The Final Unofficial GC Standings (minus the TTT)

[titotito]

Well, it was kind of fun the first time so why not. Check out third place.

1 Alberto Contador Velasco (Spa) Astana 85:48:35
2 Andy Schleck (Lux) Team Saxo Bank 0:03:31
3 Lance Armstrong (USA) Astana 0:05:24
3 Fränk Schleck (Lux) Team Saxo Bank 0:05:24
5 Bradley Wiggins (GBr) Garmin - Slipstream 0:05:43
6 Vincenzo Nibali (Ita) Liquigas 0:06:37
7 Andreas Klöden (Ger) Astana 0:06:42
8 Christophe Le Mevel (Fra) Française des Jeux 0:11:39
9 Christian Vande Velde (USA) Garmin - Slipstrea 0:11:46
10 Mikel Astarloza Chaurreau (Spa) Euskaltel - Euskadi 0:12:35
11 Roman Kreuziger (Cze) Liquigas 0:13:18
12 Jurgen Van Den Broeck (Bel) Silence - Lotto 0:13:46
13 Sandy Casar (Fra) Française des Jeux 0:14:33
14 Vladimir Karpets (Rus) Team Katusha 0:17:11
15 Rinaldo Nocentini (Ita) AG2R La Mondiale 0:18:57
16 Stéphane Goubert (Fra) AG2R La Mondiale 0:20:41
17 Carlos Sastre Candil (Spa) Cervelo Test Team 0:24:44
18 Alexandre Botcharov (Rus) Team Katusha 0:28:10
19 Sylvain Chavanel (Fra) Quick Step 0:31:43
20 Christian Knees (Ger) Team Milram 0:32:00

 

[ThisFrenchGuy]

No huge changes though in ranking. 2 places up or down... The problem of the TTT is not so much in the individual ranking, but in how it affected the overall dynamic of the race. Astana was runing the show after the TTT and the race was neutralized for a week.

Thanks for making the calculations.

 

[Frosty]

I think the TTT has come in for a bit too much criticism. Normally the tour has a middle individual TT. The gaps between the big teams in the TTT werent that much and are less than the normal long TT would have thrown up. A mountain TT may have made things closer between Contador and A Schleck but im not sure that Contador wouldnt have won that anyway. Of course, you could just get rid of the middle TT and just have a prologue and final time trial.

 

[ThisFrenchGuy]

I think the TTT has come in for a bit too much criticism. Normally the tour has a middle individual TT. The gaps between the big teams in the TTT werent that much and are less than the normal long TT would have thrown up. A mountain TT may have made things closer between Contador and A Schleck but im not sure that Contador wouldnt have won that anyway. Of course, you could just get rid of the middle TT and just have a prologue and final time trial.

With the TTT, 4 Astana riders jumped to place 2-3-4-5 at less than a second (for Armstrong) while the contenders were more evenly distributed. Up to that point the game was mostly over.

Sure it is also because those Astana riders held pretty good positions before and because the team was strong but it did kill the race for a week. But hindsight is always 20/20, etc...

Maybe the problem does not lie with the TTT though, but with the fact that the teams were unbalanced. Astana 09 was kind of an exception that I hope will not repeat too often.

EDIT: Looking at the lineup, you could say there were two GC leaders and at least 3 "superdomestiques" (I count Zubeldia) which could be considered GC contenders in other teams.

 

[Cobber]

No huge changes though in ranking. 2 places up or down... The problem of the TTT is not so much in the individual ranking, but in how it affected the overall dynamic of the race. Astana was runing the show after the TTT and the race was neutralized for a week.

Thanks for making the calculations.

Frank and LA with the exact same time for a podium spot!

 

[patrick767]

Maybe the problem does not lie with the TTT though, but with the fact that the teams were unbalanced. Astana 09 was kind of an exception that I hope will not repeat too often.

I don't think we have to worry about that. Having four guys on one team theoretically capable of winning the GC was truly bizarre and having two of them actively going for it (Contador and Armstrong, of course) caused a lot of tension. Contador has already made it very clear it's not something he wants to repeat on any team.

