97th Liège-Bastogne-Liège 2011

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Feb 22, 2011
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Christian said:
Shifting the goalposts, are we?

Alright then, I'll play along even though I've told you this before - it was the winning move and they knew it (Rodriguez didn't). Whether the order was Schleck-Schleck-Gilbert or Schleck-Gilbert-Schleck at the moment of the attack is irrelevant since there was no sizeable gap
I disagree, if Frank had let Gilbert get back on Andy's wheel first and followed his wheel...he would have had the chance to attack Gilbert there and then..
 
Feb 20, 2011
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greatking88 said:
They could have tried there at least.. ;)
IMHO it would not have been the best place to try; even if Gilbert COULD have been gapped, it's work that would have had to have been done in degrees. Isolate him on Roche aux Faucons, then (in an utterly improbable parallel universe) attack on St Nicolas, one of the brothers gets away and the other is glued to Phil's wheel.

Was never going to happen, but even if it was imo the whole job wasn't doable in the first skirmish. Just my .02.
 
Feb 22, 2011
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beer_thirty said:
IMHO it would not have been the best place to try; even if Gilbert COULD have been gapped, it's work that would have had to have been done in degrees. Isolate him on Roche aux Faucons, then (in an utterly improbable parallel universe) attack on St Nicolas, one of the brothers gets away and the other is glued to Phil's wheel.

Was never going to happen, but even if it was imo the whole job wasn't doable in the first skirmish. Just my .02.
Yeah I agree but maybe the first skirmish could have weakened Gilbert physically and mentally(seeing both brothers attack) but hey its just a thought, it didnt happen so we'll never know.. :)
 
Funny that this morning I saw the re-run showed by Versus and Phil, Bob and Paul were talking about the tactics to dislodge PG. LOL. Phil said that it would be easier to move the Eiffel Tower than to any of the Schlecks beat him on the sprint. Then the other two kept saying about the 1-2 punch from the Schlecks (that never came) if they wanted to win. Finally Bob made a comment and laughed about how the Schlecks blew their tactics.
 
auscyclefan94 said:
Epic fail is a little strong, don't you think? I think it is a fair to say you didn't rate them initially. Are you not going to 'have a go' at some other teams who didn't live up to their potential?

btw, the 'tired' excuse doesn't rub with me. Everyone is tired after 260km of hard racing.
Depends on how you view this. I'm sure you, of all posters, remember it:

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/quinziato-bmc-the-team-to-beat-in-2011-classics
Quinziato told Cyclingnews that, with his arrival and also the signing of Belgian finisseur Greg Van Avermaet from Omega Pharma Lotto, BMC's line-up will be the most formidable in the peloton at next year's cobbled Classics. "If you add us two to Marcus Burghardt, Karsten Kroon, George Hincapie and Alessandro Ballan, I think that, collectively, we're stronger than anyone," he said.
Pretty strong hype there and around here, in March
Yet, for podium spots, they were bettered by OPL, LEOTARD, HTC, Saxo, Quick Step, Garmin, Rabo, Sky, Katusha and even Euskaltel!

Still, if you think a few top 10 finishes for the world's strongest classics squad is sufficient.

Me? I still go with an analysis that was pointed out, back in March.
Plenty of 5-10 spot potential, but no real winner.
In which case, I was not right to overrate them.
For those who did, it must equal a fail, no?
 
Jan 18, 2010
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A 210 K race would of brought others into it but 255 K separates the men from the boys.

Gilbert owned everybody and the way he made Bjorn Leukemans look like a sportiff rider in Brabantse Pijl was a foreboding message, so not that surprising he locked out the remaining races.

The guy is quality.
 
roundabout said:
what have Euskaltel and Katusha got to do with Quinziato talking about cobbled classics team strength?

Or THR for that matter as Scheldeprijs is simply a sprinters race with a few cobbles
I'm not sure of the point you are trying to make.
Maybe you missed the Milan-San Remo result.
 
