2017 Flèche Wallone - April 19th - 200.5km

[SeriousSam]

Re: Re:

And a significant amount of people still think this is the 6th most prestigious classic.

This is easily the most disappointing race on the calendar. It's about as prestigious as a win in the Scheldeprijs to me, but that race at least isn't part of the WT.

A lot of good riders weren't even here: Alaphilippe, Gilbert, Froome, Chaves, Quintana, Nibali, Contador, etc.

When will the organizers learn that they need to move the finish 20-30km away from the Mur de Huy. Then we'd see a real race.

I think they have a pretty good excuse

Exactly. And the rest of that list, other than Chaves who might or might not be a legitimate contender, are fringe contenders at best. GC climbers with little punch are not rivals to Valverde, Martin, Alaphillipe and co in the Ardennes. If they thought they would be top favourites they would be there.

Froome could be a legitimate contender, but no one else in that list has any hope.

 

[Mr.White]

Dan Martin would have finished second no matter what the position he had. He was positioned good last year, but it didn't matter much...

 

[burning]

Re: Re:

I think they have a pretty good excuse

Exactly. And the rest of that list, other than Chaves who might or might not be a legitimate contender, are fringe contenders at best. GC climbers with little punch are not rivals to Valverde, Martin, Alaphillipe and co in the Ardennes. If they thought they would be top favourites they would be there.

Froome smoked his *** on the Mur de Huy in the Tour. Nibali always smokes Valverde when he is in top shape (which sadly rarely happens these days).

<edited by mods>

Just stating facts. Nobody peaks for this race, everybody peaks for the Tour. Result = Valverde can't win.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4ZnrkrByass

Just stating facts. Nobody peaks for the cobbled classics, everybody peaks for the Tour. Result = Sagan and Canc gets dropped by Astana cobbled classics train with cobbled classics GOAT Westra leading the charge after being in the break all day.

https://youtu.be/8lB-7K92nqM?t=1623

 

[tobydawq]

Re: Re:

Just stating facts. Nobody peaks for the cobbled classics, everybody peaks for the Tour. Result = Sagan and Canc gets dropped by Astana cobbled classics train with cobbled classics GOAT Westra leading the charge after being in the break all day.

https://youtu.be/8lB-7K92nqM?t=1623

They were only dropped because Kwiatkowski punctured and slowed everybody down in a long while.

 

[El Pistolero]

Re: Re:

Just stating facts. Nobody peaks for the cobbled classics, everybody peaks for the Tour. Result = Sagan and Canc gets dropped by Astana cobbled classics train with cobbled classics GOAT Westra leading the charge after being in the break all day.

https://youtu.be/8lB-7K92nqM?t=1623

Lars Boom won. What is he again?

Boonen wasn't there and Sep Vanmarcke had a flat tire at the wrong moment. GVA was involved in a crash.

The only GT contender that put in an exceptional performance that day was Nibali and we all know he's the most versatile cyclist of the GT contenders (even podiumed in Milan-San Remo).

Also the Mur de Huy stage was an exact replica of Fleche Wallonne. This cobbled stage not so much (and there hasn't been a rainy Roubaix since 2002).

 

[burning]

Re: Re:

Just stating facts. Nobody peaks for the cobbled classics, everybody peaks for the Tour. Result = Sagan and Canc gets dropped by Astana cobbled classics train with cobbled classics GOAT Westra leading the charge after being in the break all day.

https://youtu.be/8lB-7K92nqM?t=1623

Lars Boom won. What is he again?

Boonen wasn't there and Sep Vanmarcke had a flat tire at the wrong moment. GVA was involved in a crash.

The only GT contender that put in an exceptional performance that day was Nibali and we all know he's the most versatile cyclist of the GT contenders (even podiumed in Milan-San Remo).

Also the Mur de Huy stage was an exact replica of Fleche Wallonne. This cobbled stage not so much (and there hasn't been a rainy Roubaix since 2002).

Really?

I would definitely say that there is less difference in cobbled stage vs Roubaix compared to other two. Also, the race was stopped for half an hour as well.

