Anybody believe Lance is clean?

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Mar 10, 2009
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SC1990 said:
It's a Bradley Wiggins quote on the type of people who are on cycling forums. The 'think they know everything' bit is very true, mind that happens on forums everywhere.
I see now. :)
 
Jun 16, 2009
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SC1990 said:
It's a Bradley Wiggins quote on the type of people who are on cycling forums. The 'think they know everything' bit is very true, mind that happens on forums everywhere.
what Brad means by that is that the riders can't make enemies of the most powerful people in the sport. There are rules that must be followed. It's one thing being "moral" in an internet forum with an income unrelated to cycling, but another thing spitting in the soup.

Brad doesn't mean that anyone who talks about doping on an internet forum is more ignorant than the riders. Some of the guys here are riders (I myself am ex Euro elite) and plenty of posts are remarkably well informed. Very few riders know as much as some of the guys here.
 
Oct 16, 2010
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SC1990 said:
It's a Bradley Wiggins quote on the type of people who are on cycling forums. The 'think they know everything' bit is very true, mind that happens on forums everywhere.
You could learn alot from turtles.

"One often meets his destiny on the road he takes to avoid it", a wise turtle once said.

I'm speculating that it is your destiny to discover santaclaus doesn't exist. You're now still preferring to sit on his lap, but you will end up pulling his beard.
just speculating here.
 
May 22, 2009
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sniper said:
You could learn alot from turtles.

"One often meets his destiny on the road he takes to avoid it", a wise turtle once said.

I'm speculating that it is your destiny to discover santaclaus doesn't exist. You're now still preferring to sit on his lap, but you will end up pulling his beard.
just speculating here.
Sorry, sorry, I attempt to make a not paritcularly humourous comment based on a riders quote, and you get all philosophical about me being up in the clouds? Relevance? Maybe I'm just unaware of this, but it doesnt seem particullarly related to anything? Or is it just more ':O he said innocent until proven guilty he must be a Lance lover, DESTROY' mentality?
 
Oct 16, 2010
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SC1990 said:
Sorry, sorry, I attempt to make a not paritcularly humourous comment based on a riders quote, and you get all philosophical about me being up in the clouds? Relevance? Maybe I'm just unaware of this, but it doesnt seem particullarly related to anything? Or is it just more ':O he said innocent until proven guilty he must be a Lance lover, DESTROY' mentality?
ok. I do apologize. that was inappropriate, and probably not as funny as I'd intended it to be
I'm just getting cynical, because, well, the writing's on the wall as clear as it ever was, and still, there are people unwilling (or, in the worse case, unable) to do the math.
but i'll delete my previous post and appreciate your reply.
 
Mar 10, 2009
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SC1990 said:
Sorry, sorry, I attempt to make a not paritcularly humourous comment based on a riders quote, and you get all philosophical about me being up in the clouds? Relevance? Maybe I'm just unaware of this, but it doesnt seem particullarly related to anything? Or is it just more ':O he said innocent until proven guilty he must be a Lance lover, DESTROY' mentality?
I think the harsh reaction of many on here is probably down to the fact that a few years ago Brad was one of the only riders in the pro peloton who had the balls to speak out against the dopers. For that reason he was greatly admired by those of us who were tired of the way our sport was being run and ruined. People feel (whether rightly or wrongly) a little betrayed when he suddenly drops vitriol in favour of diplomacy. Truth is Brad's position in the peloton has changed and his voice has changed accordingly.
 
Eric8-A said:
Anybody? It seems like everybody thinks he doped. This is for past and present day. Also throw in the US Postal claims that Floyd has made. Was the team clean?
Absolutely NOT. Nor was the team clean. I think also his re-writing the history books for a 6th and 7th win is why we are here today. Indurain won 5 years in row and no one says boo about him. But a man of his size winning in the manner he did, wasn't clean either. Don't be fooled. But again, he stopped at 5 wins. If Lance stopped at 5 tour wins I think the pressure would have been off and he would have had a lot more fans dancing around in their yellow bands. But I honestly think it was his greed for that 6th and 7th title and how he managed them, is what causes such uproar.
 
May 26, 2010
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the problem with Wiggo is that when LA retired he shouted about doping. When LA comeback 1.0 he shut up shop. Now he spouts omerta.

That is a problem, for a guy who said he wanted a clean sport. Now is the time for riders to decry the doping, corruption in the uci, bad directour sportifs, the bad influence that someone like armstrong had on the sport when it had the chance to go clean after 98

it might not be realistic but when you wanted a clean sport in 2007 and have changed tack. keep yer big gob shut or face the wrath of people who like the sport.
 
