Anyone know Astana's roster for next year...

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Mar 10, 2009
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Assan Bazayev
Alberto Contador
David De la Fuente
Valeriy Dimitryev
Alexsandr Dyachenko
Dmitriy Fofonov
Enrico Gasparotto
Maxim Gourov
Andriy Grivko
Jesus Hernandez
Maxim Iglinskiy
Valentin Iglinskiy
Roman Kireyev
Dmitriy Muravyev
Daniel Navarro
Benjamin Noval
Oscar Pereiro
Bolat Raimbekov
Sergey Renev
Mirko Selvaggi
Gorazd Stangelj
Paolo Tiralongo
Alexandre Vinokourov
Andrey Zeits
 
Mar 13, 2009
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Aside from form drops when a rider moves away from bruyneel, I'd say the team is strong enough to support Contador in GTs.
 
karlboss said:
Aside from form drops when a rider moves away from bruyneel, I'd say the team is strong enough to support Contador in GTs.
When has a multiple GT winner ever left JB? I think we are
in uncharted territory, so there is little to be gleaned from other departures.
 
auscyclefan94 said:
+1
Radioshack are all for the tour de france and tour of california and if they get anything else, well that's a bonus.

A very one dimensional team which is just for lance. BORING
They also are sure to go all out for the ToC, boring us with another Leipheimer win, as no one else worth a darn cares about the race. Especially with the change in date this year.
 
Mar 13, 2009
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Publicus said:
When has a multiple GT winner ever left JB? I think we are
in uncharted territory, so there is little to be gleaned from other departures.
Heras and Landis both stood top step of a GT podium when they left, Heras even kept one of his wins. There is something, not everything, to be gleaned from departures.

I generally regard almost any team to be able to control a flat or intermediate stage break. Then if you need to control a break in the mountains, as long as Vinokourov, Pereiro, and De La Fuente ride close to their best the team should be strong enough. Hence the comment about form drops, it occured as an afterthought that rider's often seem to drop off away from JB.
I think Saxo's tactics will play to Astana's advantage also, they did this year.
 
Aug 13, 2009
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craig1985 said:
It would be pretty hypocritical for ASO to not let Vino and Astana not ride their races next year, after they chased Unibet out of cycling (it was BS anywya, since they were allowed to race in Paris-Tours in 2006, which I believe is in France, and there are never any problems with Lotto. Rather Unibet had a PT licence and ASO wanted to give the middle finger to the UCI), let Liquigas ride the 2009 Tour after Beltran tested positive in 2008, Rabobank and Rasmussen in 2007, Saxo Bank and Riis, Cofidis and Moreni in 2007, Columbia are still allowed to race when Sinkewitz tested positive in 2007 under the same management, even though T-Mobile still sponsored the team and the car trip to Freiburg after Stage 1 in 2006.

That is why I thought it was hypocritical for them to not let Fuji-Survetto and Barloworld not do the ASO races this year as well.
To be fair there were legit concerns in allowing Unibet to race in ANY races in France or Belgium. In late 2005 there was a revision of the law that clearly stated that for profit gambling sites were illegal. Lotto, FdJ, and PMU are all state run entities and are exempt. Unibet and Bwin executives were arrested in France and some early season race organizers who allowed Unibet to race were notified that they were under investigation.

While the UCI trying to cram the ProTour down the ASO's neck certainly played a part in the ASO's decision the threat of legal action also played a key role.
 
karlboss said:
Heras and Landis both stood top step of a GT podium when they left, Heras even kept one of his wins. There is something, not everything, to be gleaned from departures.

I generally regard almost any team to be able to control a flat or intermediate stage break. Then if you need to control a break in the mountains, as long as Vinokourov, Pereiro, and De La Fuente ride close to their best the team should be strong enough. Hence the comment about form drops, it occured as an afterthought that rider's often seem to drop off away from JB.
I think Saxo's tactics will play to Astana's advantage also, they did this year.
My point was that JB has never had a rider who has won multiple GT's leave him (or in this case, JB is leaving AC). When Landis and Heras left (or Tyler or Levi) they'd never won anything. They only had the promise/potential. AC has tasted victory 4 times. So we are entering uncharted territory as to whether he will experience a drop in form. Not saying that he won't, but just that there is no historical precedent that will serve as a guide.
 