Boonen was bad in 2014, and I don't care about what happened with GVA and Vanmarcke, they should take a lesson or two from the Astana train on how to ride on cobbles on a rainy day.

 

[El Pistolero]

Re: Re:

Just stating facts. Nobody peaks for the cobbled classics, everybody peaks for the Tour. Result = Sagan and Canc gets dropped by Astana cobbled classics train with cobbled classics GOAT Westra leading the charge after being in the break all day.

https://youtu.be/8lB-7K92nqM?t=1623

Lars Boom won. What is he again?

Boonen wasn't there and Sep Vanmarcke had a flat tire at the wrong moment. GVA was involved in a crash.

The only GT contender that put in an exceptional performance that day was Nibali and we all know he's the most versatile cyclist of the GT contenders (even podiumed in Milan-San Remo).

Also the Mur de Huy stage was an exact replica of Fleche Wallonne. This cobbled stage not so much (and there hasn't been a rainy Roubaix since 2002).

Really?

I would definitely say that there is less difference in cobbled stage vs Roubaix compared to other two. Also, the race was stopped for half an hour as well.

Boonen was bad in 2014, and I don't care about what happened with GVA and Vanmarcke, they should take a lesson or two from the Astana train on how to ride on cobbles on a rainy day.

There's only one km that matters in this joke of a race. If it finishes on Mur de Huy it's an exact replica.

And lol, even Dylan Teuns was on the podium in this race? I wouldn't even rate him in the top twenty best Belgian cyclists at the moment.

 

[Mr.White]

Re: Re:

Just stating facts. Nobody peaks for the cobbled classics, everybody peaks for the Tour. Result = Sagan and Canc gets dropped by Astana cobbled classics train with cobbled classics GOAT Westra leading the charge after being in the break all day.

https://youtu.be/8lB-7K92nqM?t=1623

Lars Boom won. What is he again?

Boonen wasn't there and Sep Vanmarcke had a flat tire at the wrong moment. GVA was involved in a crash.

The only GT contender that put in an exceptional performance that day was Nibali and we all know he's the most versatile cyclist of the GT contenders (even podiumed in Milan-San Remo).

Also the Mur de Huy stage was an exact replica of Fleche Wallonne. This cobbled stage not so much (and there hasn't been a rainy Roubaix since 2002).

Really?

I would definitely say that there is less difference in cobbled stage vs Roubaix compared to other two. Also, the race was stopped for half an hour as well.

Boonen was bad in 2014, and I don't care about what happened with GVA and Vanmarcke, they should take a lesson or two from the Astana train on how to ride on cobbles on a rainy day.

There's only one km that matters in this joke of a race. If it finishes on Mur de Huy it's an exact replica.

And lol, even Dylan Teuns was on the podium in this race? I wouldn't even rate him in the top twenty best Belgian cyclists at the moment.

Matt Hayman won Roubaix! Do I need to say more..?

 

[burning]

Re: Re:

Just stating facts. Nobody peaks for the cobbled classics, everybody peaks for the Tour. Result = Sagan and Canc gets dropped by Astana cobbled classics train with cobbled classics GOAT Westra leading the charge after being in the break all day.

https://youtu.be/8lB-7K92nqM?t=1623

Lars Boom won. What is he again?

Boonen wasn't there and Sep Vanmarcke had a flat tire at the wrong moment. GVA was involved in a crash.

The only GT contender that put in an exceptional performance that day was Nibali and we all know he's the most versatile cyclist of the GT contenders (even podiumed in Milan-San Remo).

Also the Mur de Huy stage was an exact replica of Fleche Wallonne. This cobbled stage not so much (and there hasn't been a rainy Roubaix since 2002).

Really?

I would definitely say that there is less difference in cobbled stage vs Roubaix compared to other two. Also, the race was stopped for half an hour as well.

Boonen was bad in 2014, and I don't care about what happened with GVA and Vanmarcke, they should take a lesson or two from the Astana train on how to ride on cobbles on a rainy day.

