Touring gear ratios

[La Fringale]

Hi there,

Happy New Year everybody!

OK, I am in the process of replacing my Marin Muirwoods frameset that I used for touring for years. During last summer tour, I realized the frame was not up to the task anymore fully loaded, too muck flex, pretty scary going downhill.

I am still undecided about a Thorn Sherpa and a Co-motion Pangea. Both are 26'', sturdy, and can accomodate rim brakes.

- Wheelset: Will probably be White Industries hubs, 40 spokes at the rear, 36 at the front.

- The drivetrain options give me headaches. On the Marin, I used an old triple Ultegra cranset (52/42/30 with 172.5 cranks) paired with an 11/26 cassette (9 speed) and a short cage 105 rear derailleur. Shifting was crisp. I really liked the close gears. Nevertheless, I need smaller ratios as I struggled on steep inclines. For exemple, made it through Topes de Callantes in Cuba, but zigzaging! Here are a few options.

Question 1: Which BB interface? Has to be sturdy obviously, but I need to be able to find parts when touring in Latin America for instance. Square taper an option (Phil Woods) with Sugino XD 600 triple? I thought square taper interface was prone to failure?

question 2: What gear ratios? I want a 9 speed drivetrain.

Option 1: Keep the Ultegra Crankset and go for a MTB cassette behind (11-32, 9 speed) which implies buying a long cage derailleur. Pros= Very wide range of gears, cassettes available everywhere); Cons= lots of gaps between gears + shifting not as crisp as short cage derailleurs and more prone to failure. Moreover, the rings are wasted, so I need new rings. Is it worth it?

Option 2: Use a MTB crankset up front. I have an XT M760 sitting around. Needs new rings too. Thinking of 46/32/22 combination. I could use my 105 short care derailleur with an 11/12-26-27 cassette (I have a few 9 speed road cassettes). Pros= closely spaced ratios, crisp shifting, derailleur less prone to failure; Cons= Hard to find a 9 speed road cassette in the middle of nowhere, road rear derailleurs and cassettes more fragile than MTB stuff?

Option 3: Go for a crankset with the following ratios(26/36/46-48), kind of in between former options : Sugino XD 600 (square taper), LX T661 Crankset, XT M771. Then, what setup behind?

I need a sturdy drivetrain with components widely available. I have been riding bikes for 25 years and I am fit.

Thanks for your input.

François

 

[lostintime]

First of all .. square tapers are not prone to breaking. Like anything though... you can render a crank useless if you don't know what you're doing...ie over and under tightening . I've used ST cranks all my life, as they suit my riding just fine... for 30+ years now. Integrated cranks is/was a solution to a problem that never existed for myself !

I've always liked 110/74 BCD cranks too, as the rings are easy to find and any combo is possible. I never liked the BCD game Shimano has played with their cranks, hence I'll never own one. I used a TA Zephyr for many years .. but switched to the Sugino XD cranks last year when I started using shorter arms. I use a 110mm cartridge BB with the XD.

No need for a Phil BB .... I've used Tange steel cupped ones for years, though AL one are available too. One steel cup Tange BB costs less than a single bearing from Phil, and these easily will last 15k miles. I see you're in Europe though... I don't know what brands are available besides Tange. I'm not high on Shimano UN-54/55 , because of the lips on the cups. Tange's are lipless, so you can adjust the chainline as needed per frame with spacers.


Gear ratios? Really ... you don't need tight ratios for touring ... you're touring .. not racing ! Do you really need to have the perfect gear all the time? .. I mean ... the ability to vary one's cadence is golden. People used to tour with 5 speed FW's .. they could vary their cadence a lot ! I use a 24/36/48 XD crank with a 13/32 7sp FW and that gets me over any hill and dale easily with light loads. But , it doesn't matter what I or anyone else uses, because it's your bike and your experience.... you decide how you want to go. That said .. you can use any crank/cassette combo you wish ... as only you know your strengths... but hey ... I'd always rather have gears to spare on the low end... than the high end. Ask yourself ... do you need a 11/52 high end ? Many people use 11/12 or even 13 with a 48 or 46 big ring.

