2019 Giro d'Italia Stage 13: Pinerolo - Lago Serrù 196 km

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Re: Re:

jaylew said:
luckyboy said:
Roglic and Nibali never gave 100% here

Good gains for guys like Zakarin and Mollema but they won't get that from the breakaway every day. Landa and the big two still look strongest.
Maybe. I don't know. I think Nibali and Roglic were more on the limit than that. Not sure about Mollema but I think Zakarin would have been somewhere in the Carapaz/Majka/NIbali/Roglic vicinity if he hadn't been in the break. And Carapaz and Majka look to be at least as strong as Roglic and Nibali. I'd add Lopez as well - he's a bit harder to judge because of how his day went with the mechanical.

Iow, I don't at all think that Nibali and Roglic look like the clear strongest at this point but time will tell.
Lopez was bad. Mechanical or not, Kangert, Madouas and Polanc finished within 20 seconds of him.
 
Re: Re:

Pirazziattacks said:
yetiyeti said:
i think Roglic and Nibali are playing this right - the competition has proven they are likely to have bad days that cost them real time and the competition had to go deep to get these gains today. Tomorrow we'll see if it cost them. Plus most of these guys can't touch Roglic or Nibali in a TT, especially with the race on the line.
Roglic I can understand, Nibali not so much. He's almost on par with Carapaz now and certainly won't be counting on the final TT to make the difference.

But Nibali wants to win...not second or third

And to win he has to beat one man imo...Roglic ...its very simple really

Today Bahrain chased with Pozzo but Nibali was not going to chase and bring Roglic to the line after Pozzo pulled over ? Why do that ...his gap to Roglic he wants to close

Its a risky strategy but its the one if you want to win

This race will be won next weekend
 
May 8, 2013
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Re: Re:

Pirazziattacks said:
yetiyeti said:
i think Roglic and Nibali are playing this right - the competition has proven they are likely to have bad days that cost them real time and the competition had to go deep to get these gains today. Tomorrow we'll see if it cost them. Plus most of these guys can't touch Roglic or Nibali in a TT, especially with the race on the line.
Roglic I can understand, Nibali not so much. He's almost on par with Carapaz now and certainly won't be counting on the final TT to make the difference.
I agree that it is more clearly the right strategy for Roglic than for Nibali. Nibali is consistently stronger than Carapez in TT's though, even if it isn't as big an advantage for him as it is for Roglic. I think Nibali is playing the game of waiting for a bad day from a competitor and that's won grand tours for him before. I'm not a big fan of Nibali, but it's hard to fault his tactics given how many races he's won with tactics.
 
Sep 2, 2010
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Re:

Dekker_Tifosi said:
Well what a stage that was!
Landa, Zak, Carapaz back in the game

But to me, sorry Nibali fans, don't shoot me, but I think he **** himself. Roglic is totally fine with this situation. It wasn't up to him to put hard pace. He has the TT and tries to save as much as possible for the 3rd week. If Nibali wanted to really hurt him he should've tried to lose him or go with Majka/Carapaz. Tbh I think Roglic is not worried about Landa or Carapaz etc
I think Nibali realises that Roglic is strong and the only way he can beat him is if he is forced to work to keep Majka, Landa and co in check. And the only way that happens is if those guys pull back time on him like today. Also, I agree. I don't think is he particularly worried about Landa and Carapaz, but I don't think he has continue to let them just ride away now though either
 
Re: Re:

yetiyeti said:
Pirazziattacks said:
yetiyeti said:
i think Roglic and Nibali are playing this right - the competition has proven they are likely to have bad days that cost them real time and the competition had to go deep to get these gains today. Tomorrow we'll see if it cost them. Plus most of these guys can't touch Roglic or Nibali in a TT, especially with the race on the line.
Roglic I can understand, Nibali not so much. He's almost on par with Carapaz now and certainly won't be counting on the final TT to make the difference.
I agree that it is more clearly the right strategy for Roglic than for Nibali. Nibali is consistently stronger than Carapez in TT's though, even if it isn't as big an advantage for him as it is for Roglic. I think Nibali is playing the game of waiting for a bad day from a competitor and that's won grand tours for him before. I'm not a big fan of Nibali, but it's hard to fault his tactics given how many races he's won with tactics.
How many races has he won with tactics?
 
