Transformation of a Fanboy

[Kodiak]

Two years ago I joined this site to get another perspective on cycling that was missing. Initially I was totally shocked at the stuff I was reading about Lance Armstrong and others as I didn't know diddly about the extent of the doping going on in the late 90's and the 2000's. Today I'm just as shocked at the still ignorant people who continue to believe the spin doctors and still put that man up on a pedestal. There is so much out there to disprove the myth that is LA and the rest of his merry band of junkies yet most all of them are still in the sport.

 

[Pazuzu]

If I were to guess I'd say that most of Armstrong's most fervent supporters are only casual cycling fans at best. I also think his 'support' is a mile wide and and inch thick and will weaken as more revelations come to the fore.

However, even if no further evidence surfaces, his legacy is tarnished beyond repair. No one will be able to place him in the category of greatest ever in his sport - i.e., Phelps, Gretzky, Jordan, Dæhlie, Federer, etc. - and be taken seriously.

I'd love for him to come clean and dedicate himself to fixing the cyclling. But somehow I don't think that'll happen, which is a shame.

 

[AcademyCC]

If I were to guess I'd say that most of Armstrong's most fervent supporters are only casual cycling fans at best. I also think his 'support' is a mile wide and and inch thick and will weaken as more revelations come to the fore.

However, even if no further evidence surfaces, his legacy is tarnished beyond repair. No one will be able to place him in the category of greatest ever in his sport - i.e., Phelps, Gretzky, Jordan, Dæhlie, Federer, etc. - and be taken seriously.

I'd love for him to come clean and dedicate himself to fixing the cyclling. But somehow I don't think that'll happen, which is a shame.

I've tried to talk to these people. They have a malfunction in their brain. End of story

 

[Page Mill Masochist]

If I were to guess I'd say that most of Armstrong's most fervent supporters are only casual cycling fans at best. I also think his 'support' is a mile wide and and inch thick and will weaken as more revelations come to the fore.

It's now down to the Livestrong fans, celebrity worshipers, and a handful of commentators who had faithfully promoted the myth (Sally Jenkins, Rick Reilly, Phil Ligget) and lashed their reputations to a liar.

 

[Big Doopie]

It's now down to the Livestrong fans, celebrity worshipers, and a handful of commentators who had faithfully promoted the myth (Sally Jenkins, Rick Reilly, Phil Ligget) and lashed their reputations to a sociopath.

agree, just changed that one element for you.

there is no hope of a confession. ever.

this is a sociopath. the only true emotion he knows is anger. otherewise he has absolutely no ability for any form of compassion -- confirmed in anderson's account of his break up from Kik. and his comment about his cancer work "I hate these f###ing things" and his complete lack of contrition, and on and on...

this is a sociopath.

as someone posted in another thread we have to hope that he becomes publicly irrelevant.

if that were to happen, i actually fear what he might do when he implodes...

 

[Page Mill Masochist]

agree, just changed that one element for you.

there is no hope of a confession. ever.

this is a sociopath. the only true emotion he knows is anger. otherewise he has absolutely no ability for any form of compassion -- confirmed in anderson's account of his break up from Kik. and his comment about his cancer work "I hate these f###ing things" and his complete lack of contrition, and on and on...

this is a sociopath.

as someone posted in another thread we have to hope that he becomes publicly irrelevant.

if that were to happen, i actually fear what he might do when he implodes...

He drinks a lot and does stupid and irrational things when drunk: taunting Novitsky and Tygart in his tweets, threatening Ty at a restaurant. He'll get drunk and do something monumentally dumb. Set your watch.

 

[LauraLyn]

If I were to guess I'd say that most of Armstrong's most fervent supporters are only casual cycling fans at best. I also think his 'support' is a mile wide and and inch thick and will weaken as more revelations come to the fore.

Lance has two support basis:

1. The fans: "a mile wide and an inch thick and weak" - public opinion is fickle and it will almost always come back and bite you

2. The sports institutions: USA Cycling, WTC, UCI, and sponsor/business investments, tied to him and tied to the institutions

When #2 breaks (and it is breaking now) #1 will break as well.

You will know when the ship is sunk when the Lance Armstrong Foundation no longer exists.

 

[Page Mill Masochist]

When #2 breaks (and it is breaking now) #1 will break as well.

Waiting for Nike to break.

Bill Bowerman is rolling in his grave. So is Steve Prefontaine, who lost to the blood doper Lasse Viren in the 1972 Olympic 5,000 meter run.

Come on, Phil Knight! Remember your roots. Step up. Reclaim your Bowerman/Prefontaine legacy. You were once noble.

 

[Race Radio]

There is a small, but vocal, band of groupies that make the support look like more then it is.

