Video : East German Doping Program

May 26, 2010
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Where did those East German coaches go after the wall came down?

That would be the best thing for this thread. To show where the coaches are now and who they worked with.

Heiko Salzwedel is in GB and works big time with Wiggins.
 
movingtarget said:
http://www.abc.net.au/foreign/content/2016/s4520781.htm

It seems that some athletes are still unable to admit to doping even 44 years later. But the health repercussions have been dire.
I was depressed after 5'. You'd think that they would pay these women to talk. Something as vulgar as Oprah might work here.
 
Re:

Benotti69 said:
Where did those East German coaches go after the wall came down?

That would be the best thing for this thread. To show where the coaches are now and who they worked with.

Heiko Salzwedel is in GB and works big time with Wiggins.
Jürgen Groebler is Steven Redgrave's pal.
 
Re:

Benotti69 said:
Where did those East German coaches go after the wall came down?

That would be the best thing for this thread. To show where the coaches are now and who they worked with.

Heiko Salzwedel is in GB and works big time with Wiggins.
Yes he was in Australia before that for quite a long time as the coach of the Road team.
 
buckle said:
movingtarget said:
http://www.abc.net.au/foreign/content/2016/s4520781.htm

It seems that some athletes are still unable to admit to doping even 44 years later. But the health repercussions have been dire.
I was depressed after 5'. You'd think that they would pay these women to talk. Something as vulgar as Oprah might work here.
i think the guy who was on the disability pension who had problems with his brain was the track sprinter who handed his medal back.
 
Re: Re:

movingtarget said:
Benotti69 said:
Where did those East German coaches go after the wall came down?

That would be the best thing for this thread. To show where the coaches are now and who they worked with.

Heiko Salzwedel is in GB and works big time with Wiggins.
Yes he was in Australia before that for quite a long time as the coach of the Road team.
He worked out of Switzerland also and the UCI counts amongst his clients. I can find nothing on his academic qualifications. Ferrari is easier to track down.
 
Re: Re:

buckle said:
movingtarget said:
Benotti69 said:
Where did those East German coaches go after the wall came down?

That would be the best thing for this thread. To show where the coaches are now and who they worked with.

Heiko Salzwedel is in GB and works big time with Wiggins.
Yes he was in Australia before that for quite a long time as the coach of the Road team.
He worked out of Switzerland also and the UCI counts amongst his clients. I can find nothing on his academic qualifications. Ferrari is easier to track down.

Funny how everyone is 'oh those horrible, awful, East German authoritarian, systematic dopers...' yet once Germany was reunited, everyone was looking to hire them. I mean, if you felt something was bad for sport, wouldn't you want to distance yourself and your team/club/federation from it? The East Germans were also very good at ID'ing talent and developing that talent. Of course, doping played a big role, but their gymnasiums and hochschulsport were top notch. Strong sports schools, strong organization, good work ethic, doping=strong results.

Maybe the Brits are on to something...
 
Feb 6, 2016
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Good post Bullsfan.

This article is well worth reading: http://www.ironcurtainproject.eu/en/stories/ive-given-my-blood-for-union/how-east-and-west-germany-abused-and-drained-their-athletes/

It epitomises a very interesting current in German history; the conspiracy of silence. Until the 1980s, Nazi Germany was seldom discussed. Everything was swallowed up in the economic miracle. To this day, the abuses perpetrated by the DDR are something of a taboo in Germany. It's thus unsurprising that the DDR doping programme was simultaneously seized upon and ignored.
 
Re:

Benotti69 said:
Where did those East German coaches go after the wall came down?

That would be the best thing for this thread. To show where the coaches are now and who they worked with.

Heiko Salzwedel is in GB and works big time with Wiggins.
Isn't HMW also from East Germany?

Don't think he was part of the system there though, but who knows
 
Re:

Cannibal72 said:
Good post Bullsfan.

This article is well worth reading: http://www.ironcurtainproject.eu/en/stories/ive-given-my-blood-for-union/how-east-and-west-germany-abused-and-drained-their-athletes/

It epitomises a very interesting current in German history; the conspiracy of silence. Until the 1980s, Nazi Germany was seldom discussed. Everything was swallowed up in the economic miracle. To this day, the abuses perpetrated by the DDR are something of a taboo in Germany. It's thus unsurprising that the DDR doping programme was simultaneously seized upon and ignored.

Glad you shared that link. I think I may also have shared it at some point in recent weeks. It's good to have it circulating.

