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2017 Liège-Bastogne-Liège - April 23rd - 258k

Page 18 - Get up to date with the latest news, scores & standings from the Cycling News Community.
I just don't get cyclist nowadays. Only a few years ago there were big attacks in RaF basically every year and in the FW riders startet to attack early on the Mur. But it seems as if a few years ago everyone agreed to lose half of their brain capacity and ride completely passive until Saint Nicolas. From 2003 to 2013 Valverde has won 3 Ardennes races, and from 2014 to now 6. This guy isn't unbeatable in these kind of classics but when nobody even tries to beat him ofc he will end up on top over and over again. If one rider is clearly stronger than everyone else in cobbles classics everyone rides against this guy but here it seems like the teams don't care about the others and only ride their own race. Situations like PR 2016 would never happen in LBL because if the peloton is split and Dan Martin would be in front with a few teammates they would just let the peloton regroup. When will riders ever learn?
 
Re:

meat puppet said:
Valverde catching Martin knowing full well he was superior to him and then outsprinting him with such ease was just cruel to watch.

The peloton got the beating they deserved. Guess they will never learn.

In Valverde's current form he isn't going to be dropped anyway if he rides like he did. Almost as predictable as Fleche Wallone.
 
Re: Re:

Alexandre B. said:
frisenfruitig said:
Alexandre B. said:
The guy has been 10 meters in the wind for the whole race.

The same can be said about guys like Kwiat/Martin or Matthews though. Should he attack for no reason so you are happy?
Everyone was bitching about Gerrans in 2014. Everyone is praising Valverde today. There's almost no difference between both wins.

I don't blame Matthews for following in this particular race, but we're talking about freakin' Valverde here.
I think the difference is that Valverde was demonstrably the strongest rider in the race. It's difficult to criticize the strongest rider for winning the race. He would have been strong favourite however it was raced, and, in the end, was in complete control in the last km. Gerrans won pretty much only because everyone else was so tepid and passive in the finale, and because Martin crashed, it was the only way he could have won.

It's a bit disappointing and anti-climatic when a not very talented rider like Gerrans wins a really big race. When Valverde wins like this, it was still a really dull race and not much tension as soon as he began to close down Martin and showed he had good legs, but at least it feels like there was a worthy winner. And the race wasn't just decided by default because everyone else was so cowardly.
 
Re: Re:

Alexandre B. said:
frisenfruitig said:
Alexandre B. said:
The guy has been 10 meters in the wind for the whole race.

The same can be said about guys like Kwiat/Martin or Matthews though. Should he attack for no reason so you are happy?
Everyone was bitching about Gerrans in 2014. Everyone is praising Valverde today. There's almost no difference between both wins.

I don't blame Matthews for following in this particular race, but we're talking about freakin' Valverde here.

It's not even the same scenario. Valverde closed multiple gaps. He didn't just sprint.

Anyway, hot knife through butter. Again.

---

Multiple riders tried to attack multiple times, I don't get the Orica and Sky hate. Kreuziger and Henao were the two most active on the day, of course they didn't expect to beat VV on the line. Thats why they tried and tried before the final uphill. Did we even watch the same race?

The real problem is that there are too many riders in the last 30/40 kms, the race is not hard enough and eiher there are domestiques left to work or too many riders form too many teams nullifying each others' attacks and eventually playing it in favour of the likes of Valverde.
 
Gigs_98 said:
I just don't get cyclist nowadays. Only a few years ago there were big attacks in RaF basically every year and in the FW riders startet to attack early on the Mur. But it seems as if a few years ago everyone agreed to lose half of their brain capacity and ride completely passive until Saint Nicolas. From 2003 to 2013 Valverde has won 3 Ardennes races, and from 2014 to now 6. This guy isn't unbeatable in these kind of classics but when nobody even tries to beat him ofc he will end up on top over and over again. If one rider is clearly stronger than everyone else in cobbles classics everyone rides against this guy but here it seems like the teams don't care about the others and only ride their own race. Situations like PR 2016 would never happen in LBL because if the peloton is split and Dan Martin would be in front with a few teammates they would just let the peloton regroup. When will riders ever learn?
Probably when the value of their next contract isn't largely determined by their number of WT points.
 