Mellow Velo said:
I'm not sure of the point you are trying to make.
Maybe you missed the Milan-San Remo result.
I am guessing from the editorial part of the quote you posted that Quinziato was talking about cobbled classics, not Ardennes or Sanremo.

BMC probably didn't perform as well as they wanted but they were certainly better than Katusha, Euskaltel or THR in the races Quinziato was talking about.

Or simply put, you've made your point, no need to pound BMC further into the ground with something that didn't happen. ;)
 
Captain_Cavman said:
It was a truly amazing performance, one that will live in the memory for a long time.

It was like watching someone try to kill a fish by drowning it.
Seems like you're in the wrong place. If you prefer boring tactics over animation, I wonder why you watched the race instead of the WC snooker...
 
Nov 30, 2010
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Flamin said:
Seems like you're in the wrong place. If you prefer boring tactics over animation, I wonder why you watched the race instead of the WC snooker...
Well I did quite well for boring tactical races at Milan San Remo, the Ronde and Roubaix. Those must have been tedious beyond belief for you; you have my deepest sympathy.
 
Mar 8, 2010
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greatking88 said:
They could have tried there at least.. ;)
So that you then could have laughed and cried about a laughable and useless effort to attack ? :D
That would have looked even more powerless and useless, than the "sprint".

They were dead after giving all, and also demoralized and in pain, when they saw Gilbert following them, and pedalling with total easyness, even up "their" climbs and when leading group, while even nearly dropping them and putting them deep into red zone there.
Seeing Gilbert's pedalling, especially on the hills, and after such a long distance, was one of the most impressive showings of superior strength, that I ever saw. That was somehow like seeing someone walking over water. Not even talking about the "sprint".
What I (we) could actually just enjoy (if you noticed it), was at the same time a strong punch right into the brother's face - because they saw it too.

Gilbert just played with them - like he played with all the others and in other races. It was clear since AGR, and even clearer after FW, that no one can beat this guy - whatever they may try by giving 100%.
And it is somehow strange (but not really) to see many people here blaming the Schlecks for "not attacking" and beeing stupid, when they actually took responsibility, attacked and did their best against a total superior Flip.

While it is also important to mention, that Schlecks have other important races they have to care about and cannot totally focus 100%, peak and plan like Gilbert.

After L-B-L, you can bash and question many, many other favorites - but not the Schlecks who got 2nd 3th, only beaten by TGPG.
 
People need to stop repeating that the Schlecks were dead. Andy was tired, but not dead. Fränk wasn't even dropped by Gilbert. Many riders, much less talented than the Schlecks, have attacked when in a breakaway with a faster rider throughout history. It's the thing to do. It's like the most basic tactic there is.
 
Mar 18, 2009
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I agree with what Joe Lindsey had to say here<---

My reaction to Liege this year is a bit mixed. The Schlecks were right in saying afterward that Gilbert was unbeatable. But the anticlimactic finale seems to indicate that they decided this as far back as the Saint Nicolas. Risk aversion may work to win a stage race, but it won’t get you a victory in a monument.
 
Feb 22, 2011
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Cobblestoned said:
So that you then could have laughed and cried about a laughable and useless effort to attack ? :D
That would have looked even more powerless and useless, than the "sprint".

They were dead after giving all, and also demoralized and in pain, when they saw Gilbert following them, and pedalling with total easyness, even up "their" climbs and when leading group, while even nearly dropping them and putting them deep into red zone there.
Seeing Gilbert's pedalling, especially on the hills, and after such a long distance, was one of the most impressive showings of superior strength, that I ever saw. That was somehow like seeing someone walking over water. Not even talking about the "sprint".
What I (we) could actually just enjoy (if you noticed it), was at the same time a strong punch right into the brother's face - because they saw it too.