Only 23% of his Twitter followers are real

His popularity is less then Michael Bolton
http://bizbeatblog.dallasnews.com/2012/08/armstrongs-marketing-flame-extinguished.html/

Only 10% of people who know who he is view him positively.

getting few baseball reporters to write nice things does little

 

[thehog]

Waiting for Nike to break.

Bill Bowerman is rolling in his grave. So is Steve Prefontaine, who lost to the blood doper Lasse Viren in the 1972 Olympic 5,000 meter run.

Come on, Phil Knight! Remember your roots. Step up. Reclaim your Bowerman/Prefontaine legacy. You were once noble.

Don't bet on it. Remember Dr. Craig Nichols? The main who never was from OHSU.

--

Because for reasons he has not shared in detail publicly, cancer research is among the areas of interest for Nike co-founder Phil Knight. Earlier this year, one of Nike's first employees and a friend of Knight, Geoff Hollister, died of cancer. Jim Riswold, the former Wieden+Kennedy creative director credited with some of Nike's most memorable ads, was diagnosed with cancer years ago.*

Knight and his wife Penny have pledged $100 million to the OHSU Knight Cancer Institute -- OHSU's largest donation ever. The Livestrong Foundation also has contributed to research projects of OHSU scientists.*

 

[Page Mill Masochist]

Because for reasons he has not shared in detail publicly, cancer research is among the areas of interest for Nike co-founder Phil Knight. Earlier this year, one of Nike's first employees and a friend of Knight, Geoff Hollister, died of cancer. Jim Riswold, the former Wieden+Kennedy creative director credited with some of Nike's most memorable ads, was diagnosed with cancer years ago.*

Knight and his wife Penny have pledged $100 million to the OHSU Knight Cancer Institute -- OHSU's largest donation ever. The Livestrong Foundation also has contributed to research projects of OHSU scientists.*

You're right. My mistake to think Knight bleeds Oregon yellow (and green). Instead it's Livestrong yellow.

Still, Nike is a pubic company, and I would think Nike shareholders are not as willing to circle the drain with LA.

 

[LauraLyn]

. . . .
Still, Nike is a pubic company, and I would think Nike shareholders are not as willing to circle the drain with LA.

Sponsors often take time to jump ship. Too many papers and too many lawyers to make course changing decisions easy.

Be patient.

 

[Page Mill Masochist]

Sponsors often take time to jump ship. Too many papers and too many lawyers to make course changing decisions easy.

Be patient.

Assume ASO strips LA of his TdF titles. If Nike is still sponsoring LA at that point, is there a basis for a shareholder class action lawsuit again Nike?

 

[LauraLyn]

Assume ASO strips LA of his TdF titles. If Nike is still sponsoring LA at that point, is there a basis for a shareholder class action lawsuit again Nike?

On the basis of . . . ? I don't see it. Unless Nike continued to advertise LiveStrong apparel as connected to 7 TdF winnings. And they wouldn't be that silly. (Even now with USADA's decision they can no longer connect Lance with the TdF or any other post-August 2008 winnings.]

I think Nike will separate from LiveStrong in the not so distant future.

A more interesting class-action suit would be one against the Lance Armstrong Foundation. The whole "It's Not about the Bike" lie would tend to make the LAF quite vulnerable. Juries won't take lightly to people being defrauded out of cancer contributions. But better to wait on this a bit longer until the public opinion is really fed up with Lance.

 

[Robert21]

He drinks a lot and does stupid and irrational things when drunk: taunting Novitsky and Tygart in his tweets, threatening Ty at a restaurant. He'll get drunk and do something monumentally dumb. Set your watch.

Here was a good example, not that the report lasted long on the web before his PR /legal goons had it pulled.

http://www.comcast.net/articles/entertainment-eonline/20090325/b106071/

26 March 2009

Liquored-Up Lance Loses It on Plane?

Ted Casablanca, eonline

Poor Lance Armstrong can't catch a break—well, aside from actually breaking his collarbone during a race in Spain, we mean.

After crashing during the run-up to his stunningly ambitious eighth Tour de France, Lance was on a flight from Madrid to Atlanta. And apparently the sometimes-womanizer took his self-pity out on the other passengers. Perhaps he knew how bad surgery was going to be, what with that steel plate and those 12 screws he'd just had implanted in his collarbone, which was busted in four spots?

Regardless, an A.T. reader on the flight with L.A. contacted us and described how unpleasant the 36-year-old cancer-surviving cyclist was:

"He was such an arsehole," ranted our onboard babe. "He was so wasted on painkillers, and he drank a lot. It was just obnoxious."

So how much did he chug exactly? "Enough to be cut off," the witness told us. And that was in first class, where the booze flows freely until passengers usually cut themselves off, honeys.

