Tyler's Tour de France in 2003

[coinneach]

I'm scared to post in the clinic under the heading "anything you don't agree with in the USADA report" but, it says that Tyler stopping Jan Ullrich and waiting for Lance at Luz-Airdiden:
"Hamilton’s chivalry may have cost himself a spot on the podium. He wound up in fourth place at the 2003 Tour, just over two minutes out of third."
I really don't remember it like that BUT in any event, whose place did the reports authors think Hamilton would have taken if he hadn't slowed down for Lance?

 

[Ryo Hazuki]

I've never heard of that. only that ullrich screwed his possible tour win up there and that is definitely true. lance would've never waited under those circumstances for ullrich. and don't come with tour 2001, when ullrich was already 5 minutes behind in gc.

 

[RownhamHill]

I'm scared to post in the clinic under the heading "anything you don't agree with in the USADA report" but, it says that Tyler stopping Jan Ullrich and waiting for Lance at Luz-Airdiden:
"Hamilton’s chivalry may have cost himself a spot on the podium. He wound up in fourth place at the 2003 Tour, just over two minutes out of third."
I really don't remember it like that BUT in any event, whose place did the reports authors think Hamilton would have taken if he hadn't slowed down for Lance?

Ermmm, Lance's?

 

[coinneach]

Ermmm, Lance's?

I can't see that: Lance beat Tyler by over 6 minutes overall: he can't have lost more than 1 in the fall?

 

[babastooey]

I just checked the history books and I am scratching my head trying to figure out who you are talking about.

Lance won a world title and a couple of stages in the Tour with Motorola, and then got cancer, thought about coming back, and then dropped off the face of the earth in 1998.

I couldn't really find anything on Tyler Hamilton, are you sure he even rode the Tour?

 

[RownhamHill]

I can't see that: Lance beat Tyler by over 6 minutes overall: he can't have lost more than 1 in the fall?

No idea I'm afraid, and I couldn't care less either way. But surely the only way that deciding to wait for someone would cost you a place is that if, otherwise, you would have beaten the person you waited for?

(Unless I suppose someone else entirely didn't wait while you did, and you lost out to them while you were hanging around - but that didn't happen either did it?)

 

[coinneach]

Hmmmm....Just as I thought, no one (so far) can really justify this statement in the report...doesn't take anything away from its real value though.

 

[Ryo Hazuki]

I just checked the history books and I am scratching my head trying to figure out who you are talking about.

Lance won a world title and a couple of stages in the Tour with Motorola, and then got cancer, thought about coming back, and then dropped off the face of the earth in 1998.

I couldn't really find anything on Tyler Hamilton, are you sure he even rode the Tour?

lol. good one

 

[Eshnar]

I just checked the history books and I am scratching my head trying to figure out who you are talking about.

Lance won a world title and a couple of stages in the Tour with Motorola, and then got cancer, thought about coming back, and then dropped off the face of the earth in 1998.

I couldn't really find anything on Tyler Hamilton, are you sure he even rode the Tour?

well played
it took me time to understand this tho

 

[Bavarianrider]

That's ****ing bull****. Had Ullich not slowed down, Hamilton would have neer seen him again. He was already way behind. Moreoer, there were many riders coming back to Ullrich before Hamilton was there. There wasalready a wholebunch of riders soft pedeling, when Hamilton played the sherif.

 

[jens_attacks]

absolutely nothing meaningful to the gc would have happened anyway if ulle or the others didn't wait. chechu and lance could have catched them easily....30-40 seconds gap was nothing for lance in super form that day, jan too no doubt.but lance was better
sadly, the tour was lost by ulle on the alpe

i don't know, maybe the autor thought that tyler would put minutes into a very hurt vino who was already dropped on the tourmalet that day. but tyler was already at 7 minutes from vino, if he was closer,no more bayonne festival for him

 

[burning]

I just checked the history books and I am scratching my head trying to figure out who you are talking about.

Lance won a world title and a couple of stages in the Tour with Motorola, and then got cancer, thought about coming back, and then dropped off the face of the earth in 1998.

I couldn't really find anything on Tyler Hamilton, are you sure he even rode the Tour?

Quality post there

 

[Ryo Hazuki]

absolutely nothing meaningful to the gc would have happened anyway if ulle or the others didn't wait. chechu and lance could have catched them easily....30-40 seconds gap was nothing for lance in super form that day, jan too no doubt.but lance was better
sadly, the tour was lost by ulle on the alpe

i don't know, maybe the autor thought that tyler would put minutes into a very hurt vino who was already dropped on the tourmalet that day. but tyler was already at 7 minutes from vino, if he was closer,no more bayonne festival for him

lance superform?? in 2003 ullrich was better than lance.

 

[jens_attacks]

i said that day, not overall

 

[coinneach]

My point was that the report was wrong, and no one has really challenged that. I think its a consequence of caring for the victims so much and not really understanding cycling. Can't have everything though!

 

[babastooey]

I neglected to mention that Lance did come out of nowhere to make something of a comback and win a bronze medal in the Olympic Men's Time Trial in 2000, quite a feat for someone who had tumors in his head, although, he hasn't done anything since.

 

[skidmark]

My point was that the report was wrong, and no one has really challenged that. I think its a consequence of caring for the victims so much and not really understanding cycling. Can't have everything though!

Yeah I cringed pretty heavily reading that part of the report too... I mean, I get that USADA is trying to paint their witnesses as semi-victims or at least in some kind of favourable light, but that part was just embarrassing. Agree with your assessment.

 

[Epicycle]

My point was that the report was wrong, and no one has really challenged that. I think its a consequence of caring for the victims so much and not really understanding cycling. Can't have everything though!

The funny part is USADA took that info from Lance's book, Every Second Counts. The reference is in the footnote below it. So they are using Lance's own words against him.

But yeah, in reality it looked like Jan did start soft pedaling before Tyler started telling them to slow down. Jan knew what had happened because he had to swerve to miss Lance and Mayo when they fell. Jan slowed down and the guys behind caught up to him, including Tyler.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GEqQW1-casM