There's only one km that matters in this joke of a race. If it finishes on Mur de Huy it's an exact replica.

And lol, even Dylan Teuns was on the podium in this race? I wouldn't even rate him in the top twenty best Belgian cyclists at the moment.

Matt Hayman won Roubaix! Do I need to say more..?

Also, the legends like Lampaert, Tjalingii, Moscon, Elmiger and Keukeleire was in the pointy end in recent years. Don't bother to argue with him, he makes no sense.

 

[El Pistolero]

Re: Re:

Just stating facts. Nobody peaks for the cobbled classics, everybody peaks for the Tour. Result = Sagan and Canc gets dropped by Astana cobbled classics train with cobbled classics GOAT Westra leading the charge after being in the break all day.

https://youtu.be/8lB-7K92nqM?t=1623

Lars Boom won. What is he again?

Boonen wasn't there and Sep Vanmarcke had a flat tire at the wrong moment. GVA was involved in a crash.

The only GT contender that put in an exceptional performance that day was Nibali and we all know he's the most versatile cyclist of the GT contenders (even podiumed in Milan-San Remo).

Also the Mur de Huy stage was an exact replica of Fleche Wallonne. This cobbled stage not so much (and there hasn't been a rainy Roubaix since 2002).

Really?

I would definitely say that there is less difference in cobbled stage vs Roubaix compared to other two. Also, the race was stopped for half an hour as well.

Boonen was bad in 2014, and I don't care about what happened with GVA and Vanmarcke, they should take a lesson or two from the Astana train on how to ride on cobbles on a rainy day.

There's only one km that matters in this joke of a race. If it finishes on Mur de Huy it's an exact replica.

And lol, even Dylan Teuns was on the podium in this race? I wouldn't even rate him in the top twenty best Belgian cyclists at the moment.

Matt Hayman won Roubaix! Do I need to say more..?

And Zaugg won Lombardia. What's your point exactly? Can't ignore the context of the race.

 

[the asian]

Why do you fall in to the trap of arguing with El Pisti. He's just trolling big time, riling you up and enjoying. Just ignore him.

 

[El Pistolero]

Re:

Why do you fall in to the trap of arguing with El Pisti. He's just trolling big time, riling you up and enjoying. Just ignore him.

How am I trolling?

The field in these races is weak. Gilbert podiumed FW in 2012 and he was in god awful shape back then.

Riders like Froome don't care for this race even though they could win it if they bothered to show up. It's clearly not worth the effort for them.

This is a god awful race, no matter who wins it. I said the same of the AGR before the course change this year. That's what FW needs. Anybody arguing otherwise is just a fanboy. Why would you only want an "exciting" final km if you can get an exciting finale that starts 40km from the finish-line? It has been evident for years now that finishing on these Murs has ruined the Ardennes classics. But the organizers simply don't learn.

The Muur van Geraardsbergen lies 100km from the finish-line and it still played a prominent role in the race. So it's not like we wouldn't see any action on the Mur de Huy if they put the finish-line somewhere else.

Both FW and LBL need a drastic course change to make the races more exciting again.

 

[Dekker_Tifosi]

Re:

Why do you fall in to the trap of arguing with El Pisti. He's just trolling big time, riling you up and enjoying. Just ignore him.

It's the best thing to do really.

Either he is trolling or living in his own reality. Either way, can't challenge his views, he'll never accept a different one then his own. It's like the Donald Trump of this board

 

[El Pistolero]

Re: Re:

Why do you fall in to the trap of arguing with El Pisti. He's just trolling big time, riling you up and enjoying. Just ignore him.

It's the best thing to do really.

Either he is trolling or living in his own reality. Either way, can't challenge his views, he'll never accept a different one then his own. It's like the Donald Trump of this board

You're the one that claimed the level of the riders in the Ardennes classics is much closer together than in the cobbled classics which is why we don't see long-range attacks succeed. I was the one who said that races become more exciting if they put the final hill 10-30 km from the finish-line. What happened in the AGR? Gilbert and Kwiatkowski blew everyone away on the hills. You were dead wrong and then you act like nothing happened after the AGR. :lol: You're full of *** as usual.

