese but it's more of a shady bussines with super agent Jorge Mendes and they move players for profit.

Sticking with cycling, in 2016 Lampre would have had Chinese investors, but of course they pulled out and the UAE saved the team.

So again, I doubt there will be a Chinese sugar daddy in cycling or any sport anytime soon.

 

[GenericBoonenFan]

Astana seem to be the cheapest option for a buy out. It looks though they'll be out of the WT after next year unless something very dramatic happens.
If I was that Chinese businessman, I'd take over Dstny's joint sponsorship at Lotto as they seem deemed for WT status.

I wonder if that's possible. Their second sponsor is a Belgian government-owned business (the national lottery) I would be very surprised if there isn't a clause in the contract stating that no other foreign goverment-owned sponsors may come aboard.

I wondered if the Chinese would try to follow the oil states’ lead and sportswash by buying a WT license. I wonder what the title sponsor would be. Surely not Kazakhstan.

"China Glory World Tour Team"

 

[Samamba]

If I was that Chinese businessman, I'd take over Dstny's joint sponsorship at Lotto as they seem deemed for WT status.

Never suggest something like this again, pretty please.

Also never ever happening ofcourse. Not a chance in hell.

It also seems the chinese businessman - whoever he is - does not just want to sponsor a team, he wants to own one. And then Astana is probably the easiest to get. On the other hand, with Astana almost guaranteed to lose its WT license, what even is the point to buy their license? I guess one year guaranteed Tour.

 

[yaco]

If you can finish 19th or 20th in the rankings then you ride a similar program to a WT team.

I don't understand where sportswashing enters the debate. If it gets up it will be a individual or a company buying Astana. It won't be funded by the Chinese Government.

 

[GenericBoonenFan]

If you can finish 19th or 20th in the rankings then you ride a similar program to a WT team.

I don't understand where sportswashing enters the debate. If it gets up it will be a individual or a company buying Astana. It won't be funded by the Chinese Government.

Not a single ounce of my body will believe the Chinese government won't be involved one way our another.

 

[Rob5091]

Not a single ounce of my body will believe the Chinese government won't be involved one way our another.

Exactly, if it will reflect badly on China then pressure will be applied.

 

[yaco]

Not a single ounce of my body will believe the Chinese government won't be involved one way our another.

Individuals have been trying for years to get sponsorships from China with little or no success. I am struggling to think of a sport in which the Chinese Government is involved in any major sponsorships. Yes, they hold sporting events but this is different to direct sponsorship.

 

[Rob5091]

Maybe Mrs Xi liked the singing and dancing so much up on the Tourmalet, that she persuaded her hubby to get into pro-cycling?

 

[pastronef]

Maybe Mrs Xi liked the singing and dancing so much up on the Tourmalet, that she persuaded her hubby to get into pro-cycling?

she' a fan, I've even heard rumors she asked "which jersey is the blue one" while watching Tirreno early this year. she likes the trident trophy

 

[GenericBoonenFan]

Individuals have been trying for years to get sponsorships from China with little or no success. I am struggling to think of a sport in which the Chinese Government is involved in any major sponsorships. Yes, they hold sporting events but this is different to direct sponsorship.

Every sport where a Chinese company is involved, the goverment is involved.

 

[Rechtschreibfehler]

Which top sports teams are owned by rich Chinese? Until very recently, Inter Milan was owned by Steven Zhang, which he lost because the Chinese government 'prevented' him from repaying the loan to Oaktree. The Chinese government doesn't like it when individuals take their money out of the country, especially when it comes to reckless big spending like in sports. So they'll find a way to stop the rich Chinese from doing it.

The same is true for English teams that have had Chinese owners recently Aston Villa, WBA, Reading.. and many examples

Wolverhampton are still owned by the Chinese but it's more of a shady bussines with super agent Jorge Mendes and they move players for profit.

Sticking with cycling, in 2016 Lampre would have had Chinese investors, but of course they pulled out and the UAE saved the team.

So again, I doubt there will be a Chinese sugar daddy in cycling or any sport anytime soon.