Gilbert just played with them - like he played with all the others and in other races. It was clear since AGR, and even clearer after FW, that no one can beat this guy - whatever they may try by giving 100%.
And it is somehow strange (but not really) to see many people here blaming the Schlecks for "not attacking" and beeing stupid, when they actually took responsibility, attacked and did their best against a total superior Flip.

While it is also important to mention, that Schlecks have other important races they have to care about and cannot totally focus 100%, peak and plan like Gilbert.

After L-B-L, you can bash and question many, many other favorites - but not the Schlecks who got 2nd 3th, only beaten by TGPG.
It was just a thought, I wasn't bashing the Schlecks, fair play they achieved a great result, just would have been fun to see the Schlecks 1-2 attack.. :D
 
Mar 13, 2009
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hrotha said:
People need to stop repeating that the Schlecks were dead. Andy was tired, but not dead. Fränk wasn't even dropped by Gilbert. Many riders, much less talented than the Schlecks, have attacked when in a breakaway with a faster rider throughout history. It's the thing to do. It's like the most basic tactic there is.
Please don't take a statement from a single user and turn it into a generalization. Cobblestoned said they were dead. If you don't agree with him that's fine but don't make it sound like everyone is saying that.

Also I can't believe you're comparing this specific situation with any other "breakaway with a faster rider throughout history". But I guess that spares you from coming up with a precise example.

Finally, in this case (I don't know how it went in all the other breakaways "throughout history"), applying "the most basic tactic there is" would have resulted in getting 10th and 17th place.
 
Christian said:
Please don't take a statement from a single user and turn it into a generalization. Cobblestoned said they were dead. If you don't agree with him that's fine but don't make it sound like everyone is saying that.

Also I can't believe you're comparing this specific situation with any other "breakaway with a faster rider throughout history". But I guess that spares you from coming up with a precise example.

Finally, in this case (I don't know how it went in all the other breakaways "throughout history"), applying "the most basic tactic there is" would have resulted in getting 10th and 17th place.
Nonsense. With 5 km to go, it was clear they weren't going to get caught.

How's this for an example: Cédric Vasseur in the yellow jersey.
 
Jul 18, 2010
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greatking88 said:
But answer me why would Frank follow Andy's attack instead of waiting to see if Gilbert followed it first? Im not saying the Schlecks are morons, just dont understand that move..
That is the million dollar question. Did they think they were about to pull a semi Mapei/Gewiss? I've seen this done before by other teams and always found it a bit bizarre but in this case with the current most dominant rider, Gilbert, sitting in the same group of riders, one would think that if you have 2 strong riders that they would attempt to work over that one dominant rider.
One attacks to see if they can draw out the dominant rider or see if he sits in to wait for someone else to respond. In this case LeOpard gave Gilbert no choice. Technically they gave him an avenue to escape from the rest of the contenders without having to do it on his own. Gilbert had the Schlecks to escort him to a sprint finish.
 
Mar 13, 2009
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hrotha said:
Nonsense. With 5 km to go, it was clear they weren't going to get caught.

How's this for an example: Cédric Vasseur in the yellow jersey.
I see: all breakaways are alike because they are improbable. Following the same logic the Giro d'Italia and the Eneco Tour are the same because they are both bike races. But seriously: when you find an example of two climbers outsmarting a puncheur in the form of his life on the flat, let me know. Apples and oranges.

But all sillyness aside, I believe it is quite probable that they would have blown up after their hypothetical attack, and then been swallowed by the peloton. Bear in mind the next group finished only 24 seconds back, and 5 km is a loooong way to go, especially in Ans, and especially after 250 brutal km
 
Jul 18, 2010
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AntonioRossi said:
Does anyone have a decent 15-30 minute recap video of the race?
I found several french links, but does anyone have Dutch/English links?
Versus decided to screw cycling over again, so f*ck them
Versus programmers should be drawn and quartered. Almost an hour of action preempted for the NBA's development league's final. Additionally they initially had scheduled to show Fleche Wallone (I programmed my receiver to record it) and it suddenly disappeared completely from their schedule!
 
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