Jun 16, 2009
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masking_agent said:
Absolutely NOT. Nor was the team clean. I think also his re-writing the history books for a 6th and 7th win is why we are here today. Indurain won 5 years in row and no one says boo about him. But a man of his size winning in the manner he did, wasn't clean either. Don't be fooled. But again, he stopped at 5 wins. If Lance stopped at 5 tour wins I think the pressure would have been off and he would have had a lot more fans dancing around in their yellow bands. But I honestly think it was his greed for that 6th and 7th title and how he managed them, is what causes such uproar.
Also if he had just been a rider doing his job he would have been ok.

But he wanted to own cycling and adapt it to his own enrichment and advancement, and also becomne a celebrity personality.

As his personality is sociopathic, he rubbed a lot of people up the wrong way, and in some cases couldn't resist trying to destroy people out of pride, temper, and the need to control.

A nicer guy could have probably gotten away with what Lance tried to achieve. And the irony is that much of his ambition depended on people believing he was actually a nice guy.

Rather than a friendless sociopath.
 
Dec 30, 2010
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A lot of SUCKERS out there.

I just read an article on CBS' (American network) website.
http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-31751_162-20028841-10391697.html#addcomm

The article basically takes the "same old unsubstantiated accusations" tack at the new revelations against Armstrong.



None of SI's leaked evidence is particularly strong, however.

Included in their key findings are:

- Armstrong had "access" to a drug that boosts the blood's oxygen-carrying capacity in the 1990s called "HemAssist." He has since denied every taking it and never publicly tested positive for it.

- "Lance had a bag of drugs and s---," said former teammate and admitted doper Floyd Landis, when talking about being stopped by customs in St. Moritz in 2003. Agents allegedly found syringes and drugs with labels written in Spanish. Landis claims Armstrong then asked a member of his traveling crew to convince customs "agents that the drugs were vitamins and that the syringes were for vitamin injections." Armstrong has since denied this happened.

- Armstrong's testosterone-epitestosterone ratio was reported to be higher than normal on three occasions between 1993 and 1996, although the evidence for this is spurious. The lab that reported the higher levels has long since dismissed the tests, and all attempts at unearthing them have fallen flat.

- Another former teammate who has admitted taking PEDs said Armstrong was "the instigator" in 1995 when it came to his cycling team using the banned blood booster EPO. Again, Armstrong denies the accusation and has not tested positive for EPO during his career.



As well, the "comments" are decidedly pro-Armstrong :



by NinthSt78 January 19, 2011 4:09 AM EST
People are jealous of the statue on the Canadian side of the border and hurling gossip because they were foolish enough to drink curdled milk.
Reply to this comment



by rightbehind January 19, 2011 12:34 AM EST
I think Lance Armstrong is a straight shooter. The guy just has what is takes to be a successful racer.
Reply to this comment



by mecanik-2009 January 18, 2011 9:56 PM EST
This guy is the most tested most watched and most investigated guy in sports. If this guy had so much as stepped off the curb before the light turned he would have been caught. I think the guy is a hero. He's special in some way and everyone is jealous.



So Apparently, there are a significant number of Americans that still believe the lie.
 
Jun 16, 2009
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Andynonomous said:
As well, the "comments" are decidedly pro-Armstrong :



by NinthSt78 January 19, 2011 4:09 AM EST
People are jealous of the statue on the Canadian side of the border and hurling gossip because they were foolish enough to drink curdled milk.
Reply to this comment



by rightbehind January 19, 2011 12:34 AM EST
I think Lance Armstrong is a straight shooter. The guy just has what is takes to be a successful racer.
Reply to this comment



by mecanik-2009 January 18, 2011 9:56 PM EST
This guy is the most tested most watched and most investigated guy in sports. If this guy had so much as stepped off the curb before the light turned he would have been caught. I think the guy is a hero. He's special in some way and everyone is jealous.



So Apparently, there are a significant number of Americans that still believe the lie.
I have never read a pro Lance reader comment that doesn't scream out "I know NOTHING about cycling" louder than a Motorhead concert.

If i see the "most tested athlete ever" again today I am going to scream even louder.
 
May 15, 2010
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Ever see that movie Ground Hog Day with Bill Murray?
Well, this forum is just like that. Come back a year later, and its like nothing has changed. Its like an HP Lovecraft novel where the souls of the members get sucked in and trapped in a never ending world of LA doping threads.
Pretty eerie man...
 
