2011 Copenhagen World Championships: Elite Men Road Race

[cineteq]

I'd put J-Rod in there because he can cope with the big mountains as well as the one day stuff.

Sorry but can't put him in the same sentence with the others. J-Rod is one dimensional climber. Evans and Valverde the most versatile of the list. They should be your measuring bar.

 

[El Pistolero]

But in reality that all boils down to "can get over hills well", and leaves us with a course suited for the same 5 riders every year. Some years we'll make it harder so Evans has a better chance, other years we'll make it a bit easier so Cancellara and Hushovd have a better chance.

I just don't get why hilly classic riders are held up as the ideal. It's not the world hilly road champion. I'd love cobbles one year, mountain the next, hilly the next, sprint the next.

Because what you say ain't true. Cancellara and Phil are much more than just hilly classics specialists or cobbled specialists.

 

[sublimit]

J-Rod cant TT but he's the best rider for me. He would need a really hard race with climbs and then an uphill finish. Evans is clearly superb but Valverde I'm not counting at the moment untill he proves himself again.

 

[spalco]

Btw. my opinion in regards to what the road race World Championships course should be like is that it should generally be a Classics-style race, maybe a little easier to give the "lesser nations" (copyright Harmon) a little hope too.

 

[Mambo95]

Ever heard of Alejandro Valverde?

He's a proven cheat though.

 

[Ferminal]

I just don't get why hilly classic riders are held up as the ideal. It's not the world hilly road champion. I'd love cobbles one year, mountain the next, hilly the next, sprint the next.

Yes, I agree, but more often than not the course probably will suit these types of riders because they have the most diverse skill sets. That may be why they are seen as the "ideal World Champions" compared with others who may only be able to win in a bunch sprint of 60+ or 10km+ MTF.

 

[taiwan]

Versatile Riders

Valverde, Evans, Vinokourov, Sanchez, Voeckler. IMHO.

 

[cineteq]

Valverde, Evans, Vinokourov, Sanchez.

Now we're talking

 

[thehog]

He's a proven cheat though.

I don't think that means anything anymore. Proven or not I think you can slop eveyone into the same soup.

 

[pantsarefortheold]

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/hushovd-says-two-captain-strategy-backfired-for-norway
Classic Hushovd.

The rest of the original article also include Hushovd saying how he dont blame any other than himself for staying to far back when the crash happend. Wich also is classic, IF your used to whole reading interviews instead of dissected ones.

 

[Winterfold]

"sportsidioterne"

the commenters on that Danish paper have sussed the cycling knowledge and amazing ability of the CN forum to call races

 

[Thomsena]

Fact is that amongst the spectators there were probably 50% danes, 30% norwegians, 10% belgians and 5% dutch, and neither of these were particularly pleased with either the winner or the race development. I can't even imagine how crazy the atmosphere would have been if a Norwegian had won, but instead there was just silence.

I have no idea where you were standing but 30 % norwegians? Are you kidding? I was placed about 50 meters from the finish line and the atmosphere was incredible. Alot of cheering for Mark. He is very popular here.

 

[Mellow Velo]

This thread made it to a Danish newspaper quoting a few posts:

http://spn.dk/cykling/article2558012.ece

Yay! I made the Danish newspapers...............as the voice of reason and sanity.

 

[hrotha]

Not entirely correct.
The Worlds was in Columbia in 1995 and was set in Sallanches in the Alps in 1980.

I don't get the argument that the WC should just be for versatile riders, why?
Certainly different types of courses should be selected, to offer all types of rider the opportunity to go for the WC.
The only difficulty is the preference of the host organizer and/or the UCI to select circuits, which means it is difficult to put in long or demanding climbs.

Duitama was the hardest course in recent times, but it wasn't necessarily a course for climbers. Olano won, Indurain was second, and guys like Puttini, Gianetti and Konyshev were up there. Obviously I didn't see Sallanches but it's my understanding that it was similar: hard, but not really a climber ghetto.

 

[hrotha]

The rest of the original article also include Hushovd saying how he dont blame any other than himself for staying to far back when the crash happend. Wich also is classic, IF your used to whole reading interviews instead of dissected ones.

Regardless, he still says the team orders should have been clear (ie. that he should have been the sole leader) and that Rasch and Arvesen should have helped him (even if he doesn't blame them for what happened). Me Thor. Me me me me me. Thor. Me.

 

[spalco]

I honestly don't think Rasch, Arvesen and EBH dropping back would have changed anything. The group Hushovd was in was plenty strong enough if they had had a chance to catch back on. It was his own mistake/bad luck that screwed the race for him, can happen to anybody, but tactics had nothing to do with it imo.