Mar 13, 2009
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Well no historical precedent exactly, but unless Alberto left JB, it would never be close enough. We have however seen planty of riders leave and not be quite the same rider. Heras is the only one that strikes me as leaving and being exactly as strong as he was without taking a few seasons to find form again.
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
these are names I've seen confirmed

I've seen confirmation in the press for all of these:
Alberto Contador
Oscar Pereiro - just signed
Jesus Hernandez - two year contract last year
Benjamin Noval - re-upped for Alberto
David de la Fuente -
Daniel Navarro
Enrico Gasparotto
Gorazd Stangelj
Paolo Tiralongo
Alexandre Vinokourov
Allan Davis - confirmed per velonews
David Herrero - confirmed per velonews
Xavier Tondo - confirmed per velonews

Astana Fans dot com has a list that includes the Kazakhs and a few others I haven't seen confirmed - I don't want to steal their content
 
Oct 25, 2009
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Alberto Contador
Oscar Pereiro
Jesus Hernandez
Benjamin Noval
Daniel Navarro
Enrico Gasparotto
Gorazd Stangelj
Paolo Tiralongo
Alexandre Vinokourov

Not bad Tour team....provided Vino can ride.
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
lucybears said:
Assan Bazayev
Alberto Contador
David De la Fuente

Valeriy Dimitryev
Alexsandr Dyachenko
Dmitriy Fofonov
Enrico Gasparotto
Maxim Gourov
Andriy Grivko
Jesus Hernandez
Maxim Iglinskiy
Valentin Iglinskiy
Roman Kireyev
Dmitriy Muravyev
Daniel Navarro
Benjamin Noval
Oscar Pereiro

Bolat Raimbekov
Sergey Renev
Mirko Selvaggi
Gorazd Stangelj
Paolo Tiralongo
Alexandre Vinokourov
Andrey Zeits
Probably have to include at least 2 kazakhs - i've bolded a possible tour team (maybe 1 too many climbers - need another flats man perhaps.

Anyway, up against 9 out of these 12:

Lance Armstrong
Janez Brakjovic
Chris Horner
Andreas Kloden
Levi Leipheimer

Dimitri Muravyev
Sergio Paulinho
Yaroslav Popovych
Gregory Rast

Chechu Rubeira
Tomas Vaitkus
Haimar Zubeldia

My pick of the 9 are in bold - note average age about 33.

Either way, point is, RadioShack has a much much better tour team than AC for 2010. Sure they are old, but 40 is the new 35 now.

Furthermore, someone mentioned about long term (Publicus I think), and I agree that Lance has more than 1 year left. I think he will be there in 2011 unless he wins 2010. Prob be there in 2012 when he's 40yrs old.
 
karlboss said:
Well no historical precedent exactly, but unless Alberto left JB, it would never be close enough. We have however seen planty of riders leave and not be quite the same rider. Heras is the only one that strikes me as leaving and being exactly as strong as he was without taking a few seasons to find form again.
I guess my point is/was that the folks that you are talking about had to learn how to win; how to bring themselves into championship form. With rare exception (Heras and Landis), they couldn't handle the pressure of being a team leader and developing the skill set to win (see, e.g., Levi Leipheimer). AC has been team leader and has developed the skill set to not only win, but dominate under the most physically and mentally demanding situation. While that is not dispositive on the question, I think those factors suggest that a drop off in form is highly unlikely.
 
Mar 12, 2009
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Mountain Goat said:
Probably have to include at least 2 kazakhs - i've bolded a possible tour team (maybe 1 too many climbers - need another flats man perhaps.

Anyway, up against 9 out of these 12:

Lance Armstrong
Janez Brakjovic
Chris Horner
Andreas Kloden
Levi Leipheimer

Dimitri Muravyev
Sergio Paulinho
Yaroslav Popovych
Gregory Rast

Chechu Rubeira
Tomas Vaitkus
Haimar Zubeldia

My pick of the 9 are in bold - note average age about 33.

Either way, point is, RadioShack has a much much better tour team than AC for 2010. Sure they are old, but 40 is the new 35 now.