After bitchin' for a while, Lancey, who had his arm in a sling, finally went to sleep, much to the flight attendants' and other passengers' joy.

 

[ebandit]

tales of unicorns

wonderful story...............except it's too good to be true

says it all

 

[the big ring]

http://au.eonline.com/news/106071/liquored-up-lance-loses-it-on-plane

 

[TheSecretForum]

There is a small, but vocal, band of groupies that make the support look like more then it is.

Only 23% of his Twitter followers are real

His popularity is less then Michael Bolton
http://bizbeatblog.dallasnews.com/2012/08/armstrongs-marketing-flame-extinguished.html/

Only 10% of people who know who he is view him positively.

getting few baseball reporters to write nice things does little

I think that's a slight misreading of the poll. It's a marketing poll about whether they have any negative aspects to their image, rather than being unpopular. Nicky Minaj is one of the biggest pop stars in the world right now and he is level with her, yet you wouldn't necessarily want her to market your product. Other recent polls show that the majority of people think it was wrong to take all seven TdF titles away from him, so it is complex.

Most people involved in the sport continue to see Lance Armstrong as an icon. I think that support is critical to Armstrong. If that were to change then public opinion would quickly follow.

 

[Race Radio]

I think that's a slight misreading of the poll. It's a marketing poll about whether they have any negative aspects to their image, rather than being unpopular. Nicky Minaj is one of the biggest pop stars in the world right now and he is level with her, yet you wouldn't necessarily want her to market your product. Other recent polls show that the majority of people think it was wrong to take all seven TdF titles away from him, so it is complex.

Most people involved in the sport continue to see Lance Armstrong as an icon. I think that support is critical to Armstrong. If that were to change then public opinion would quickly follow.

I am not sure what you are saying

Armstrong is an icon in the same way that Micheal Bolton is an Icon. Even Micheal Bolton has loyal groupies.

Rumor has it Micheal Bolton is angry that his name is associated with Lance Armstrong. He is exploring his legal options for this slight

 

[Benotti69]

I think that's a slight misreading of the poll. It's a marketing poll about whether they have any negative aspects to their image, rather than being unpopular. Nicky Minaj is one of the biggest pop stars in the world right now and he is level with her, yet you wouldn't necessarily want her to market your product. Other recent polls show that the majority of people think it was wrong to take all seven TdF titles away from him, so it is complex.

Most people involved in the sport continue to see Lance Armstrong as an icon. I think that support is critical to Armstrong. If that were to change then public opinion would quickly follow.

After 13 years of Armstrong misleading the world, i think maybe what we are starting to see is some reality. He is not as popular a his pr spin it. His years of hiring public stratagies to keep the myth alive has skewed the polls always in his favour. That and only 23% of his followers are real tell us something closer to the true story.

 

[TheSecretForum]

After 13 years of Armstrong misleading the world, i think maybe what we are starting to see is some reality. He is not as popular a his pr spin it. His years of hiring public stratagies to keep the myth alive has skewed the polls always in his favour. That and only 23% of his followers are real tell us something closer to the true story.

Maybe, but I think the specific poll is about product endorsment rather than popularity.

 

[TheSecretForum]

I am not sure what you are saying

Armstrong is an icon in the same way that Micheal Bolton is an Icon. Even Micheal Bolton has loyal groupies.

Rumor has it Micheal Bolton is angry that his name is associated with Lance Armstrong. He is exploring his legal options for this slight

I don't think most of the top people in the music industry view Bolton as a great, is what I was saying. If the likes of Merckx and all of Armstrong's peer's turned against him, then public opinon would follow.

 

[Benotti69]

I don't think most of the top people in the music industry view Bolton as a great, is what I was saying. If the likes of Merckx and all of Armstrong's peer's turned against him, then public opinon would follow.

The average fan of Armstrong barely know anything about cycling. I am sure most would not know who Merckx is.

Maybe, but I think the specific poll is about product endorsment rather than popularity.

"the latest consumer poll"

It is a popularity poll. i.e. he is not popular because he is viewed as a cheater.

 

[TheSecretForum]

The average fan of Armstrong barely know anything about cycling. I am sure most would not know who Merckx is.

You're right, but it would filter through pretty quick if the majority of people in the sport turned against him. Vaughters doesn't seem to think that will happen.

"the latest consumer poll"

It is a popularity poll. i.e. he is not popular because he is viewed as a cheater.

Again, consumer polls include all aspects of someone's image. Therefore you can be wildly popular like nicki minaj yet have a negative endorsment value for many products. It's complicated. We're also at the height of the scandal, when it dies down he might go up again. It's difficult to tell at this stage.

 

[the big ring]

Nothing new under the sun: http://forum.cyclingnews.com/showthread.php?t=13612