Re:

Dekker_Tifosi said:
Well what a stage that was!
Landa, Zak, Carapaz back in the game

But to me, sorry Nibali fans, don't shoot me, but I think he **** himself. Roglic is totally fine with this situation. It wasn't up to him to put hard pace. He has the TT and tries to save as much as possible for the 3rd week. If Nibali wanted to really hurt him he should've tried to lose him or go with Majka/Carapaz. Tbh I think Roglic is not worried about Landa or Carapaz etc
Nibali and Roglic had some time up their sleeve. Landa is still behind. Zakarin could lose 3 minutes tomorrow, you never know with him. I think they rode smart races considering what is to come. If Nibali felt that good he would have attacked Roglic. Michelton are done by the looks of things. Yates bad TT doesn't just look like a bad day, he doesn't have the form.
 
Re:

Dekker_Tifosi said:
Well what a stage that was!
Landa, Zak, Carapaz back in the game

But to me, sorry Nibali fans, don't shoot me, but I think he **** himself. Roglic is totally fine with this situation. It wasn't up to him to put hard pace. He has the TT and tries to save as much as possible for the 3rd week. If Nibali wanted to really hurt him he should've tried to lose him or go with Majka/Carapaz. Tbh I think Roglic is not worried about Landa or Carapaz etc
In the race he measures his opponents and I guess after all these years he knows when one looks dead or fresh so what's he gonna do? Close the gap to Carapaz, Roglic looks good he follows, there's a long way to the top. Roglic looks bad he steps on it. We'll never know if Nibs himself wasn't quite good today and it's a great characteristic to hide it. Now you have Majka/Carapaz/Sputnik around. Roglic has to take his eyes off Nibali and put some work to close himself Carapaz next time so Nibs can follow and counter. I don't think Roglic is fine with the situation, Movistar can do a one-two on him as soon as tomorrow.
 
Re: Re:

roundabout said:
yetiyeti said:
Pirazziattacks said:
yetiyeti said:
i think Roglic and Nibali are playing this right - the competition has proven they are likely to have bad days that cost them real time and the competition had to go deep to get these gains today. Tomorrow we'll see if it cost them. Plus most of these guys can't touch Roglic or Nibali in a TT, especially with the race on the line.
Roglic I can understand, Nibali not so much. He's almost on par with Carapaz now and certainly won't be counting on the final TT to make the difference.
I agree that it is more clearly the right strategy for Roglic than for Nibali. Nibali is consistently stronger than Carapez in TT's though, even if it isn't as big an advantage for him as it is for Roglic. I think Nibali is playing the game of waiting for a bad day from a competitor and that's won grand tours for him before. I'm not a big fan of Nibali, but it's hard to fault his tactics given how many races he's won with tactics.
How many races has he won with tactics?
Maybe 2016 Giro?
But I agree he's tactically overrated, he rides a lot on instincts.
 
Usually when Nibali goes with a huge gear means he isn't in top form.
But then he followed a couple of very hard Roglic's accelerations, and Roglic himself wasn't looking good when Nibali did go.
So maybe as I've said before, neither of them is the best climber in the race.
Carapaz looked the best of the all tbh and Zakarin as well, rest all looked dead at the end.
Tomorrow another very hard day...
 
Fantastic stage. Beautiful climbs and many great performances especially from Zakarin, Mollema, Landa, Carapaz, Sivakov, Ciccone and Polanc. Roglič and Nibali were watching each other but they play a dangerous game. The Movistar duo looks very strong. Landa and Carapaz are the strongest uphill right now IMO. We'll see tomorrow who will pay for the efforts today. The last climb Colle San Carlo is a true monster. And then there's Sunday with Ghisallo, Sormano and Civiglio :eek:

Great fight to remain in Rosa by Polanc. This young man fights hard every stage and won't give up. I think in the end he can still do a top10.
Sorry for what happened to Lopez. I'm surprised he lost this much time in the end, though. Probably went in red trying to quickly close the gap to Roglič/Nibali.