Furthermore, someone mentioned about long term (Publicus I think), and I agree that Lance has more than 1 year left. I think he will be there in 2011 unless he wins 2010. Prob be there in 2012 when he's 40yrs old.
Rubiera said recently he will not race the Tour next year, only the Giro or the Vuelta, he wanted a light race schedule for 2010, so max 1 GT.

Agree the Shack has a stronger team on paper than Astana, but by far the strongest Tour team (barring accidents etc.) next year will be Saxo-Bank. Garmin & Cervelo not too bad either. Remember there is no TTT and a lot more climbing than this year.

I personally hope Lance will re-retire, the sooner the better.
 
Mar 13, 2009
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Any news on the simoni front?

My point wasn't really focussing on Contador, but more the domestiques. Domestiques tend to ride above themselves for JB.
 
Mountain Goat said:
Probably have to include at least 2 kazakhs - i've bolded a possible tour team (maybe 1 too many climbers - need another flats man perhaps.

Anyway, up against 9 out of these 12:

Lance Armstrong
Janez Brakjovic
Chris Horner
Andreas Kloden
Levi Leipheimer

Dimitri Muravyev
Sergio Paulinho
Yaroslav Popovych
Gregory Rast

Chechu Rubeira
Tomas Vaitkus
Haimar Zubeldia

My pick of the 9 are in bold - note average age about 33.

Either way, point is, RadioShack has a much much better tour team than AC for 2010. Sure they are old, but 40 is the new 35 now.

Furthermore, someone mentioned about long term (Publicus I think), and I agree that Lance has more than 1 year left. I think he will be there in 2011 unless he wins 2010. Prob be there in 2012 when he's 40yrs old.
I think Tiralongo and Iglinskiy make the squad for Astana.

As for your contention that Radio Shack is much much stronger, I wonder if you really think that will make a difference? I will certainly concede that RS has the bigger names (Armstrong, Horner, Kloden, Levi and Zubeldia), but they will have only one goal: do whatever it takes to get Lance on top of the podium. We all know how the Lance Armstrong-Bruyneel model works. It's worked 7 times before, they aren't going to deviate now. And the absence of a TTT makes them even less relevant.

What matters is the team leaders and on this point I don't think there is much argument, Astana leads in that category by a considerable margin. Physically and mentally, AC has an advantage over Lance. He's done something no one else (save AS this year) has done: beat Lance straight up. And he beat him soundly. No fluke crash. No flats. No hunger bonks. Lance was in shape and hungry. He had the team manager, more than half the team in his pocket. He played mind games; trying to get into AC's head. And he still got crushed.
 
karlboss said:
Any news on the simoni front?

My point wasn't really focussing on Contador, but more the domestiques. Domestiques tend to ride above themselves for JB.
He's retiring I believe. As for the domestiques, I'm not sure we'll have a comparison since JB took most of the domestiques with him. New team, with a new manager and new DSs. We are in unchartered territory.
 
May 6, 2009
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Race Radio said:
To be fair there were legit concerns in allowing Unibet to race in ANY races in France or Belgium. In late 2005 there was a revision of the law that clearly stated that for profit gambling sites were illegal. Lotto, FdJ, and PMU are all state run entities and are exempt. Unibet and Bwin executives were arrested in France and some early season race organizers who allowed Unibet to race were notified that they were under investigation.

While the UCI trying to cram the ProTour down the ASO's neck certainly played a part in the ASO's decision the threat of legal action also played a key role.
I see Unibet all the time advertised during La Liga (they are a sponsor of Valencia CF) and in Italy's Serie A, but they couldn't ride the Vuelta or the Giro and only got into MSR in the last week or two IIRC.
 
Jun 16, 2009
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Moose McKnuckles said:
Lance's teams have been about Lance, not about developing other riders.
They had Boonen, until he left because he saw the obvious.

RadioShack is another team of Lance salad-tossers.
I understand money talks, but hey, that doesn't mean the RadioShackers aren't flossing their teeth with Lance's short and curlies.