Thats true, yet it might be a touch different when it comes to cycling. Depending on what the owner turned out to be, and the sponsor, it's maybe just an effective way to promote a Brand outside china, and afaik they do like exporting stuff. Meaning: operating a cycling team is much cheaper than the money burning needed for realising anything in football, if you wan't a shot of winning the big trophys.

Also I think Xi is very interested in propagating sports, so if the possible owner would also build up a cycling base in China, the outlook might be different. A Chinese TdF Winner would be quite something I guess. I have no idea what the ideological stance towards cycling is in China.

But yeah, a lot of speculation. I believe it when I see it.

 

[Mayomaniac]

So gc Lyu Xianjing to Astana?
Someone better call @Libertine Seguros asap!

 

[Libertine Seguros]

If you can finish 19th or 20th in the rankings then you ride a similar program to a WT team.

I don't understand where sportswashing enters the debate. If it gets up it will be a individual or a company buying Astana. It won't be funded by the Chinese Government.

Yep, it's a 20-team WT in all but name, offering zero flexibility for wildcards and completely homogenizing the calendar. As long as you aren't TOO terrible to drop out the top 20 - which you shouldn't be as a WT team with any credibility (I know, we're talking about Astana here) as you get a better calendar than anybody outside the top 20, thus closing the shop at the top. It may have come through the back door, but it's what Vaughters has been campaigning for ever since he grew his team organically to the top tier: to prevent other people doing the same and guarantee his seat at the top table in perpetuity. Congratulations, Jonathan, you did it.

I hate it.

So gc Lyu Xianjing to Astana?
Someone better call @Libertine Seguros asap!

I love it.

 

[Slavique Nuke]

Thats true, yet it might be a touch different when it comes to cycling. Depending on what the owner turned out to be, and the sponsor, it's maybe just an effective way to promote a Brand outside china, and afaik they do like exporting stuff. Meaning: operating a cycling team is much cheaper than the money burning needed for realising anything in football, if you wan't a shot of winning the big trophys.

Also I think Xi is very interested in propagating sports, so if the possible owner would also build up a cycling base in China, the outlook might be different. A Chinese TdF Winner would be quite something I guess. I have no idea what the ideological stance towards cycling is in China.

But yeah, a lot of speculation. I believe it when I see it.

I don't think so, cycling is such a niche sport. It's not very good for advertising. If a company wants to promote its brand, there are much better ways than cycling. And for the 30-40 million euros a year a cycling team spends, there are other sports that offer better value for money.

EURO 2024 will start soon. Look how many Chinese sponsors are there: AliExpress, BYD, Hisense, Vivo

The only way Chinese money comes into cycling is if there is a Chinese star rider who brings sponsors. Which seems unlikely that China will ever produce such a rider. Looking at PCS, the Chinese have quite a few Conti teams but no Chinese rider has been able to move on to the next level. It's likely that talented Chinese or other Asian athletes will all choose other sports as cycling is quite European-centric and requires them to leave their country at a youngish age.

 

[Rechtschreibfehler]

I don't think so, cycling is such a niche sport. It's not very good for advertising. If a company wants to promote its brand, there are much better ways than cycling. And for the 30-40 million euros a year a cycling team spends, there are other sports that offer better value for money.

I am not sure about this, the way I understood it is that you get a lot of TV coverage for relatively little money spend compared to especially Football. In a more or less recent Podcast Denk of Bora-Hansgrohe said the same, and it was even his explanation of how he could convince Bora in the end, because they looked exactly at value for money, and Cycling came out on top for most time on TV for least Euros spend.

The only way Chinese money comes into cycling is if there is a Chinese star rider who brings sponsors. Which seems unlikely that China will ever produce such a rider. Looking at PCS, the Chinese have quite a few Conti teams but no Chinese rider has been able to move on to the next level. It's likely that talented Chinese or other Asian athletes will all choose other sports as cycling is quite European-centric and requires them to leave their country at a youngish age.

This is why I said I think it would necessitate building up a cycling base in China if one wants to convince the political side of it imo. But nonetheless I am not saying that it's happening and I still thin it's unlikely but if it's done I think it will be both a company that wants to make gains in Europe and also is ready to invest in finding Chinese stars.