 

[the asian]

Re: Re:

Why do you fall in to the trap of arguing with El Pisti. He's just trolling big time, riling you up and enjoying. Just ignore him.

How am I trolling?

The field in these races is weak. Gilbert podiumed FW in 2012 and he was in god awful shape back then.

Riders like Froome don't care for this race even though they could win it if they bothered to show up. It's clearly not worth the effort for them.

This is a god awful race, no matter who wins it. I said the same of the AGR before the course change this year. That's what FW needs. Anybody arguing otherwise is just a fanboy. Why would you only want an "exciting" final km if you can get an exciting finale that starts 40km from the finish-line? It has been evident for years now that finishing on these Murs has ruined the Ardennes classics. But the organizers simply don't learn.

Both FW and LBL need a drastic course change to make the races more exciting again.

It's god awful race, but that doesn't mean you should belittle Valverde's achievements in FW.

And just because Froome beat him once in a Tour stage finishing on the Huy doesn't mean if Froome and Valverde turn up in peak form for FW, Froome will necessarily win.

Valverede is simply the strongest on these terrain, he has consistantly showed it, so even if you don't like Valverde, that's a fact.

 

[El Pistolero]

Re: Re:

Why do you fall in to the trap of arguing with El Pisti. He's just trolling big time, riling you up and enjoying. Just ignore him.

How am I trolling?

The field in these races is weak. Gilbert podiumed FW in 2012 and he was in god awful shape back then.

Riders like Froome don't care for this race even though they could win it if they bothered to show up. It's clearly not worth the effort for them.

This is a god awful race, no matter who wins it. I said the same of the AGR before the course change this year. That's what FW needs. Anybody arguing otherwise is just a fanboy. Why would you only want an "exciting" final km if you can get an exciting finale that starts 40km from the finish-line? It has been evident for years now that finishing on these Murs has ruined the Ardennes classics. But the organizers simply don't learn.

Both FW and LBL need a drastic course change to make the races more exciting again.

It's god awful race, but that doesn't mean you should belittle Valverde's achievements in FW.

And just because Froome beat him once in a Tour stage finishing on the Huy doesn't mean if Froome and Valverde turn up in peak form for FW, Froome win necessarily win.

Valverede is simply the strongest on these terrain, he has consistantly showed it, so even if you don't like Valverde, that's a fact.

How do you know if it's a fact if someone like Froome never bothers to ride this classic?

I'm not saying Froome would win all the time, but that stage in the Tour was very revealing if you ask me. It's not like Valverde was in bad shape, it's the only Tour he ever finished on the podium.

It's a fact that the Tour de France attracts the best riders in the world in the best possible shape however. You cannot say that of FW.

 

[Ramon Koran]

Re: Re:

Why do you fall in to the trap of arguing with El Pisti. He's just trolling big time, riling you up and enjoying. Just ignore him.

How am I trolling?

The field in these races is weak. Gilbert podiumed FW in 2012 and he was in god awful shape back then.

Riders like Froome don't care for this race even though they could win it if they bothered to show up. It's clearly not worth the effort for them.

This is a god awful race, no matter who wins it. I said the same of the AGR before the course change this year. That's what FW needs. Anybody arguing otherwise is just a fanboy. Why would you only want an "exciting" final km if you can get an exciting finale that starts 40km from the finish-line? It has been evident for years now that finishing on these Murs has ruined the Ardennes classics. But the organizers simply don't learn.

Both FW and LBL need a drastic course change to make the races more exciting again.

It's god awful race, but that doesn't mean you should belittle Valverde's achievements in FW.

And just because Froome beat him once in a Tour stage finishing on the Huy doesn't mean if Froome and Valverde turn up in peak form for FW, Froome win necessarily win.

Valverede is simply the strongest on these terrain, he has consistantly showed it, so even if you don't like Valverde, that's a fact.

How do you know if it's a fact if someone like Froome never bothers to ride this classic?