Here are some more links underlying the fact the West Germans may not have been better at doping their athletes than the East. Better as in, they tried to compete clean, but it appears that was never the case:

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-23573169

http://www.worldsoccer.com/columnists/keir-radnedge/west-germanys-culture-of-doping-kept-under-wraps-341986

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2013/aug/05/west-germany-doping-athletes-report

http://www.espnfc.com/german-bundesliga/story/1514871/west-germany-sponsored-doping-in-sports-report

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/08/09/sports/west-germany-engaged-in-sports-doping-in-1970s-study-says.html

http://www.playthegame.org/news/news-articles/2016/0155_germany-intends-to-keep-its-doping-secret/


Not to mention solely looking at the Bundesliga and reports of widespread doping already in the 70's and 80's. Even before that with the 1954 World Cup and how the Germans were able to beat the more talented Hungarian team. Plus Beckenbauer saying how the national team was taking 'vitamins.'

http://www.spiegel.de/sport/fussball/zdf-sportstudio-beckenbauer-spricht-ueber-vitaminspritzen-a-915922.html

http://www.sueddeutsche.de/sport/dfb-und-doping-vitaminspritzen-aus-der-guten-alten-zeit-1.1745086
 
Re: Re:

The Hitch said:
Benotti69 said:
Where did those East German coaches go after the wall came down?

That would be the best thing for this thread. To show where the coaches are now and who they worked with.

Heiko Salzwedel is in GB and works big time with Wiggins.
Isn't HMW also from East Germany?

Don't think he was part of the system there though, but who knows
If it's the HMW I'm thinking of, he worked at Hertha Berlin in the mid 70s so I would have to guess he was from West Berlin/Germany. He then moved to Bayern in the late 70s.
 
Re: Re:

BullsFan22 said:
buckle said:
movingtarget said:
Benotti69 said:
Where did those East German coaches go after the wall came down?

That would be the best thing for this thread. To show where the coaches are now and who they worked with.

Heiko Salzwedel is in GB and works big time with Wiggins.
Yes he was in Australia before that for quite a long time as the coach of the Road team.
He worked out of Switzerland also and the UCI counts amongst his clients. I can find nothing on his academic qualifications. Ferrari is easier to track down.

Funny how everyone is 'oh those horrible, awful, East German authoritarian, systematic dopers...' yet once Germany was reunited, everyone was looking to hire them. I mean, if you felt something was bad for sport, wouldn't you want to distance yourself and your team/club/federation from it? The East Germans were also very good at ID'ing talent and developing that talent. Of course, doping played a big role, but their gymnasiums and hochschulsport were top notch. Strong sports schools, strong organization, good work ethic, doping=strong results.

Maybe the Brits are on to something...
Salzwedel found his first big gig in Australia ...
 
Re: Re:

BullsFan22 said:
buckle said:
movingtarget said:
Benotti69 said:
Where did those East German coaches go after the wall came down?

That would be the best thing for this thread. To show where the coaches are now and who they worked with.

Heiko Salzwedel is in GB and works big time with Wiggins.
Yes he was in Australia before that for quite a long time as the coach of the Road team.
He worked out of Switzerland also and the UCI counts amongst his clients. I can find nothing on his academic qualifications. Ferrari is easier to track down.

Funny how everyone is 'oh those horrible, awful, East German authoritarian, systematic dopers...' yet once Germany was reunited, everyone was looking to hire them. I mean, if you felt something was bad for sport, wouldn't you want to distance yourself and your team/club/federation from it? The East Germans were also very good at ID'ing talent and developing that talent. Of course, doping played a big role, but their gymnasiums and hochschulsport were top notch. Strong sports schools, strong organization, good work ethic, doping=strong results.

Maybe the Brits are on to something...
5000 coaches of which 400 gained employment in Germany the rest disappeared across the World.
 
buckle said:
movingtarget said:
http://www.abc.net.au/foreign/content/2016/s4520781.htm

It seems that some athletes are still unable to admit to doping even 44 years later. But the health repercussions have been dire.
I was depressed after 5'. You'd think that they would pay these women to talk. Something as vulgar as Oprah might work here.
Well they are after compensation some of them but it would be a complex case or maybe class action. They could argue that to compete they had to dope but being compliant in doping even though they were coerced, many of them, proving the government was liable would not be easy especially a new government. They would rather pay them disability pensions and hope they go away which seems to be what is happening for the most part. Of course the doctors usually continue to thrive elsewhere and doctors in general, it's hard to prosecute them or even have them de-registered in many countries. Probably because it's difficult to say that a medical condition is the way it is because of a doctor's actions or lack of action. I think most cases would be settled out of court which is usually what happens with drug companies. Victims take what they can get instead of being tied up in court for years and not knowing if they will ever receive anything. Unfortunately most of the records were shredded but enough survived to implicate quite a few people and then there would be plenty of personal testimonies from athletes but after so long many of the perpetrators are probably already dead or retired. And then of course the doctors could say the same. They were directed by the government to do what they did. It was kept quiet for too long unfortunately for the victims and they are the ones still suffering.
 