Dec 30, 2010
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Mach Schnell said:
Ever see that movie Ground Hog Day with Bill Murray?
Well, this forum is just like that. Come back a year later, and its like nothing has changed. Its like an HP Lovecraft novel where the souls of the members get sucked in and trapped in a never ending world of LA doping threads.
Pretty eerie man...

I disagree.

Because things like this unravel slowly, it may look like nothing has changed.

It took years to get the truth on Barry Bonds, Roger Clemens, Marion Jones,.... Eventually, the truth did come out (only because of persistent investigations however). Lance IS being thoroughly investigated now.
 
Jun 12, 2010
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noomster said:
Its mainly the newbies who think that Lance is clean ...

... does anyone also think that he rides a white horse, wears shinning armour, plants trees to combat global warming, and drives a Prius?
:D Have you been privy to the contents of Flicker and Polish`s dreams?...
described suspiciously accuritly I reckon! :D
 
May 26, 2010
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Mach Schnell said:
Ever see that movie Ground Hog Day with Bill Murray?
Well, this forum is just like that. Come back a year later, and its like nothing has changed. Its like an HP Lovecraft novel where the souls of the members get sucked in and trapped in a never ending world of LA doping threads.
Pretty eerie man...
this forum for fanboys is like chinese water torture as the drip drip drip drip drip of the truths started coming out and they will start screaming they can take no more.....:D

imagine being in LA's 'saddle' reading this all the time as the jigsaw pieces keep getting put together in here, sometimes he laughs at the wide of the mark comments but lately i imagine his anger is rising at how the clinic is getting very good at putting the complete picture together:D
 
Apr 9, 2009
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hrotha said:
Cut the newbies some slack. Nobody gets into the PEDs side of things before getting into cycling, with the exception of LA.
Ha ha ha ha! Nice, you just made me laugh and choke on my coffee this morning! :D
 
Apr 9, 2009
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ingsve said:
I know allegations are only anecdotal evidence but there are so many allegations from so many diffrent sources over so many years that one would have to be a grade A conspiracy theorist to believe that all of them are lying.
Strange that everyone Armstrong has ever met that he's not currently employing is a liar, isn't it?
 
Even McQuaid now thinks he's dirty......
___

“I work in cycling today,” he said, “Armstrong will ride two or three times this year but is already out of cycling; and if the case goes ahead in the United States then cycling will go on.

“Harm has already been done in the past,” he added, referring to the countless scandals that have rocked the sport over recent years.

“The sport is bigger than Lance Armstrong,” he continued, “bigger than Floyd Landis or Alberto Contador. I’m not saying that Armstrong is guilty because we have to wait for the trial but I’m sure cycling is cleaner than it has ever been.

“This is the cleanest of sports,” he added.


http://www.velonation.com/News/ID/7159/Cycling-will-go-on-without-Lance-Armstrong-says-Pat-McQuaid.aspx#ixzz1BamXyl8O
 
I made a few posts and links to this article on non-cycling message boards. It's a mix out there. Half the people think it's disappointing, but inevitably true. The other half take the 'innocent until proven guilty" or "no hard evidence" path.

My take of course is that the "innocent until proven guilty" only applies to legal court proceedings, not sporting rules. Especially when the rules can be circumvented. The "no hard evidence" is of course naive, or from people who believe OJ was "innocent".
 
Jun 28, 2009
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I don't think LA is clean, and I'm not talking about the city :p Regardless whether he is or not, he certainly acts like a real jerk at times and he gets a big thumbs down in my book for being a whole a$$.
 
Aug 3, 2009
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I think Lance is just as clean as his competitors were. He was simply a lot more thorough than his opposition in most cases.

Hate Lance for being a @$%^@!# if you must, but don't hate him due to his more effective "training" and "preparation."
 
Dec 7, 2010
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Apparently this author does, or is at least willing to suspend all logic:
http://www.businessinsider.com/the-problem-with-the-lance-armstrong-doping-investigation-2011-1

Here's The Problem With The Lance Armstrong Doping Investigation: There's No Proof!
According to the article, here are some of the culprits:
no one can say (or prove) that they actually saw him take the drugs.
Floyd who?

Applying the logic of a six-year-old:
Mike Anderson: Why is he Lance's former bike mechanic?
On why Betsy is bitter:
Betsy Andreu: Her husband was a teammate of Armstrong's, which really meant he had to sacrifice his own position in races to help Armstrong win.
And this gem:
But unless the grand jury has more evidence that has yet to come out, that definitive link between Armstrong and drugs doesn't appear to exist yet.
Huh, you mean you think it's possible that the Feds just handed everything over to SI and said, "Here, have at it. We've done all we can do."? :rolleyes:

"Unless." :D Now that's a beautiful perspective.
 
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