As far as cassettes availability .... do you plan on needing one on the road? If you're that worried ... use the cheaper cassettes that you can disassemble yourself and are completely customizable by removing the rivets, and take some extra cogs with you. Don't let the cassette options decide your crank for you ! I'm a big fan of making your own cassettes . I'd use such gears as 12 13 15 17 19 21 24 28 34 with a 24/36/48 crank any day And no weight weenie protest either ! No worries about weight on a touring bike.

MTB vs. road durability ? Silly really. The only difference is in their intent of use, neither is better/worse .

 

[La Fringale]

Thanks for the reply, very good points. You are right, the 52X11 is pretty much useless. I need more small gears, so I guess it will be a MTB cassette or an home made one. I found this Web site http://sheldonbrown.com/harris/k7.html#9cassettes.

The Sugino crank attracted my attention and the gearing makes lots of sense. I remember using Campi square taper cranks when racing as a cadet and junior back in Europe. You are right, don't remember any issue.

I am now living in North America.

What would be your take on brakes?

Cant's or V-brakes?

F

 

[DirtyWorks]

What would be your take on brakes?

Cant's or V-brakes?

F

V-brakes for sure. Tektro has a linear pull lever, or you can get a couple of Travel Agent devices if you are married to Brifters.

As long as the bottom bracket has English threading and cranks are square taper you should be okay in the Americas. The only uh-oh moment might be if the frame needs an obscure width spindle. I'd find a department store 'mountain bike' bottom bracket just to see how/if it works.

Phil Wood is the gold standard for reliability. If you've got the budget, then you won't be disappointed with a Phil Wood.

 

[lostintime]

I've used canti's all my life , so I can't say anything of V brakes. The only thing I'll add is Kool-Stop Salmon pads are the best I've used , and are available for any type of brake.

But really brakes are such a personal thing ... I say try some, whether canti or v-brake and see how you like them. I never used v-brakes because of the types of levers I preferred and didn't wish to use Travel Agent devices to get them to work properly.

You'll be fine with a Co Motion or Thorn frame with it's English threading , and a 110/113mm BB is very common.

You can get the Sugino cranks with either 26/36/46 as the XD600 or 24/36/48 as the XD500 rings as stock . To me ... just doesn't make much sense to buy a new crank with a 26/36/46 when you cant get the 24/36/48. I've used both and it does help to have the 24 instead of a 26, and 48 instead of 46. http://sheldonbrown.com/harris/cranks/11074.html

 

[dsut4392]

Lots of different perspectives on http://www.crazyguyonabike.com (following a friend's Canada to Tierra del Fuego tour on there).

I'm amazed at the places he's been able to find the replacement parts he has needed. For instance, I never would have thought he would have to "downgrade" his rear shifter to Deore in Bogota because the shops only carried LX and above level in 10 speed nowadays.

Re brakes, have you not considered discs? These seem to be an option on the Pangea, though Thorn seem to be stuck in the 1930s.

If you do end up going with an external BB, I've had much better experience with Enduro bearings than stock Shimano (and Truvativ and Raceface BB's I've had were junk). Enduro's seem to withstand anything but direct hits from the power washer.

 

[purpletezza]

10 years ago we toured 9000km around Europe with front and back panniers. I rode a Steel giant peleton frame, square taper cranks(26-36-46) on Shimano UN52(?) bottom bracket with a 12-32 7spd cassette. My wife was riding a Thorn Brevet with 9 spd Octalink 105 shimano 32-42-52 cranks, 12-28 cassette, full Shimano drivetrain. No mech probs with anything.

I never used the 46 chainring. Averaged 18km/h most days so low gears are the go.

Keep the drive train clean and it will last a long time. If you are anywhere in the western world you will get shimano or shimano compatible parts. Only spares I would carry would be a chain joining link and chain breaker tool.

Have fun!

 

[austy37]

I use an old xt rd with a 9speed MTB cassette. My shifters a friction. I find it shifts pretty nicely with the ramped rings on the cassette an d no probs with tuning or bent derailed hangers.