 

[Sørensen]

I have no idea where you were standing but 30 % norwegians? Are you kidding? I was placed about 50 meters from the finish line and the atmosphere was incredible. Alot of cheering for Mark. He is very popular here.

Hehehe 30% norwegians Sure it wasent more? Relax Norway.. To quote Brede Hangeland "Sometimes it gets a little bit embarrassing"

 

[Thomsena]

Hehehe 30% norwegians Sure it wasent more? Relax Norway.. To quote Brede Hangeland "Sometimes it gets a little bit embarrassing"

There were alot of norwegians but of course not like 75.000 of them.

 

[Dr. Maserati]

Duitama was the hardest course in recent times, but it wasn't necessarily a course for climbers. Olano won, Indurain was second, and guys like Puttini, Gianetti and Konyshev were up there. Obviously I didn't see Sallanches but it's my understanding that it was similar: hard, but not really a climber ghetto.

Unless you put the race in the alps/pyrenees and have 20+ km of climbing then it is not possible to put in a course that suits just the 'pure climbers'.

As I said that goes against the circuit type events that are favoured by the organizers (& probably the UCI).

1. Abraham Olano, Spain 7:09:55
2. Miguel Indurain, Spain +35 secs.
3. Marco Pantani, Italy s.t.
4. Mauro Gianetti, Switzerland s.t.
5. Pascal Richard, Switzerland 53
6. Richard Virenque, France 1:31
7. Dimitri Konychev, Russia 1:53
8. Oliverio Rincon, Colombia s.t.
9. Rolf Sorensen, Denmark s.t.
10. Felice Puttini, Switzerland s.t.
11. Israel Ochoa, Colombia 3:08

 

[Sørensen]

There were alot of norwegians but of course not like 75.000 of them.

I heard 30.000 which is still very impressive. But ofc. they have to exaggerate it...

 

[roundabout]

Hmm, Sallanches...

http://gasrom.free.fr/Etapes/PCM2010/Sallanches1980.png

Profile in the middle of the image. Probably 230 meters climbed per lap?

268km, 13.4 per lap should be 20 laps so about the same as Mendrisio which was officially 4655 meters?

 

[hrotha]

Unless you put the race in the alps/pyrenees and have 20+ km of climbing then it is not possible to put in a course that suits just the 'pure climbers'.

As I said that goes against the circuit type events that are favoured by the organizers (& probably the UCI).

1. Abraham Olano, Spain 7:09:55
2. Miguel Indurain, Spain +35 secs.
3. Marco Pantani, Italy s.t.
4. Mauro Gianetti, Switzerland s.t.
5. Pascal Richard, Switzerland 53
6. Richard Virenque, France 1:31
7. Dimitri Konychev, Russia 1:53
8. Oliverio Rincon, Colombia s.t.
9. Rolf Sorensen, Denmark s.t.
10. Felice Puttini, Switzerland s.t.
11. Israel Ochoa, Colombia 3:08

I don't want a WC for climbing specialists. I don't want a WC for any kind of specialist to the detriment of all others. My point is that Duitama wasn't really for climbers (yes, Pantani was up there; he did well at Liege once or twice too), so those saying the pure sprinters should get their chance because other specialists do are not putting forth a very convincing argument IMO.

 

[pantsarefortheold]

Regardless, he still says the team orders should have been clear (ie. that he should have been the sole leader) and that Rasch and Arvesen should have helped him (even if he doesn't blame them for what happened). Me Thor. Me me me me me. Thor. Me.

Again according to the original article, where he got asked if they should drop back, he answered again that it was his own fault and that he couldnt hold it against them. Hes also quoted saying that there wouldnt be any guarantee them coming back for him would help at all.

 

[Dr. Maserati]

I don't want a WC for climbing specialists. I don't want a WC for any kind of specialist to the detriment of all others. My point is that Duitama wasn't really for climbers (yes, Pantani was up there; he did well at Liege once or twice too), so those saying the pure sprinters should get their chance because other specialists do are not putting forth a very convincing argument IMO.

Then who should the WC races suit? And why have a course solely designed for them?

This is simple - it is called a road race. First past the line wins.

The only thing yesterdays course meant was that it be harder for other teams to shake the sprinters, everyone knew what the GB tactic was going to be.

 

[hrotha]

Then who should the WC races suit? And why have a course solely designed for them?

Why are you asking me to repeat myself?