Oct 16, 2010
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Re: Re:

buckle said:
...
Salzwedel found his first big gig in Australia ...
Salzwedel's background and links to different teams and riders, and specifically also his time at the AIS, have been discussed in some detail here:
viewtopic.php?f=20&t=29554

buckle said:
...
He worked out of Switzerland also and the UCI counts amongst his clients.
this is interesting. Got any link(s)?

I can find nothing on his academic qualifications.
I doubt he has any.
 
Oct 16, 2010
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Re:

Tienus said:
http://www.insidethegames.biz/articles/6762/martin-gillingham-on-britains-east-german-doping-link

In 2004, the BOA gave Grobler a lifetime achievement award (note the ‘lifetime’ bit – no effort there to differentiate between his work in the GDR and here in the UK) while the Olympics minister Tessa Jowell has even bestowed upon him an honorary OBE.
well I'll be damned. Nice linkylink.

So we got Grobler AND Salzwedel, both embraced by UK Sports.
Both telling us how 'unlucky' they are to have been born in East Germany, but that that plays no role in the present. Right.

From the link you provided:
Since Grobler’s arrival in the Home Counties he has coached the likes of Sir Steve Redgrave and Sir Matthew Pinsent to a hatful of Olympic golds. And though there is, of course, no suggestion that drugs formed any part of their regime that is hardly the point. What is, though, is the speed with which not only British rowing but also two of our greatest Olympians embraced him.
yikes.
 
Oct 16, 2010
19,912
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Re:

The Carrot said:
http://sabotagetimes.com/football/team-gb-are-the-new-east-germany

I've posted this before. 4 yrs old but still a good read.
nice read indeed.
 
Jul 5, 2011
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Re: Re:

sniper said:
Tienus said:
http://www.insidethegames.biz/articles/6762/martin-gillingham-on-britains-east-german-doping-link

In 2004, the BOA gave Grobler a lifetime achievement award (note the ‘lifetime’ bit – no effort there to differentiate between his work in the GDR and here in the UK) while the Olympics minister Tessa Jowell has even bestowed upon him an honorary OBE.
well I'll be damned. Nice linkylink.

So we got Grobler AND Salzwedel, both embraced by UK Sports.
Both telling us how 'unlucky' they are to have been born in East Germany, but that that plays no role in the present. Right.

From the link you provided:
Since Grobler’s arrival in the Home Counties he has coached the likes of Sir Steve Redgrave and Sir Matthew Pinsent to a hatful of Olympic golds. And though there is, of course, no suggestion that drugs formed any part of their regime that is hardly the point. What is, though, is the speed with which not only British rowing but also two of our greatest Olympians embraced him.
yikes.
Yes but obviously once on British soil it would have been made clear that his decades of compulsory doping of athletes and the wealth of experience that would have brought would no longer play a part in his regimen. :lol:
 
Re: Re:

sniper said:
buckle said:
...
Salzwedel found his first big gig in Australia ...
Salzwedel's background and links to different teams and riders, and specifically also his time at the AIS, have been discussed in some detail here:
viewtopic.php?f=20&t=29554

buckle said:
...
He worked out of Switzerland also and the UCI counts amongst his clients.
this is interesting. Got any link(s)?

Sorry only crappy wiki - this guy is bizarrely elusive to tie down.


Avec son agence SL Sport, il supervise les fédérations sportives (par exemple, l'Union Cycliste Internationale (UCI), Swiss Triathlon, la fédération de patinage de vitesse canadienne) et des coureurs comme McEwen, Ronny Scholz et Grischa Niermann et le triathlète Jan van Berkel.


il supervise les fédérations sportives - supervised the UCI?

The German uses er betreut ("he looked after" the UCI?).

I can find nothing on his academic qualifications.
I doubt he has any.
You think he worked unqualified at the Australia Institute of Sport with this guy?

http://www.nba.com/sixers/news/150629-martin-hired/

"Doctor" Martin to boot ...
 

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