I'm a little surprised by Yates' poor showing but then again I had a feeling he is not as strong as many believed he was.
 
Impressed with Madouas in such a hard stage, better than Yates, Sosa and Carthy among others. I'm curious to see if he can hold on in the next mountain stages.

Chavito lost 21 minutes in the end. I guess he's not exactly back.
 
Re: Re:

roundabout said:
jaylew said:
luckyboy said:
Roglic and Nibali never gave 100% here

Good gains for guys like Zakarin and Mollema but they won't get that from the breakaway every day. Landa and the big two still look strongest.
Maybe. I don't know. I think Nibali and Roglic were more on the limit than that. Not sure about Mollema but I think Zakarin would have been somewhere in the Carapaz/Majka/NIbali/Roglic vicinity if he hadn't been in the break. And Carapaz and Majka look to be at least as strong as Roglic and Nibali. I'd add Lopez as well - he's a bit harder to judge because of how his day went with the mechanical.

Iow, I don't at all think that Nibali and Roglic look like the clear strongest at this point but time will tell.
Lopez was bad. Mechanical or not, Kangert, Madouas and Polanc finished within 20 seconds of him.
I don't think he was as bad as it seemed. I think there's a decent chance he'd have been with Nibali and Roglic if not for the mechanical.
 
Here's an (in my weird opinion) rather funny commentator moment.

Bay: What do you think, Brian? Is Roglic in trouble?
Roglic: *Attacks*

That's a pretty good way to answer a question you don't even know has been asked - and wouldn't understand anyway.
 
Re:

HelloDolly said:
Landa finish just 18 seconds in front of Carapaz ...if he has waited fro last 6 km he probably would have got more time ...just saying

Its heads that win bike races not just legs
Cant really use that kind of logic tbh. It also helped Carapaz that he could sit on wheels all the climb and only go with 1-2 km to go or whatever. Today was really textbook tactics and maybe its reversed tomorrow with Carapaz attacking or something. Its a dynamic duo and they really use to need to use it.
 
Re: Re:

Valv.Piti said:
HelloDolly said:
Landa finish just 18 seconds in front of Carapaz ...if he has waited fro last 6 km he probably would have got more time ...just saying

Its heads that win bike races not just legs
Cant really use that kind of logic tbh. It also helped Carapaz that he could sit on wheels all the climb and only go with 1-2 km to go or whatever. Today was really textbook tactics and maybe its reversed tomorrow with Carapaz attacking or something. Its a dynamic duo and they really use to need to use it.
Yup, I agree with Valv Piti. Both looks really strong and thats good.
 
Re:

HelloDolly said:
Landa finish just 18 seconds in front of Carapaz ...if he has waited fro last 6 km he probably would have got more time ...just saying

Its heads that win bike races not just legs
If Landa waits for the last 6 kilometers the front group probably stays together and nobody gains anything close to what Landa gained.

Edit: And yes to the posts about Jungels. Gotta say, I'm kinda happy that decision seems to backfire.
 
Re: Re:

jaylew said:
roundabout said:
jaylew said:
luckyboy said:
Roglic and Nibali never gave 100% here

Good gains for guys like Zakarin and Mollema but they won't get that from the breakaway every day. Landa and the big two still look strongest.
Maybe. I don't know. I think Nibali and Roglic were more on the limit than that. Not sure about Mollema but I think Zakarin would have been somewhere in the Carapaz/Majka/NIbali/Roglic vicinity if he hadn't been in the break. And Carapaz and Majka look to be at least as strong as Roglic and Nibali. I'd add Lopez as well - he's a bit harder to judge because of how his day went with the mechanical.

Iow, I don't at all think that Nibali and Roglic look like the clear strongest at this point but time will tell.
Lopez was bad. Mechanical or not, Kangert, Madouas and Polanc finished within 20 seconds of him.
I don't think he was as bad as it seemed. I think there's a decent chance he'd have been with Nibali and Roglic if not for the mechanical.
You never know how legs react when you have to stop like that. Cramps can come real quickly for example. We’ll never know though
 

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