Can't wait until Hincapie is pacing Cadel up the climbs and Pharmstrong is struggling to keep up.
I can't wait for that either
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
Publicus said:
As for your contention that Radio Shack is much much stronger, I wonder if you really think that will make a difference? I will certainly concede that RS has the bigger names (Armstrong, Horner, Kloden, Levi and Zubeldia), but they will have only one goal: do whatever it takes to get Lance on top of the podium. We all know how the Lance Armstrong-Bruyneel model works. It's worked 7 times before, they aren't going to deviate now. And the absence of a TTT makes them even less relevant.

What matters is the team leaders and on this point I don't think there is much argument, Astana leads in that category by a considerable margin. Physically and mentally, AC has an advantage over Lance. He's done something no one else (save AS this year) has done: beat Lance straight up. And he beat him soundly. No fluke crash. No flats. No hunger bonks. Lance was in shape and hungry. He had the team manager, more than half the team in his pocket. He played mind games; trying to get into AC's head. And he still got crushed.
I think it will make "a" difference, but whether or not it makes "the" difference is the main question. I see your point, that AC is still way ahead of Lance at this stage.

I not sure he beat him "straight up" given they were on the same team. Of course its all speculation at this stage, but when AC beats LA on separate teams, then its more than fair to say he won straight up, but at this stage, I wouldn't say that. Without a doubt tho, he did beat him for sure.

In regard to the team side of things, I guess the advantage for Lance here is that despite not being the best in the peleton, that team can cause some distress for AC if they attack first. If they wait, AC will just attack and the tour will be over, so it's arguable that the team will make a difference, but its also arguable they wont make any difference whatsoever - we find out in 8 months ;).

I guess that the only way Lance wins is how Sastre won in 2008. Strongest team propels not-the-strongest rider to the win. Probably won't happen on a hill finish like sastre did, but maybe the only way lance wins is time on the cobbles, time in the wind breaks, and its a huge prediction but I'm gonna throw it out there that he beats AC by a minute in the 50k TT (i've explained in many thread my doubts about ACs TT ability in flat 50k TTs, this is not AC bias becoz im a big fan of his). Will that mean he wins? probably not, but we'll find out in 8 months ;)

All that said, I will not be barracking for anyone other than Cadel Evans, so hopefully the RadioShack vs Astana rivalry continues, and they forget about a certain world champion, and he sneaks his way onto the top step :D

I apolgise to Andy Schleck for this, becoz he's a superstar, but I'm predicting the same podium at the tour in 2010 as I did in 2009, Armstrong, Contador, Evans (note, that is alphabetical order, not my actual prediction of 1-2-3). For some reason I think Schleck will blow up in the final TT and maybe be something like 5-10 seconds off the podium, but I wish i'm wrong. Of course, I was wrong about Schleck this year, happy to be wrong again.
 
Jun 16, 2009
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Mountain Goat said:
Probably have to include at least 2 kazakhs - i've bolded a possible tour team (maybe 1 too many climbers - need another flats man perhaps.

Anyway, up against 9 out of these 12:

Lance Armstrong
Janez Brakjovic
Chris Horner
Andreas Kloden
Levi Leipheimer

Dimitri Muravyev
Sergio Paulinho
Yaroslav Popovych
Gregory Rast

Chechu Rubeira
Tomas Vaitkus
Haimar Zubeldia

My pick of the 9 are in bold - note average age about 33.

Either way, point is, RadioShack has a much much better tour team than AC for 2010. Sure they are old, but 40 is the new 35 now.

Furthermore, someone mentioned about long term (Publicus I think), and I agree that Lance has more than 1 year left. I think he will be there in 2011 unless he wins 2010. Prob be there in 2012 when he's 40yrs old.
Do you think that with Radioshack and Astana worrying/fighting about each other as they seem the 2 big teams might help, schleck, wiggins, vandevelde or evans
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
Contador FTW

I don't think Contador is focusing on Radio Shack - he knows the threat could be Schleck, Evans, Wiggins, Sastre, etc. And Team Astana is too busy arranging staff and equipment before the first training camp. Alberto said that he can't expect as many wins next year with a team that's not as strong overall. (Pro Tour teams some times have to be two places at once, so they can't load up his squad for other races). But this team is built around Contador winning the Tour, and I think that Pereiro, Tiralongo, Noval, De la Fuente, Navarro and others will give everything they have. The steeper climbs and mountain finishes are in Contador's favor, as is the lack of a TTT. The Time Trials are up to him. On most days, especially sprint stages, he just needs to stay protected in the peloton. On the days he wants to attack, a couple of guys to set him up should be enough, and even then it often comes down to the GC guys and a helper or two. I was hoping for Alberto to go elsewhere, but now I'm excited to watch these guys turn into a Tour winner, and then go after the Vuelta.
 