Re: Re:

Alexandre B. said:
frisenfruitig said:
Alexandre B. said:
The guy has been 10 meters in the wind for the whole race.

The same can be said about guys like Kwiat/Martin or Matthews though. Should he attack for no reason so you are happy?
Everyone was bitching about Gerrans in 2014. Everyone is praising Valverde today. There's almost no difference between both wins.

I don't blame Matthews for following in this particular race, but we're talking about freakin' Valverde here.
Well, at least Valverde had to go solo to bridge to Martin, even if he was only in the wind for few hundred meters. :p

Everyone knew that that Martin move was the winning move and Bala was the only one strong enough to bridge so at least the strongest rider won.
 
Re:

KyoGrey said:
Lets not compare Gerrans with Valverde. Because the double rush acceleration that Valverde showcasted in 2015 and today against Moreno and Martin is unreachable for the australian. Please.

Yet Gerrans has out sprinted Sagan. If Gerrans won like that today the forum would have crashed. The only difference is that Gerrans is nearing retirement and age is affecting him while Valverde around the same age is getting better.
 
Re: Re:

BigMac said:
Alexandre B. said:
frisenfruitig said:
Alexandre B. said:
The guy has been 10 meters in the wind for the whole race.

The same can be said about guys like Kwiat/Martin or Matthews though. Should he attack for no reason so you are happy?
Everyone was bitching about Gerrans in 2014. Everyone is praising Valverde today. There's almost no difference between both wins.

I don't blame Matthews for following in this particular race, but we're talking about freakin' Valverde here.

It's not even the same scenario. Valverde closed multiple gaps. He didn't just sprint.

Anyway, hot knife through butter. Again.

---

Multiple riders tried to attack multiple times, I don't get the Orica and Sky hate. Kreuziger and Henao were the two most active on the day, of course they didn't expect to beat VV on the line. Thats why they tried and tried before the final uphill. Did we even watch the same race?

The real problem is that there are too many riders in the last 30/40 kms, the race is not hard enough and eiher there are domestiques left to work or too many riders form too many teams nullifying each others' attacks and eventually playing it in favour of the likes of Valverde.
I think Sky rode quite half heartedly with their attacks. If they really wanted to split the race apart and risk it all for the win, then Kwiatkowski or Sergio Henao should have gone all out on the Redoute. It nearly got them the win in Amstel (probably should have done) and would have been the only way to catch out Valverde or force him into making a split decision whether to chase himself or not.

In the end, they sent Seb Henao - which was never going to do anything. And then tried to get Sergio Henao away on later climbs, when the pace was too high. They weren't prepared to risk their main cards when it could have made a race-winning difference.
 
Re: Re:

movingtarget said:
KyoGrey said:
Lets not compare Gerrans with Valverde. Because the double rush acceleration that Valverde showcasted in 2015 and today against Moreno and Martin is unreachable for the australian. Please.

Yet Gerrans has out sprinted Sagan. If Gerrans won like that today the forum would have crashed. The only difference is that Gerrans is nearing retirement and age is affecting him while Valverde around the same age is getting better.
I think if Gerrans had won like that - closing down Martin solo in the last km, literally riding the peloton off his wheel, then flying past him and having plenty of time to ease up and celebrate without needing to sprint - then he would have gained a lot of respect around here.
 
Re: Re:

movingtarget said:
KyoGrey said:
Lets not compare Gerrans with Valverde. Because the double rush acceleration that Valverde showcasted in 2015 and today against Moreno and Martin is unreachable for the australian. Please.

Yet Gerrans has out sprinted Sagan. If Gerrans won like that today the forum would have crashed. The only difference is that Gerrans is nearing retirement and age is affecting him while Valverde around the same age is getting better.