I can see why Astana/Bruyneel signed Armstrong, who had stated when he came out of retirement that he would try to win the Tour de France, even though they already had Contador. From a sponsor's perspective, they likely found it impossible to turn down the promotional potential of having the 7 time champion on the team. But yeah, it's not likely to happen again.

 

[ThisFrenchGuy]

Frank and LA with the exact same time for a podium spot!

True, Franck gains two spot and ties on the podium. But currently he is only 3" behind Wiggins and 42" behind Armstrong. Not that big of a change IMHO. As I said elsewhere, those riders (plus Kloden and Nibali) looked pretty even on climbing stages to me, they tried to follow each other without bonking, and neither of them exploded. They only produced a few attacks apart from F.Schleck (was pretty active) and Armstrong bridging in stage 16. Contador and Shleck were clearly above, hence their clear 1st and 2nd spot. 3rd place was to be decided between somewhat equal riders, and in the end LA was the best "all around" in average, and he resisted in the mountains.

This was discussed quite a few times and I agree that if we suppose that the TTT never happened, this would have changed a lot of the strategies: who knows what the results would have been then?

 

[karlboss]

I'd like to see the value of the teams at the tour ie the salaries of the sum of 9 riders who take part. anyone know where this info can be gleaned?

 

[benpounder]

This was discussed quite a few times and I agree that if we suppose that the TTT never happened, this would have changed a lot of the strategies: who knows what the results would have been then?

Not only that, but it is highly likely that the TTT would have been replaced by an ITT.

 

[rhubroma]

In a race where the teams count, but only one rider gets to wear the yellow jersey, I think the TTT is unfair.

It should not play the decisive role it frequently does. Because it falsifies the standings, which should purely be based upon one's personal strength. And riding at 55kph in a TTT, isn't the same as a team helping a leader win the race on the other stages. In the end the leader still has to come up with the goods, which doesn't happen on such an individual basis in a TTT.

 

[Vanderaerden's perm]

I probably stand alone on this one but, apart from a prologue, I'd consider getting rid of all time trials from Grand Tours! You have to admit that there is an air of inevitability about the results of them that you don't get on the other key stages.

I shall start plugging my ears in readiness for the howls of derision that will follow!

 

[Oldman]

I probably stand alone on this one but, apart from a prologue, I'd consider getting rid of all time trials from Grand Tours! You have to admit that there is an air of inevitability about the results of them that you don't get on the other key stages.

I shall start plugging my ears in readiness for the howls of derision that will follow!

I won't howl at you but there have been some dramatic mechanical problems and crashes that made for good TV coverage. The TTT also helps sell bikes. Cervelo adds were all over American coverage. Otherwise it does resemble a numbers game where the event can be purchased by the biggest budget team; not fair from that standpoint. Perhaps a salary cap? Now there's a concept that can be debated.

 

[BeachBum]

...if we suppose that the TTT never happened, this would have changed a lot of the strategies: who knows what the results would have been then?

EXACTLY. Just start looking at 2010, and imagine another TTT. Next year, there is no way Contador's team (whatever it is, and whoever is on it) wins the TTT. You could have 4 or 5 GC contenders ahead of AC theoretically after a TTT.

The 2010 Tour will be a closer race if there is another TTT.

 

[Vanderaerden's perm]

I won't howl at you but there have been some dramatic mechanical problems and crashes that made for good TV coverage. The TTT also helps sell bikes. Cervelo adds were all over American coverage. Otherwise it does resemble a numbers game where the event can be purchased by the biggest budget team; not fair from that standpoint. Perhaps a salary cap? Now there's a concept that can be debated.

Fair point. I forgot about the pure comedy gold that was Michael Rasmussen's 2006 horrorshow time trial, or the B-Box teams impromptu diversion into a potato field! Long live the time trial!

 

[Eva Maria]

Not only that, but it is highly likely that the TTT would have been replaced by an ITT.

Exactly.

If the TT was held the same day as the TTT Armstrong, Schelck don't make the podium.

 

[karlboss]

I'd have to check times, but i think ullrich would have won 2003 if there weren't a TTT

 

[psychlist]

I like watching the teams do the TTT, but I would rather have an additional ITT.