Mar 12, 2009
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Mountain Goat said:
I think it will make "a" difference, but whether or not it makes "the" difference is the main question. I see your point, that AC is still way ahead of Lance at this stage.

I not sure he beat him "straight up" given they were on the same team. Of course its all speculation at this stage, but when AC beats LA on separate teams, then its more than fair to say he won straight up, but at this stage, I wouldn't say that. Without a doubt tho, he did beat him for sure.

In regard to the team side of things, I guess the advantage for Lance here is that despite not being the best in the [/B]peleton, that team can cause some distress for AC if they attack first. If they wait, AC will just attack and the tour will be over, so it's arguable that the team will make a difference, but its also arguable they wont make any difference whatsoever - we find out in 8 months ;).


It's pelOton.
 
Aug 1, 2009
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auscyclefan94 said:
Do you think that with Radioshack and Astana worrying/fighting about each other as they seem the 2 big teams might help, schleck, wiggins, vandevelde or evans
Absolutely. The Radioshack/Astana feud is Andy Schleck's big chance to beat Contador. Be sure that Bjarne Riis is going to take advantage of it.
 
Mountain Goat said:
I think it will make "a" difference, but whether or not it makes "the" difference is the main question. I see your point, that AC is still way ahead of Lance at this stage.

I not sure he beat him "straight up" given they were on the same team. Of course its all speculation at this stage, but when AC beats LA on separate teams, then its more than fair to say he won straight up, but at this stage, I wouldn't say that. Without a doubt tho, he did beat him for sure.

In regard to the team side of things, I guess the advantage for Lance here is that despite not being the best in the peleton, that team can cause some distress for AC if they attack first. If they wait, AC will just attack and the tour will be over, so it's arguable that the team will make a difference, but its also arguable they wont make any difference whatsoever - we find out in 8 months ;).

I guess that the only way Lance wins is how Sastre won in 2008. Strongest team propels not-the-strongest rider to the win. Probably won't happen on a hill finish like sastre did, but maybe the only way lance wins is time on the cobbles, time in the wind breaks, and its a huge prediction but I'm gonna throw it out there that he beats AC by a minute in the 50k TT (i've explained in many thread my doubts about ACs TT ability in flat 50k TTs, this is not AC bias becoz im a big fan of his). Will that mean he wins? probably not, but we'll find out in 8 months ;)

All that said, I will not be barracking for anyone other than Cadel Evans, so hopefully the RadioShack vs Astana rivalry continues, and they forget about a certain world champion, and he sneaks his way onto the top step :D

I apolgise to Andy Schleck for this, becoz he's a superstar, but I'm predicting the same podium at the tour in 2010 as I did in 2009, Armstrong, Contador, Evans (note, that is alphabetical order, not my actual prediction of 1-2-3). For some reason I think Schleck will blow up in the final TT and maybe be something like 5-10 seconds off the podium, but I wish i'm wrong. Of course, I was wrong about Schleck this year, happy to be wrong again.
Yes they were on the same team, but Lance was racing for himself, as was AC. As for potential team strategy, I guess attacking first seems like a good idea, but in reality that plays to AC's strength. If you'll notice he normally doesn't like to be launched into space. Look Arcalis and Verbier. Both counter-attacks. The best strategy would be to force him to start the show or hope that he has a deficit going into the mountains and does something impetuous trying to regain time.

As for the TT, until Lance actually beats AC in a team trial, I think it is premature to say he will win by a minute. But for the sake of argument let's assume you are correct--that Lance has the ability to beat AC on a flat TT course by a minute plus. Wouldn't the obvious answer be for AC to look for maximum time gains in the mountains? So the question becomes does AC's advantage in the mountains offset Lance's (or Cadel or any of the other larger motors) advantage in the TT? I know where I come down on that question.
 
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