But he would never have won today, not in a million years would he have beaten Valverde or even Martin. Yes, Gerrans has outsprinted Sagan. He also outsprinted Cancellara after wheelsucking him but he still isn't fit to tie his shoelaces.
 
Re: Re:

DFA123 said:
Alexandre B. said:
frisenfruitig said:
Alexandre B. said:
The guy has been 10 meters in the wind for the whole race.

The same can be said about guys like Kwiat/Martin or Matthews though. Should he attack for no reason so you are happy?
Everyone was bitching about Gerrans in 2014. Everyone is praising Valverde today. There's almost no difference between both wins.

I don't blame Matthews for following in this particular race, but we're talking about freakin' Valverde here.
I think the difference is that Valverde was demonstrably the strongest rider in the race. It's difficult to criticize the strongest rider for winning the race. He would have been strong favourite however it was raced, and, in the end, was in complete control in the last km. Gerrans won pretty much only because everyone else was so tepid and passive in the finale, and because Martin crashed, it was the only way he could have won.

It's a bit disappointing and anti-climatic when a not very talented rider like Gerrans wins a really big race. When Valverde wins like this, it was still a really dull race and not much tension as soon as he began to close down Martin and showed he had good legs, but at least it feels like there was a worthy winner. And the race wasn't just decided by default because everyone else was so cowardly.

A sprint by a rider who has done nothing beforehand is still a sprint doesn't matter whether you like the rider or not. It seems a worthy winner depends on the fans.
 
Re: Re:

DFA123 said:
movingtarget said:
KyoGrey said:
Lets not compare Gerrans with Valverde. Because the double rush acceleration that Valverde showcasted in 2015 and today against Moreno and Martin is unreachable for the australian. Please.

Yet Gerrans has out sprinted Sagan. If Gerrans won like that today the forum would have crashed. The only difference is that Gerrans is nearing retirement and age is affecting him while Valverde around the same age is getting better.
I think if Gerrans had won like that - closing down Martin solo in the last km, literally riding the peloton off his wheel, then flying past him and having plenty of time to ease up and celebrate without needing to sprint - then he would have gained a lot of respect around here.

Exactly, lol.

It's apples and oranges.
 
Re:

Dr. Watson said:
So Matthews is now turning into ardennes guy? Does anybody know what he wants to concentrate on?
I think he's going to be one of those unlucky riders who kind of falls between two stools. A bit like Dumoulin or maybe Thomas in different ways. Riders who can do everything really well, and can pick up some good but relatively minor wins, but don't really have any one big race (GT or classic) which is perfectly suited to their skills.
 
Re: Re:

movingtarget said:
DFA123 said:
Alexandre B. said:
frisenfruitig said:
Alexandre B. said:
The guy has been 10 meters in the wind for the whole race.

The same can be said about guys like Kwiat/Martin or Matthews though. Should he attack for no reason so you are happy?
Everyone was bitching about Gerrans in 2014. Everyone is praising Valverde today. There's almost no difference between both wins.

I don't blame Matthews for following in this particular race, but we're talking about freakin' Valverde here.
I think the difference is that Valverde was demonstrably the strongest rider in the race. It's difficult to criticize the strongest rider for winning the race. He would have been strong favourite however it was raced, and, in the end, was in complete control in the last km. Gerrans won pretty much only because everyone else was so tepid and passive in the finale, and because Martin crashed, it was the only way he could have won.

It's a bit disappointing and anti-climatic when a not very talented rider like Gerrans wins a really big race. When Valverde wins like this, it was still a really dull race and not much tension as soon as he began to close down Martin and showed he had good legs, but at least it feels like there was a worthy winner. And the race wasn't just decided by default because everyone else was so cowardly.

A sprint by a rider who has done nothing beforehand is still a sprint doesn't matter whether you like the rider or not. It seems a worthy winner depends on the fans.
Today's win wasn't a sprint. It didn't need to be, because Valverde was so much stronger than everyone else.