I'm not saying Froome would win all the time, but that stage in the Tour was very revealing if you ask me. It's not like Valverde was in bad shape, it's the only Tour he ever finished on the podium.

It's a fact that the Tour de France attracts the best riders in the world in the best possible shape however. You cannot say that of FW.

Valverde holds the record for huy, no doubt in top shape he would crush froome on those slopes.

 

[Red Rick]

I'm not sure who would have the record on Huy if we'd correct for celebrations. I'd think Gilbert

 

[El Pistolero]

Re: Re:

Why do you fall in to the trap of arguing with El Pisti. He's just trolling big time, riling you up and enjoying. Just ignore him.

How am I trolling?

The field in these races is weak. Gilbert podiumed FW in 2012 and he was in god awful shape back then.

Riders like Froome don't care for this race even though they could win it if they bothered to show up. It's clearly not worth the effort for them.

This is a god awful race, no matter who wins it. I said the same of the AGR before the course change this year. That's what FW needs. Anybody arguing otherwise is just a fanboy. Why would you only want an "exciting" final km if you can get an exciting finale that starts 40km from the finish-line? It has been evident for years now that finishing on these Murs has ruined the Ardennes classics. But the organizers simply don't learn.

Both FW and LBL need a drastic course change to make the races more exciting again.

It's god awful race, but that doesn't mean you should belittle Valverde's achievements in FW.

And just because Froome beat him once in a Tour stage finishing on the Huy doesn't mean if Froome and Valverde turn up in peak form for FW, Froome win necessarily win.

Valverede is simply the strongest on these terrain, he has consistantly showed it, so even if you don't like Valverde, that's a fact.

How do you know if it's a fact if someone like Froome never bothers to ride this classic?

I'm not saying Froome would win all the time, but that stage in the Tour was very revealing if you ask me. It's not like Valverde was in bad shape, it's the only Tour he ever finished on the podium.

It's a fact that the Tour de France attracts the best riders in the world in the best possible shape however. You cannot say that of FW.

Valverde holds the record for huy, no doubt in top shape he would crush froome on those slopes.

Obviously Froome won't hold the record if he never bothers to ride it...

And Gilbert was faster in 2011, he just started celebrating very early which slowed him down.

 

[Ramon Koran]

I think without celebration Gilbert and Valverde in 2014 would have been the same to about a second close. Point is froome has done it during the tour so in top shape and wasn't as fast despite going a long way out. No way he beats Valverde

 

[djconnel]

Re:

This is obviously a very different effort than an HC climb.

The race used to be fantastic, perhaps my favorite one-day, back when the climb was too steep for racing gears, and it was a total sufferfest grinding up the Mur. With the preponderance of medium-cage derailleurs that ended. It's just spin, spin, spin, all about W/kg and no longer about torque. The early laps no longer filter the field as much. It just comes down to the final hundred meters every year. And with Valv Piti winning every year, my interest wanes. That's on me: I'm not a fan, although he's obviously an extraordinary rider.

 

[jaylew]

Re: Re:

Why do you fall in to the trap of arguing with El Pisti. He's just trolling big time, riling you up and enjoying. Just ignore him.

It's the best thing to do really.

Either he is trolling or living in his own reality. Either way, can't challenge his views, he'll never accept a different one then his own. It's like the Donald Trump of this board

Post of the year.

 

[El Pistolero]

Re: Re:

Why do you fall in to the trap of arguing with El Pisti. He's just trolling big time, riling you up and enjoying. Just ignore him.

It's the best thing to do really.

Either he is trolling or living in his own reality. Either way, can't challenge his views, he'll never accept a different one then his own. It's like the Donald Trump of this board

Post of the year.

No, this is:

viewtopic.php?p=2094829#p2094829

 

[Savant12]

I'm glad with my decision of deciding to go to bed instead of watching the last 45km. I had hoped for an Amstel-style run-in but my head said it was going to be another Valverde stroll-to-the-line finish.

 

[Asero831]

No matter how explosive Purito, Evans and Froome are, Bala still hold the all-time record on Mur